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Our country was founded on the basis of freedom of religion-there is no need for us as a society to deal with such primitive cultures and countries that are still fighting and killing eachother over religion-Israel included.
We have done too much damage already in the Middle East and lost too many American lives-it is time for us to stop supporting Israel, Egypt and Saudi Arabia and invading everywhere else-and let them deal with their own problems. These places are not allies we need-only multi-national war/oil corporations and global banks need and use them.
But Europe, (specifically Germany and Italy) did not revisit Nazism and Fascism, because the Europeans at least comprehended that culturally, they could no longer accept the thinking that led to the emergence of both as dominating forces.
It would also be possible for the middle east to change - but it requires a cultural change, one that rejects the rule of Islam as a cultural, economic, and political dictator.
Sad to say, due to the loud liberal screaming in the US, we are now unwilling, politically, to point the finger at the fault lines of their society and "That's the problem!".
Comparing the situation in the Middle East to Nazism and Fascism is like comparing professional football to a peewee league. Nazism and Fascism were a blip on the cultural radar, while the religious turmoil in the Middle East is a cultural foundation.
It would take more than a cultural change. It would take an entire overhaul of the thought process of every person in the region. We're not talking about a conflict that is based on land, oil, or money. We're talking about an area where the vast majority of the people believe that anyone who is not like them doesn't deserve to live, and firmly believes that their religion gives them the right to purge the world of those other people.
There hasn't been a single point in recorded history when the Middle East was a peaceful area. It has been at war or on the verge of war since our prehistoric ancestors moved into the Fertile Crescent and started throwing rocks at neighboring tribes. Why anyone thinks that this can be changed by outside forces is beyond me, because history has shown that outside interference does nothing but make the situation even more volatile.
European nations and the western world have been trying to impose their values on that region for a thousand years or more, and not a single change has been made. The Middle East is still trying to kill each other off, and the western world is still, for some strange reason, determined to make them stop. The only difference between the Middle East of modern times and the Middle East of circa 1,000 A.D. is that the weapons are more effective.
The only way that the conflict in the Middle East is going to end is if religion is completely purged from the area, including Islam, Judaism, Christianity, and every other belief system that encourages a culture to think that they are the chosen ones. Quite frankly, even that wouldn't end the conflict, but at least the conflict after such a purge would be based on winnable goals such as wealth and power. As it stands, the religious discord in the Middle East leads to a perpetual war which will most likely not end until this planet is a lifeless husk floating through space and the human race is nothing but a vague cosmic memory.
Our country was founded on the basis of freedom of religion-there is no need for us as a society to deal with such primitive cultures and countries that are still fighting and killing eachother over religion-Israel included.
So, human rights is just an optional thing, sort of a feature of old men with funny clothes writing their dreams? Not something inherent to humanity?
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We have done too much damage already in the Middle East and lost too many American lives-it is time for us to stop supporting Israel, Egypt and Saudi Arabia and invading everywhere else-and let them deal with their own problems. These places are not allies we need-only multi-national war/oil corporations and global banks need and use them.
Turning your back on your allies is a good way to turn everyone into an enemy.
Comparing the situation in the Middle East to Nazism and Fascism is like comparing professional football to a peewee league. Nazism and Fascism were a blip on the cultural radar, while the religious turmoil in the Middle East is a cultural foundation.
Which is precisely what my point was. Funny you didn't think that through.
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It would take more than a cultural change. It would take an entire overhaul of the thought process of every person in the region. We're not talking about a conflict that is based on land, oil, or money. We're talking about an area where the vast majority of the people believe that anyone who is not like them doesn't deserve to live, and firmly believes that their religion gives them the right to purge the world of those other people.
What do you think creates a culture?
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There hasn't been a single point in recorded history when the Middle East was a peaceful area. It has been at war or on the verge of war since our prehistoric ancestors moved into the Fertile Crescent and started throwing rocks at neighboring tribes. Why anyone thinks that this can be changed by outside forces is beyond me, because history has shown that outside interference does nothing but make the situation even more volatile.
In terms of history, I can't find any places, except those that are uninhabited that can claim long-term "peaceful" status.
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European nations and the western world have been trying to impose their values on that region for a thousand years or more, and not a single change has been made. The Middle East is still trying to kill each other off, and the western world is still, for some strange reason, determined to make them stop. The only difference between the Middle East of modern times and the Middle East of circa 1,000 A.D. is that the weapons are more effective.
And they have been trying to impose their religion on us. Some things, however, are objectively better than others. Perhaps you should look into that.
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The only way that the conflict in the Middle East is going to end is if religion is completely purged from the area, including Islam, Judaism, Christianity, and every other belief system that encourages a culture to think that they are the chosen ones. Quite frankly, even that wouldn't end the conflict, but at least the conflict after such a purge would be based on winnable goals such as wealth and power. As it stands, the religious discord in the Middle East leads to a perpetual war which will most likely not end until this planet is a lifeless husk floating through space and the human race is nothing but a vague cosmic memory.
It is fatiguing taking sides in a conflict that, in large part, stems from two competing religious philosophies that state that the people in question are 'THE CHOSEN PEOPLE OF GOD!!!!!" and believe in eye-for-an-eye retribution.
Also, both sides engage in highly dubious moral ambiguity in terms of their tactics in their never endiding tit-for-tat.
I do truly pity the victims on both sides, but as far as their states/polities go. Nope, don't care.
So, human rights is just an optional thing, sort of a feature of old men with funny clothes writing their dreams? Not something inherent to humanity?
Do you realize how many human rights issues there are in the World today? You seem naive-The US' geopolitical machine only helps countries with their "human rights" when there is something in it for our Multi-National War/Oil Corporations or the internationally controlled US Dollar. It is why we go into Libya and not Darfur-Qaddafi no longer wanted to trade oil in US Dollars.
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Originally Posted by pnwmdk
Turning your back on your allies is a good way to turn everyone into an enemy.
That seems a bit short-sighted.
It actually seems myopic to support such a violent and oppresive regime like Israel. It will ensure a larger war eventually-The USA takes the blame for Israel's actions in the mind of a radical Muslim.
"Every time anyone says that Israel is our only friend in the Middle East, I can't help but think that before Israel, we had no enemies in the Middle East." -- John Sheehan, S.J. (a Jesuit priest)
But Europe, (specifically Germany and Italy) did not revisit Nazism and Fascism, because the Europeans at least comprehended that culturally, they could no longer accept the thinking that led to the emergence of both as dominating forces.
It would also be possible for the middle east to change - but it requires a cultural change, one that rejects the rule of Islam as a cultural, economic, and political dictator.
Sad to say, due to the loud liberal screaming in the US, we are now unwilling, politically, to point the finger at the fault lines of their society and "That's the problem!".
THIS ^^^ 10^10
I'd add that progressive liberals need to come to terms with calling Muslim/Islamic terrorists, terrorists. Until they can call it what it is, they'll continue to deny it entirely.
Little more than a decade since 911, and they've convinced themselves such things won't/can't happen again. It's absurd to believe the state of the middle east does not affect the US, when their goal is destroy western civilization.
Do you realize how many human rights issues there are in the World today? You seem naive-The US' geopolitical machine only helps countries with their "human rights" when there is something in it for our Multi-National War/Oil Corporations or the internationally controlled US Dollar. It is why we go into Libya and not Darfur-Qaddafi no longer wanted to trade oil in US Dollars.
How is this relevant? The question is about YOUR beliefs, not the machinations of politicians.
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It actually seems myopic to support such a violent and oppresive regime like Israel. It will ensure a larger war eventually-The USA takes the blame for Israel's actions in the mind of a radical Muslim.
It's definitely myopic to think Israel is violent and oppressive.
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"Every time anyone says that Israel is our only friend in the Middle East, I can't help but think that before Israel, we had no enemies in the Middle East." -- John Sheehan, S.J. (a Jesuit priest)
There's no accounting for how amazingly wrong that statement is.
I'd add that progressive liberals need to come to terms with calling Muslim/Islamic terrorists, terrorists. Until they can call it what it is, they'll continue to deny it entirely.
Little more than a decade since 911, and they've convinced themselves such things won't/can't happen again. It's absurd to believe the state of the middle east does not affect the US, when their goal is destroy western civilization.
I find it sickening when people use the actions of a few radical extremists to paint all Muslims as hellbent on the destruction of the US. Most Muslims are people like you and me.
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