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View Poll Results: Your support on conceal carry...
Do not support right for individuals to own firearms. 0 0%
Anyone should be able to ccw without a permit. 18 39.13%
Permit should be required however no training needed only simple background check. 3 6.52%
Basic safety course should be a requirement to get a ccw. 25 54.35%
Voters: 46. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-25-2014, 09:14 AM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,866 posts, read 46,432,657 times
Reputation: 18520

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
It is not an inherent natural right. It is a right granted to own a gun by the 2nd amendment, nothing about concealed weapon

WRONG! Rights are not something you are granted.
The 2nd amendment chains the government from even trying to disarm the public, or specifying what arms we may bear. PERIOD.. End of discussion.
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Old 09-25-2014, 09:15 AM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,869 posts, read 24,324,752 times
Reputation: 8672
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
WRONG! Rights are not something you are granted.
The 2nd amendment chains the government from even trying to disarm the public, or specifying what arms we may bear. PERIOD.. End of discussion.
Amendment rights are granted, and can be removed.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't own guns, or that guns should be taken away, or that the 2nd amendment should be repealed with another amendment. That is possible for the government to do, as such, it is not an inherent human right to own a firearm, it is granted to you by government amendment.

What I said was that someone should be trained to carry a concealed weapon.

The Declaration of Independence didn't say "We hold these truths to be self evident. That all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their creator with certain inalienable rights. Among these are life, liberty, the pursuit of happiness, and to own a gun"
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Old 09-25-2014, 09:22 AM
 
Location: Sector 001
15,935 posts, read 12,218,916 times
Reputation: 16103
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toyman at Jewel Lake View Post
It isn't just casual shooters that lack adequate training, so do many LEOs. Many, if not most, are far from firearms enthusiasts and don't practice and are at best minimally proficient with their weapons.

I think training is a good idea for anyone getting a CCW, as is regular retraining and practice. As far as making it mandatory, and federally controlled? No. Unless the feds are also going to mandate that a CCW license is accepted everywhere and trumps current local laws.
You make a good point.. the feds telling us which training we must get etc. I can see why some might not agree with that... however it would standardize things... in Nebraska each community is allowed to come up with their own laws regarding ccw which I can see being a big mess. In most states counties and townships cannot supercede state law...

I dont have a really strong opinion either way except that I do not want bad apples causing us to lose our gun rights. I will likely stop replying now and let others express their feedback.
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Old 09-25-2014, 09:23 AM
 
Location: Pacific NW
9,437 posts, read 7,339,244 times
Reputation: 7979
Wrong, rights are not granted. The constitution limits government it doesn't grant rights to the people.

A few reminders for the constitutionally challenged | Las Vegas Review-Journal
The Paradox of Rights 'Granted' Us by Government - Forbes

Quote:
The Bill of Rights, is redundant, not defining. It was inserted after the fact for emphasis and extra protection against over reaching government officials. It was never intended to delineate an exhaustive list of rights enjoyed by people living in the United States. Indeed, James Madison and Alexander Hamilton both feared and opposed the inclusion of a Bill of Rights in the Constitution.

Hamilton explained why he believed it was both unnecessary and dangerous in Federalist # 84. He argued it was unnecessary to insert a specific list of rights into the Constitution because the document already presumes every conceivable right is protected unless it is specifically restricted therein by delegation of an enumerated power. It was widely understood that the general rule—“permitted unless prohibited”—was the foundational principle of the Constitution.
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Old 09-25-2014, 09:26 AM
 
12,073 posts, read 23,159,429 times
Reputation: 27188
I am more in favor of state mandated licensing before people are allowed to have children. That said, I don't object to people having to sit through a gun safety class before they buy their first firearm.

I don't think everybody should be trained to CCW and, in fact, some people have absolutely no business owning a firearm or carrying concealed.
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Old 09-25-2014, 09:26 AM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,869 posts, read 24,324,752 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Haakon View Post
Wrong, rights are not granted. The constitution limits government it doesn't grant rights to the people.

A few reminders for the constitutionally challenged | Las Vegas Review-Journal
The Paradox of Rights 'Granted' Us by Government - Forbes
It is a right guaranteed to you by law. That right, like all others granted by law, can be repealed and removed. If an amendment were drafted today, went through the entire process to amend the constitution, the federal government could very easily take away our right to bear arms.
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Old 09-25-2014, 09:50 AM
 
7,846 posts, read 6,380,320 times
Reputation: 4025
I would support a training and background check.

I have zero issues with everyone owning a firearm. The safest way is that people are trained on how to use it.
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Old 09-25-2014, 09:51 AM
 
24,834 posts, read 37,250,617 times
Reputation: 11538
Quote:
Originally Posted by joe from dayton View Post
I am more in favor of state mandated licensing before people are allowed to have children. That said, I don't object to people having to sit through a gun safety class before they buy their first firearm.

I don't think everybody should be trained to CCW and, in fact, some people have absolutely no business owning a firearm or carrying concealed.
I would like to see gun safety in every school class.

At some grad levels.....it would be NEVER touch a gun.

As the children get older.....they would get more information.

And some of that information would be they should not carry.

Still......not everyone should drive a car.....but, we teach safety......because we live in a world with cars.
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Old 09-25-2014, 09:53 AM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,869 posts, read 24,324,752 times
Reputation: 8672
See, this is what the gun folks don't understand.

The reason the second amendment was drafted, was not to protect you from the federal government taking your weapons. It was there to keep states from taking away your right to own firearms. All powers, not explicitly listed in the constitution, are left up to the states. If there were no second amendment, then California could ban all firearm sales and ownership tomorrow.

Same with freedom of speech.

Now, do I think an amendment will happen that will change the 2nd? No, its not even likely in the next 50 years.

The same thing could happen to free speech. It is a protected right by the federal government, from state removal. But it isn't an "inherent" human right. It can change, if the constitution is amended.
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Old 09-25-2014, 09:56 AM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,866 posts, read 46,432,657 times
Reputation: 18520
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
It is a right guaranteed to you by law. That right, like all others granted by law, can be repealed and removed. If an amendment were drafted today, went through the entire process to amend the constitution, the federal government could very easily take away our right to bear arms.


There is a good reason the 1st 10 amendments, that we the people, tell them the government, you mess with this, we kill you.... It is called the bill of rights.

Try to amend them and you will be a traitor to freedom and personal liberty. The 2nd amendment will be used to eliminate you and anyone conspiring to do so with you.
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