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Old 11-01-2014, 01:47 PM
 
8,483 posts, read 6,909,050 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redraven View Post
Try this wikipedia site:

North Dakota oil boom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"The industrialization and population boom has put a strain on roads, water supplies, sewage systems, and government services in the area. Some counties have increased in population by almost double from 20,000 to 40,000.[9]"

Is a doubling of population enough to make the cut?

Keep in mind it is nearly impossible to find a place to live in the area. It is also nearly impossible to find a place to park an RV.

I still say if the map ignored a job scenario like that, their veracity is questionable!
It said major metropolitan areas, iirc. No data on types of jobs either. It is more a visual novelty than a real tool.
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Old 11-01-2014, 01:54 PM
 
8,483 posts, read 6,909,050 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
Well I guess we will just have to wait and see.
Unfortunately, that seems to be the way bubbles are largely defined, with 20/20 hindsight. After the contraction.

There are people talking about bubbles, however.

Blackstone’s Private Equity Head Warns: “We Are In The Middle Of An Epic Credit Bubble”
quote:
Blackstone Group have arguably been at the center of inflating the new echo bubble in real estate by bidding (all cash) for property across the US. So it is somewhat ironic that just two months after we noted that "the smartest money is selling," the head of Blackstone's Private Equity Group had the following words for an audience at a Dow Jones Equity conference in New York:

“We are in the middle of an epic credit bubble, in my opinion, the likes of which I haven’t seen in my career in private equity.”
Joseph Baratta had plenty more to say including “the good times are not going to last forever,” and “we are not leveraging US GDP,” as he expects a ‘mean reversion’ in multiples and “that largesse goes to the seller.”
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Old 11-01-2014, 02:08 PM
 
8,483 posts, read 6,909,050 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivorytickler View Post
We're still not out of it. Just because jobs are being created doesn't mean that all the people who were displaced during the recession have found work. I now many who have not found work. Most of them in their 50's and 60's. Some are underemployed and others have chosen to start living off of IRA's and taking SS early. From where I sit we have not recovered. I'm hoping we've turned a corner but I'm not holding my breath. When an area loses over 100k jobs per year for multiple years, it is not back on it's feet because 50,000 new jobs have been created there. There are still hundreds of thousands of people looking for jobs. What I'd really like to see is a map that compares job creation to job elimination in the last 10 years. All you have to do is drive down the main roads here to see we have not recovered. Every shopping mall has vacant buildings. We have restaurants and stores that have closed and the buildings sit vacant. Houses that sit vacant. Most of the vacant houses are occupied on my street now but we still have several. Saying the economy has recovered is like saying my neighborhood has recovered. It hasn't and won't until all the houses have people living in them. Anything less is not a recovery. This is not a recovery. Anyone who thinks it is doesn't know what a recovery looks like. When you have 100+ applicants for every engineering job opening, that is NOT a recovery. Too many highly qualified people cannot find work.
There is BLS data, but one has to look at the underlying data details, definitions and formulas, also. Just like with UE and LFPR. There are not enough jobs being created. The trend is still leaning toward emerging markets. When the govt et al investments can benefit from off-shoring as they do it is unlikely to change.

For instance, with manufacturing, over compensating for computers skews the data. Manufacturing is very important for an economy. Indexes can be easily skewed. From 2000-2010 the manufacturing was off-shored by -33%, at least. Many count higher.
Worse Than the Great Depression: What the Experts Are Missing ...
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Old 11-01-2014, 03:42 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
46,001 posts, read 35,048,869 times
Reputation: 7875
Quote:
Originally Posted by CDusr View Post
Unfortunately, that seems to be the way bubbles are largely defined, with 20/20 hindsight. After the contraction.

There are people talking about bubbles, however.

Blackstone’s Private Equity Head Warns: “We Are In The Middle Of An Epic Credit Bubble”
quote:
Blackstone Group have arguably been at the center of inflating the new echo bubble in real estate by bidding (all cash) for property across the US. So it is somewhat ironic that just two months after we noted that "the smartest money is selling," the head of Blackstone's Private Equity Group had the following words for an audience at a Dow Jones Equity conference in New York:

“We are in the middle of an epic credit bubble, in my opinion, the likes of which I haven’t seen in my career in private equity.”
Joseph Baratta had plenty more to say including “the good times are not going to last forever,” and “we are not leveraging US GDP,” as he expects a ‘mean reversion’ in multiples and “that largesse goes to the seller.”
Not following their connection they are trying to make. If buyers are doing all cash deals, then in theory they are not dealing with credit when it comes to purchasing property. Plus the level of real estate going on now is nothing compared to the last real estate bubble.
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Old 11-01-2014, 04:20 PM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,795 posts, read 7,265,210 times
Reputation: 5194
Quote:
Originally Posted by blktoptrvl View Post
This Map Depicts The Staggering Highs And Lows Of The U.S. Economy Since 1999

Maybe this will help correct some of the baseless claims here.
Another total BS piece of propaganda. Truth is that the employment participation rate is the worse it has been for decades and many of the people in this country are working for less now than they were in 1999,
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Old 11-01-2014, 04:26 PM
 
Location: Limbo
6,513 posts, read 7,520,840 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimhcom View Post
Another total BS piece of propaganda. Truth is that the employment participation rate is the worse it has been for decades and many of the people in this country are working for less now than they were in 1999,
What does that have to do with a graphic displaying the numerical gains and losses in jobs around the country?
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Old 11-01-2014, 05:04 PM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,795 posts, read 7,265,210 times
Reputation: 5194
Quote:
Originally Posted by emcee squared View Post
What does that have to do with a graphic displaying the numerical gains and losses in jobs around the country?
Because the point of the chart was to try to show that the economy has improved because of numerical jobs gains, it has not improved, it has deteriorated, due to the destruction of good jobs and the creation of McJobs.
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Old 11-01-2014, 06:42 PM
 
Location: SC
8,793 posts, read 8,116,884 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimhcom View Post
Another total BS piece of propaganda. Truth is that the employment participation rate is the worse it has been for decades and many of the people in this country are working for less now than they were in 1999,
Like most things in life. You get out of it what you put into it.

This is simply a map of the number of jobs lost and gained...

"America has been through a roller coaster ride of job creation and job loss over the last 15 years. But sometimes it can be difficult to really grasp just how wild that ride has been."

If you want to put a political slant to it, feel free, but it does not purprot to be anything but a map of data.
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Old 11-01-2014, 08:56 PM
 
Location: New Orleans, La. USA
6,354 posts, read 3,638,945 times
Reputation: 2522
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
Man, that also shows the effects of Clinton signing the China Free Trade Agreement in late 2000.
The rust belt began almost immediately.
Clinton (and republicans in congress) gave us Free Trade with China.

After Clinton signed the China trade deal republicans in congress had a party. They brought out a huge fortune cookie with smiles on their faces. They broke open the fortune cookie and the fortune said "trade with China will bring us all wealth."

I saw the above on the Netflix documentary "Death by China."

Last edited by chad3; 11-01-2014 at 09:13 PM..
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Old 11-02-2014, 05:08 AM
 
13,675 posts, read 8,961,039 times
Reputation: 10385
Quote:
Originally Posted by chad3 View Post
Clinton (and republicans in congress) gave us Free Trade with China.

After Clinton signed the China trade deal republicans in congress had a party. They brought out a huge fortune cookie with smiles on their faces. They broke open the fortune cookie and the fortune said "trade with China will bring us all wealth."

I saw the above on the Netflix documentary "Death by China."

I do not believe we have a 'free trade' agreement with China (yet).

Free Trade Agreements | Office of the United States Trade Representative

Above is link showing what countries the US has Free Trade agreements with.

Maurice Greenberg: Time for a China-U.S. Free Trade Agreement - WSJ

Above is an opinion piece, dated 2012, in which the author argues that the US should enter into a free trade agreement with China.

Plus, from memory, it was during the Nixon presidency that we opened relations with China (I recall Nixon visiting China). We started 'trade' soon thereafter, with the argument being that it would create many thousands, if not millions, of jobs here, as our manufacturing plants send products to China. One of the first to ship to China was Coca Cola.

Alas, I believe it was in 1980 that Coca Cola determined that it would be more profitable to actually open bottling plants in China (now they have 50 or so), which certainly helped improve China's employment rate. Other companies, as we all know, took the lesson to heart, and improved upon the idea by opening plants in China to make products to ship back here.

There is no one political party to blame. All are to blame.

There are levels of 'trade' agreements. I believe the highest level is "free trade", which we do not yet have with China.
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