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"On Tuesday 4/29, the U.S. Supreme Court will hear arguments in two cases testing the authority of police to conduct a warrantless search of an arrested person's cell phone.
For the most part, the justices' rulings in cases dealing with the Fourth Amendment go largely unnoticed by the public. Most citizens are not interested in these cases the way they are in issues like same-sex marriage or gun control. On the whole, Americans don't worry too much about search-and-seizure issues because they think these cases don't apply to them."
Basically its just another test case of a new item. They will be deciding if you have a reason expectation of privacy . But not many will search it if your under arrest and they control they phone. Basically they have time to get a warrant which controls many searches when under arrest versus detained with probable cause to search. Like vehicle search it can be different under different situations. Regardless must show probable cause to search to get admitted as evidence. in court. The basic governing factor is reasonableness depending on circumstances and probable cause regardless.
If you are doing nothing illegal there's nothing to worry about, however, I do think they should need a warrant simply because there may be corrupt officers who just want to have a little fun at your expense. Obtaining a warrant would put more stock in what they are doing.
As far as privacy, we're being watched by cameras probably 90% of the time anyway. Sadly privacy was washed out to sea thanks to technology.
So yes, cops should be able to search your phone, in this day and age it's the same as in the old days them looking through your file cabinets for clues.
I believe cell phones should be treated the same as a car or residence. Most of the time a warrant is required, but there are exceptions. So if you are arrested for public intoxication, as an example, the cop should NOT be allowed to do anything with your phone except secure it with the rest of your property to ensure you receive it back after you are released.
The question also comes up in that what appears on your phone might not actually be on the phone but stored elsewhere and only displayed on the phone's screen. At that point, the police are also searching other locations where you have that data stored. It could also be that the data is stored in a location that you do not own or is shared by another person or owned by a company. In that case the police are searching though the data owned by others in locations owned by others.
For example, you have a remote access app on your phone that loads the user credentials and password to access the remote system. On that remote system is an email application that has as it's source, data located on yet another remote server. The police would in effect not only be accessing the first remote source but a 2nd one as well and that one could be a shared resource the same as the first one.
They would then in effect be searching the property of other people or companies for which there is no reasonable cause to believe they had violated any laws whatsoever. That then becomes guilt by association or a presumption of guilt.
Basically its just another test case of a new item. They will be deciding if you have a reason expectation of privacy . But not many will search it if your under arrest and they control they phone. Basically they have time to get a warrant which controls many searches when under arrest versus detained with probable cause to search. Like vehicle search it can be different under different situations. Regardless must show probable cause to search to get admitted as evidence. in court. The basic governing factor is reasonableness depending on circumstances and probable cause regardless.
Whoa, whoa, whoa--the question is whether they can search the phone without a warrant when a person is arrested. Most people carry phones with them, which means that anyone arrested could be (and maybe will be) subject to a phone search. And this is not a "probable cause" search, but an incidental to arrest search--more like an impounded car than anything. So it's a bigger deal than you make it out to be. The Court, fortunately, has a decent record of 4th Amendment protectiveness and seems critical of allowing routine phone searches on arrest. Here's to hoping they follow through.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Challenger76
If you are doing nothing illegal there's nothing to worry about, however, I do think they should need a warrant simply because there may be corrupt officers who just want to have a little fun at your expense. Obtaining a warrant would put more stock in what they are doing.
As far as privacy, we're being watched by cameras probably 90% of the time anyway. Sadly privacy was washed out to sea thanks to technology.
So yes, cops should be able to search your phone, in this day and age it's the same as in the old days them looking through your file cabinets for clues.
There is that pesky 4th Amendment to worry about, that people bled and continue to bleed for. Keep in mind, this is a warrentless phone search case. I don't intend to share the data on my phone (or accessed through my phone) with law enforcement or anyone else by virtue of having the device one me. Do you?
Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez
I believe cell phones should be treated the same as a car or residence. Most of the time a warrant is required, but there are exceptions. So if you are arrested for public intoxication, as an example, the cop should NOT be allowed to do anything with your phone except secure it with the rest of your property to ensure you receive it back after you are released.
I think that the usual rule should be that your phone should just be secured. I see no reason not to require a warrant to search a phone when someone has been arrested.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack Knife
The question also comes up in that what appears on your phone might not actually be on the phone but stored elsewhere and only displayed on the phone's screen. At that point, the police are also searching other locations where you have that data stored. It could also be that the data is stored in a location that you do not own or is shared by another person or owned by a company. In that case the police are searching though the data owned by others in locations owned by others.
For example, you have a remote access app on your phone that loads the user credentials and password to access the remote system. On that remote system is an email application that has as it's source, data located on yet another remote server. The police would in effect not only be accessing the first remote source but a 2nd one as well and that one could be a shared resource the same as the first one.
They would then in effect be searching the property of other people or companies for which there is no reasonable cause to believe they had violated any laws whatsoever. That then becomes guilt by association or a presumption of guilt.
Agreed. Our 4th Amendment jurisprudence is probably ill-fitted to the internet age. That's how the NSA's 3-steps to a terrorist rule seems likely to capture an unknown but massive set of data including information about massive swaths of the planet.
If you are doing nothing illegal there's nothing to worry about, however, I do think they should need a warrant simply because there may be corrupt officers who just want to have a little fun at your expense. Obtaining a warrant would put more stock in what they are doing.
As far as privacy, we're being watched by cameras probably 90% of the time anyway. Sadly privacy was washed out to sea thanks to technology.
So yes, cops should be able to search your phone, in this day and age it's the same as in the old days them looking through your file cabinets for clues.
You're right, a smart phone is much like the file cabinet of old....but I'd hope the cops couldn't search my file cabinet without a warrant either.
I agree we're watched a large percent of the time anyway by various electronic (and other) means, but it just seems that every new invasion of our 4 amendment (and other rights too) rights is predicated on the logic of "oh, we already to this or that, so this new thing is more or less the same thing, so why not allow that too. I'm not ready to give into that way of thinking.
It's like the cops installing a GPS monitor on your car while it's parked in public. They say you're parked in public, and they could simply have a cop follow you everwhere for a month. Trouble is, they don't have enough officers to follow everyone they think may be guilty of something or another, so it's not the same thing. They are using tecniques that allow them to be essentially everwhere at the same time all the time if they choose to do so on a whim with no search warrant needed. That's far to much power to put in their hands on a whim of "we think he/she might be doing something wrong". If you're sure enough that I am doing something wrong (probable cause), then get a search warrant and do it the right way. Same thing applies to my phone. It's just like my file cabinet in my home office, if you want to see the contents and have probable cause, then get a warrant and do it. If you're on a fishing expedition of "I think he may have done something wrong, but we don't have probable cause, but if we can search his file cabinet we might find probable cause, that's just flat out a violation of the 4th amendment as I see it.
Personally, whether I am guilty of anything or not matters not, I'd still make them get a search warrant even if I knew I had done nothing wrong....because it's how it supposed to work. Would be kind of satisfying in a way to know you'd put them through their paces and find out after all that work you really weren't guilty of anything. Might make them think twice before doing that again to the next guy.....which is exactly what our rights are supposed to do. Make law enforcement think first and then jump through the proper hoops before tearing through your private things.
If the decision is made to allow the police to search your phone without a warrant, expect a whole new set of apps that allow one to wipe their phones immediately (not like the relatively show process now) yet return it to fully functioning order after it is no longer in police custody.
I bet the apps are already in the works if they aren't out already.
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