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Old 12-16-2014, 11:03 AM
 
18,340 posts, read 18,963,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toryturner View Post
"Wanted" should not constitute the right to exist. MANY children are not wanted after birth but practically no one advocates eliminating them.
do you advocate woman remain pregnant and give birth against their will?
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Old 12-16-2014, 11:04 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MotleyCrew View Post
I am sick of these talking points myself. If women are in control of their organs, then perhaps they should do a better job of managing them. Rape aside. No woman/girl should bear those burdens.

so you are the morality police for women now? how well a woman lives up to your standards is not the issue.
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Old 12-16-2014, 11:08 AM
 
3,216 posts, read 2,226,483 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hothulamaui View Post
do you advocate woman remain pregnant and give birth against their will?
For me, it isn't so much about the woman carrying a child for nine months as it is about the perception of humanity being bestowed only if a child is wanted. I am not however addressing the issue of rape.
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Old 12-16-2014, 11:08 AM
 
15,047 posts, read 8,850,672 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
That's your assumption. I think if you read the article correctly and in proper context it becomes clear that the writer was accurately reflecting the views of the two surgeons.
"Over thirty years ago, Harrison and Adzick, at least, knew that they were not operating on some non-sentient clump of cells. These are babies, with the sort of medical problems that affect the rest of us, needing care as we all do."
Yeah, let's talk about assumptions. I did read the blog post. Those words were absolutely the blog writer's assumptions, not the surgeons' words. It was his personal assumption, drawn from his personal opinion (i.e., bias) about abortion. Nothing more. Show me where the surgeons made any such claim.
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Old 12-16-2014, 11:12 AM
 
18,340 posts, read 18,963,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toryturner View Post
For me, it isn't so much about the woman carrying a child for nine months as it is about the perception of humanity being bestowed only if a child is wanted. I am not however addressing the issue of rape.

so you equate a "perception" vs the risk of pregnancy? way to trivialize pregnancy. perception is a thought. pregnancy and it's risks and either raising a child or giving it up for adoption is a real thing.
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Old 12-16-2014, 11:16 AM
 
3,216 posts, read 2,226,483 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hothulamaui View Post
so you equate a "perception" vs the risk of pregnancy? way to trivialize pregnancy. perception is a thought. pregnancy and it's risks and either raising a child or giving it up for adoption is a real thing.
I have had two pregnancies. The risks only seem to be hyped by people who want to advance the case for abortion. And there are also risks with abortion. Pregnancy is one of those things that deserve thought and consideration before becoming pregnant. That is why birth control is a serious issue. Abortion is an after thought.
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Old 12-16-2014, 11:23 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toryturner View Post
I have had two pregnancies. The risks only seem to be hyped by people who want to advance the case for abortion. And there are also risks with abortion.
I've had three pregnancies--two went to term and one ended in abortion. The abortion was much less physically stressful and taxing by comparison.

I get that there are risks with absolutely any kind of medical condition, but the risks in abortion are significantly lower than they are for pregnancy, where any number of things can go wrong, not to mention the physical stress and inherent dangers of childbirth. This is true at least in countries where abortion is legal and safe. Such as here in the U.S.--unless the religious Gestapo succeeds in getting their way.
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Old 12-16-2014, 11:27 AM
 
18,340 posts, read 18,963,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toryturner View Post
I have had two pregnancies. The risks only seem to be hyped by people who want to advance the case for abortion. And there are also risks with abortion. Pregnancy is one of those things that deserve thought and consideration before becoming pregnant. That is why birth control is a serious issue. Abortion is an after thought.

abortion is an after thought, doesn't mean it shouldn't be an option. there are risks with pregnancy. if memory serves 250,000 women globally each year die, in the us about 600 or so. I am pro choice. I support the choice of an individual woman right to decide what she wants to do when she becomes pregnant. no woman should be forced to remain pregnant against her will.
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Old 12-16-2014, 11:41 AM
 
3,216 posts, read 2,226,483 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeyJude514 View Post
I've had three pregnancies--two went to term and one ended in abortion. The abortion was much less physically stressful and taxing by comparison.

I get that there are risks with absolutely any kind of medical condition, but the risks in abortion are significantly lower than they are for pregnancy, where any number of things can go wrong, not to mention the physical stress and inherent dangers of childbirth. This is true at least in countries where abortion is legal and safe. Such as here in the U.S.--unless the religious Gestapo succeeds in getting their way.
While I understand every pregnancy is different and personal, I was healthier during my pregnancies than any other time of my life. Probably due to increased vigilance of diet, exercise, etc. I just feel that the risks of pregnancy are usually emphasised by people advocating an abortion as opposed to carrying a child to term. Very few women who are contemplating a much wanted child ruminate about the risks of pregnancy.
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Old 12-16-2014, 11:55 AM
 
8,392 posts, read 7,354,917 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
Oh, please. Your arguments are beginning to border on the absurd.
I'm just following along with your definition of what constitutes a human being. You seem to keep adding qualifications to the definition until it wedges into a shape to support your contention.

Quote:
A baby in the womb (referred to as a fetus, right up until birth) is completely in tact. Your "severed finger," while it has your DNA is not a human being. The living fetus in the womb is.
'A baby in the womb' is actually called a fetus. Even you use the term. The question isn't what is or isn't a fetus, but what is a human. You set the standard as having unique DNA, yet you seem upset when it's pointed out that your standard is, well, clear only to those who agree with you.

Quote:
Just because it is not yet born does not make it less human.
Again, what makes a fetus a human? And why does your definition get to prevail?

Quote:
But this is what pro-aborts must do; twist, dance around the subject, manipulate and even change terms, in order to dehumanize what is obviously a living human being, so that they can be comfortable with the killing of innocent life.
Who said that I'm a 'pro-abort'? I'm just trying to understand your faith-based rationalization.

If a fetus was a human, why aren't miscarriages investigated as potential homicides? Why aren't you picketing your local police station right now?

Quote:
I'm betting that you are thankful that your mother didn't abort you.
How much would you bet on that? Seriously, I could make some significant money here....

Last edited by djmilf; 12-16-2014 at 12:23 PM.. Reason: Seriously....
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