Stop blaming mental health for gun violence. The problem is guns. (unemployment, politician)

[neutrino78x]

Originally Posted by Annuvin

This is why it is a complete waste of time debating with antis. They are misguided fanatics who seem to think that murder never existed prior to the invention of gunpowder.

I don't want to ban all firearms either, but you have to admit that places like the UK and Japan have very low rates of murder and gun violence.

[Nonesuch]

Originally Posted by Nighteyes

Here's the deal. (a) Gun violence in the 'Good ol' US of A' is abso-danged-lutely real. (b) Gun Violence in the 'Good ol' US of A' is abso-danged-lutely intolerable. (c) Most of the perpetrators of Gun-Violence in the Good-ol' US of A are, or should have been, diagnosably mentally ill.

I disagree with point (c). Based on published data, 75% of the perpetrators (and many of the victims) are, or should have been, convicted criminals. The only institution most murderers belonged in is prison.

Also, the USA seems to be doing a fine job of reducing "gun violence" without, or even despite, new laws. Since you reference Reagan and the 1980s, here's the trend since then:

But firearms homicides aren't the only "gun crime", so let's see what the CDC has to say about non-fatal violent crime:

[Woof]

Originally Posted by ScoopLV

The difference being that Rosie isn't shoving food down someone else's mouth and making them fat. If morons with guns only shot themselves, I would be in favor of shoveling all the guns we can at society and letting stupid people self-delete.

But it doesn't work that way. Morons with guns often find a way to shoot people just trying to get through their day.

[cindersslipper]

Originally Posted by DeenThomas

Hi there! I'm new here and i don't know what do you think about gun-usage.
Hope that it will be good thread and somebody will tell me why i'm wrong or why i'm right!

So, let's speak about gun control, gun ownership and mental health testing.
I often see articles with headlines like "Toddler shot his parents" or "Another shootings in *districtname*" and people in comments often write very stupid arguments to protect themselves and all of gun owners.
Also they like to write something like "Only mad and mentally-ill persons kill people, not guns"
But as we can see from this article Stop blaming mental health for gun violence. The problem is guns. - The Washington Post
only 4 percent of people which used guns was mentally ill.
And now i wanna know your opinion.

P.S. please, post some real arguments, not stats about ids died in swimming pools!

FANTASTIC!! kudos to you my friend.

Now I cannot ABIDE the idiocy of the pro gun lobby so that is all I wanted to say.

Well done, America, FINALLY you begin to see the light....!

[scarabchuck]

Originally Posted by cindersslipper

FANTASTIC!! kudos to you my friend.

Now I cannot ABIDE the idiocy of the pro gun lobby so that is all I wanted to say.

Well done, America, FINALLY you begin to see the light....!

Seems like the problem and solution is pretty clear to me. If only 4% of the firearms crimes are done by the mentally ill , and 75% are done by people that should not have had them or should be in prison then there is a failure in our judicial system. Also what percentage of the crimes commited by the mentally ill were actual lawful firearms owners ?
This just reinforces the fact that all the feel good restrictions and or bans will do nothing to solve the problem. Like I've said before , many times we need to look at the root cause. How did a 13 year old get a firearm, how did a convicted felon get one, why are felons that have multiple firearms violations back on the street ? Those are the problems that need to be addressed.

[Sonorio]

The reason that gun people think that everyone should be free to own a gun, is that they are generally responsible and honorable people, and they mistakenly think that everyone else is too.

The reason that gun haters think that nobody should be free to own a gun, is that that they are generally irrresponsible and despicable people, and they mistakenly think that everyone else is too.

[mkpunk]

Originally Posted by scarabchuck

Seems like the problem and solution is pretty clear to me. If only 4% of the firearms crimes are done by the mentally ill , and 75% are done by people that should not have had them or should be in prison then there is a failure in our judicial system. Also what percentage of the crimes commited by the mentally ill were actual lawful firearms owners ?
This just reinforces the fact that all the feel good restrictions and or bans will do nothing to solve the problem. Like I've said before , many times we need to look at the root cause. How did a 13 year old get a firearm, how did a convicted felon get one, why are felons that have multiple firearms violations back on the street ? Those are the problems that need to be addressed.

Stealing, guns available at home, unlawful sales, etc.

[scarabchuck]

Originally Posted by mkpunk

Stealing, guns available at home, unlawful sales, etc.

Stealing, seems like we have laws against that already

Guns available at home, I do think we need to make firearms owners more responsible if a firearm falls into a childs hands or something similar.

Unlawful sales, again we already have laws in place for this.

Seems to me like we need to enforce what we already have instead of adding band aids to the problem.

[yourmomlivesintally]

If people were considered for employment they would not have to kill off each other. DUH ! Job development which leads to income which leads to less stress decreases stressors.

[Byron1022]

Originally Posted by creepy

I agree we have too many guns in the US. A ridiculous amount and I do think they excess leads to a sloppiness and irresponsibility and a "gun-mind" in many idiots. Not all gun owners but many for some reason once they own a gun cannot get using the gun in every bad situation out of their mind. These are the people who shoot the guy with Alzheimer's who wandered away from his home at night, shoot the Autistic man who beats on the door, the foreign trick-or Treater, etc. Then you have those that store guns loaded-more sad times.

So yes I think that most of our problems are from excess or irresponsible gun ownership but we cannot ignore the mental illness component because it ties into the other. Like the parents in Colorado who gave their mentally ill son access to their guns and he shot the Giffords woman.
Gabrielle Giffords - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Define "mental." The only reason I say that because it is a subjective term. I think that men that put certain part of their body into another mans waste disposal exit is "mentally" imbalanced. However, so called normal "judges" concur with millions of so called normal people who think this is a sane thing to do.

Here is another example: Retired cop had fire arms for well over thirty plus years, never a problem.
He goes to the Dr. for insomnia. The NYS politicians cross reference his medical record to his pistol licenses, a cadre of cops show up on his door step and take his guns. Why? "Insomnia is a mental health issue!!"

I ask you: Who is mentally unstable? The cop? or the Politicians??

So one must be very careful when determining who is a "head case" and who is not.