Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Well this is both disturbing and should prompt action if borne to be true. I've always had more of an issue with our loose registration system and while I am in favor of Voter ID, it's useless if a person can register without needing to prove neither citizenship nor identity. The biggest flaw in our system is at registration and needs to be strengthened. Let's face it, simply signing an affidavit to say you are a citizen is not sufficient in the world today where fraud is rampant (e.g. credit card fraud, identity fraud, tax fraud, etc, etc).
First problem is that the OP does not know the difference between non-citizen and illegal.
And many of the non-citizens that vote in FL are likely Republicans. So not to be looked at.
Besides my choice of words, have you anything to say about the substance of the study?
I simply do not care who these non-citizens are voting for because I do genuinely care about protecting our voting process. What I cannot understand is why doesn't everyone care? These are not insignificant numbers.
Besides my choice of words, have you anything to say about the substance of the study?
I simply do not care who these non-citizens are voting for because I do genuinely care about protecting our voting process. What I cannot understand is why doesn't everyone care? These are not insignificant numbers.
We don't know if overall they are, or are not, insignificant numbers. On top of that, the Blue Wall states - which the GOP must start winning to get back POTUS, are generally showing double-digit (percentage) margins in POTUS races. Even if we assumed illegals made up 1/2 of one percent of total POTUS votes, since EC is winner take all. 9.5% margins vs 10% margins equals the same EC result.
You are (IMO) looking for a way to avoid the elephant in the room. To compete where the GOP is getting smashed (POTUS, 5 of last 6 popular votes lost, best result during that time of 286 ECs unachievable w/o turning NM and VA around-which means NOVA!!), the party must appeal as it once did to independents and moderates. That means they must appeal far less to their base every minute of every day. Their base is largely responsible for their terrible plight in terms of POTUS losses. in 24 years, they have lost >61% of the total EC vote.
We don't know if overall they are, or are not, insignificant numbers. On top of that, the Blue Wall states - which the GOP must start winning to get back POTUS, are generally showing double-digit (percentage) margins in POTUS races. Even if we assumed illegals made up 1/2 of one percent of total POTUS votes, since EC is winner take all. 9.5% margins vs 10% margins equals the same EC result.
You are (IMO) looking for a way to avoid the elephant in the room. To compete where the GOP is getting smashed (POTUS, 5 of last 6 popular votes lost, best result during that time of 286 ECs unachievable w/o turning NM and VA around-which means NOVA!!), the party must appeal as it once did to independents and moderates. That means they must appeal far less to their base every minute of every day. Their base is largely responsible for their terrible plight in terms of POTUS losses. in 24 years, they have lost >61% of the total EC vote.
I look at the issue as separate from one party winning the White House or the other. To me, it's more about protecting our voting system, something that is a bit of a hot button for me. If these percentages are accurate in the study, it is not an insignificant number. Let's not even count illegal aliens and only look at legal permanent residents - aka green card holders. According to DHS, as of 2012, there were 13.3 million green card holders living in the United States (http://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/fil...pr_pe_2012.pdf). Being green card holders, they are not eligible to vote. If the study is accurate in their claims that 2.2 percent of non-citizens voted in 2012, that represents a whopping 292,600 illegally cast votes.
This type of number should be concerning to both the left and the right. It's enough votes to sway elections one way or another if the demographics are favorable for that state/district/town. Since the article did not break it down by state or district, it's difficult to say if it would or would not have impacted the election but there are enough numbers to say, with certainty, that voter fraud - even if unintentional as the article suggests may be a driver - is not an insignificant problem.
I don't think Voter ID alone will solve it. There has to be better processes in place at the registration level and then continue on down to the voting polls. This can be done without disenfranchising any eligible voters but will not be done if we continue to act as though voter fraud is non-existent and something that shouldn't be addressed. I would love to see a genuine bi-partisan effort to attack this issue. Unfortunately, I am seeing more finger pointing and accusations than anything else. National ID has been brought up as an idea. Sure, I'm in favor of that. Regardless, I must admit I tire of the argument that our voting process is the only thing in modern day America that somehow is totally immune to any fraud, especially when we see fraud perpetuated in almost every other area of life - taxes, banking, identity, medicare, etc, etc.
Besides my choice of words, have you anything to say about the substance of the study?
I simply do not care who these non-citizens are voting for because I do genuinely care about protecting our voting process. What I cannot understand is why doesn't everyone care? These are not insignificant numbers.
Then you probably should support a National ID that would make it impossible for people to vote in multiple states and make it impossible for any illegal to vote.
Then you probably should support a National ID that would make it impossible for people to vote in multiple states and make it impossible for any illegal to vote.
I would. I'm not anti-Federal government, I just prefer it smaller. However, for something like this, I think it's important to protect our voting process and would support National ID.
Besides my choice of words, have you anything to say about the substance of the study?
I simply do not care who these non-citizens are voting for because I do genuinely care about protecting our voting process. What I cannot understand is why doesn't everyone care? These are not insignificant numbers.
There have been a number of instances of non-citizens voting particularly in southern FL. They all have photo ID. So nothing is presently proposed that would prevent them from voting.
And in general the right is not terribly interested in this problem in that many if not all of these non-citizen voters are Cuban who tend to vote for the GOP.
It is also a difficult problem and would require a new approach like a citizenship card or a passport to fix. The right does not want to go there. The right wishes to cut off the elderly and poor...who tend to vote Democratic.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
