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Old 12-28-2014, 11:26 AM
 
11,086 posts, read 8,539,703 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimhcom View Post
Wrong, In January 1921, the Inter-Allied Reparations Commission decided on the amount of reparations Germany was to pay: 269 billion gold marks, which equaled around 110,000 tons of gold. This amount required was equivalent to about 50% of all the gold ever mined in history--which was too a high a sum for Germany to ever repay. Consequently, Germany was forced to repay the debt in devalued Gold Marks, which ultimately led to hyperinflation and severe economic distress in Germany.

Reparations came in a variety of forms, including most of Germany's coal, steel, intellectual property and agricultural products.

In 1923 Germany defaulted on its ability to deliver further amounts of coal and steel. In response, French and Belgian troops occupied the Ruhr River valley inside the western border of Germany, and their coal and steel industries. This lead to a further strain on Germany's economy and contributing significantly to inflation. When the government began printing more money to pay its debts, it created astronomical "hyperinflation", the worst ever seen in the history of civilization.

The buying power of German money simply disintegrated. By the end of 1923, a life savings of a hundred thousand Marks would not buy a loaf of bread

It was the hardships and poverty caused by the greed of the Allies who wanted to use the war to make Germany a slave state that led to the rise of the Nazi's and WW2.
That was half the story.

The other half concerned the attempt by foreign communists to overthrow regional German governments to install a communist dictatorship and the stated goal of Lenin to take the revolution all the way to Berlin.

Bavarian Soviet Republic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Polish

http://www.amazon.com/Warsaw-1920-Le.../dp/0007225520

The German people's fear of the aggressive communist menace in the east wasn't based on irrational paranoia.
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Old 12-28-2014, 11:42 AM
 
13,307 posts, read 7,864,463 times
Reputation: 2144
Quote:
Originally Posted by jman07 View Post
The new age of war is now economic and cyber warfare. Example. All of Europe and America is at war with russia through economic warefare. We are destroying Russia's economy through international cooperation and sanctions.
Yeah!

They did that with Germany.
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Old 12-28-2014, 11:42 AM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,795 posts, read 7,285,342 times
Reputation: 5194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goinback2011 View Post
That was half the story.

The other half concerned the attempt by foreign communists to overthrow regional German governments to install a communist dictatorship and the stated goal of Lenin to take the revolution all the way to Berlin.

Bavarian Soviet Republic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Polish

Warsaw 1920: Lenin's Failed Conquest of Europe: Adam Zamoyski: 9780007225521: Amazon.com: Books

The German people's fear of the aggressive communist menace in the east wasn't based on irrational paranoia.
Good point, Germany was being besieged by vultures on both sides.
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Old 12-28-2014, 04:34 PM
 
20,524 posts, read 15,895,818 times
Reputation: 5948
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimhcom View Post
Wrong, In January 1921, the Inter-Allied Reparations Commission decided on the amount of reparations Germany was to pay: 269 billion gold marks, which equaled around 110,000 tons of gold. This amount required was equivalent to about 50% of all the gold ever mined in history--which was too a high a sum for Germany to ever repay. Consequently, Germany was forced to repay the debt in devalued Gold Marks, which ultimately led to hyperinflation and severe economic distress in Germany.

Reparations came in a variety of forms, including most of Germany's coal, steel, intellectual property and agricultural products.

In 1923 Germany defaulted on its ability to deliver further amounts of coal and steel. In response, French and Belgian troops occupied the Ruhr River valley inside the western border of Germany, and their coal and steel industries. This lead to a further strain on Germany's economy and contributing significantly to inflation. When the government began printing more money to pay its debts, it created astronomical "hyperinflation", the worst ever seen in the history of civilization.

The buying power of German money simply disintegrated. By the end of 1923, a life savings of a hundred thousand Marks would not buy a loaf of bread

It was the hardships and poverty caused by the greed of the Allies who wanted to use the war to make Germany a slave state that led to the rise of the Nazi's and WW2.
Please post up a link about those numbers.
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Old 12-28-2014, 04:37 PM
 
13,586 posts, read 13,108,708 times
Reputation: 17786
Quote:
Originally Posted by jman07 View Post
It's clearly not moving that way. I look forward to seeing your post admitting you are wrong a year from now when we are not dropping bombs on russia or North Korea. When in history has real war came after economic warfare? We don't need to drop bombs. Sanctions are achieving their purposes. It's called evolution. Kind of like how the civilized world doesn't enslave or behead people anymore.
WWII with Japan. Started with us choking off their oil and economy.
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Old 12-28-2014, 07:32 PM
 
Location: San Diego California
6,795 posts, read 7,285,342 times
Reputation: 5194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Packard fan View Post
Please post up a link about those numbers.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...3KCzF0yLhCyjWA

You may also want to read what John Maynard Keynes had to say about the reparations imposed on Germany

Last edited by jimhcom; 12-28-2014 at 07:41 PM..
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Old 12-28-2014, 07:55 PM
 
20,524 posts, read 15,895,818 times
Reputation: 5948
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimhcom View Post
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...3KCzF0yLhCyjWA

You may also want to read what John Maynard Keynes had to say about the reparations imposed on Germany
Thanks. I know that Germany was over a barrel but, I found it hard to believe that it was over 500 billion with a "B" 100 years ago. Yowza!
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Old 12-28-2014, 08:03 PM
 
Location: Virginia
274 posts, read 238,895 times
Reputation: 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by jman07 View Post
there is no "kinetially" waged war against the EU and US. It wont happen.

All military and political experts agree that there is no threat of a physical war with Russia. You don't know more than them no matter how smart you pretend to be.
First, what do you call an attack on foreign soil that results the death of several thousands of that countries citizenry. An act of War. When we have been on the wrong end of such attacks what have we done historically? we have put foot to tail to demonstrate our anger at the situation.

Let me say I work in the field of cyber security for a County Government. Countries like North Korea and China and Russia as well as the U.S. have Military units intended to address these type of Cyber attacks in Cyberspace.

Second, The vast majority of these attacks are not State sponsored attacks but rather either purely criminal or ideological groups such as Occupy Movement types.

Bombs and bullets are not going anywhere anytime soon. Cyber warfare is another tool in the toolbox but it will not ever replace conventional warfare. In the same way drones have not eliminated the need for Infintry Soldiers. The only true and permanent solution to stop a guy behind a keyboard is put a Bullet in his head or a a 1500 lb Bomb through his front door. Not very subtle but it sends a very clear message.
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Old 12-28-2014, 08:05 PM
 
8,391 posts, read 6,294,075 times
Reputation: 2314
Quote:
Originally Posted by jman07 View Post
The new age of war is now economic and cyber warfare. Example. All of Europe and America is at war with russia through economic warefare. We are destroying Russia's economy through international cooperation and sanctions. We are retaliating against North Korea by covertly shutting down their internet, not with bombs. The new world order is now about building economic relationships with as many powerful countries as possible and leveraging that. Other countries friendly to Russia are now avoiding it because of the negative economic impact alliances will have compared to the EU and America. At the end of the day all people care about is their standard of living and money. For all you drama queens and war mongers, you will be disappointed that future wars in the developed world will not be fought with bombs and bullets.
Here is yet another insane fear mongering conservative oh the world is falling post.

conservatives are wrong about everything.

How long are we going to pretend they make sense?

Remember how we had to ban all West Africans an ignorant and racist policy idea that conservativrs were running with while they lied about Ebola. They were utterly wrong and proven wrong by reality.


Remember how Central Americans coming to America were going to cause a humanitarian crisis that was going to last for years and overwhelm America with diseases, and they'd never be deported? Again conservatives were 100% wrong again.


Remember conservatives slobbering over Putin humiliating President Obama and he was just going to invade nation after nation due to American weakness and reconstitute the former USSR? conservatives were 100% wrong again

I can go on, the number of things conservatives have gotten completely wrong is staggering.

The stimulus, ACA, war in Iraq, the auto bail outs, torture/war on terror. All more topics conservatives were 100% wrong sbout everything they said was going to happen but didn't.
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Old 12-28-2014, 08:07 PM
 
Location: Virginia
274 posts, read 238,895 times
Reputation: 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by Packard fan View Post
That could backfire, how I don't know. NO country would dare attack us in open warfare IF things went that bad.
You Sir are wrong.
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