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Old 02-07-2015, 04:00 AM
 
Location: The Island of Misfit Toys
2,767 posts, read 2,295,559 times
Reputation: 2343

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The maker of a gun attachment called The Alternative has just wrapped up his company’s first-ever police training for the device, with the police department in Ferguson, Missouri, which is considering buying it, six months after a police officer shot and killed unarmed 18-year-old Michael Brown.

Christian Ellis told Here & Now’s Robin Young that The Alternative makes a bullet less lethal by slowing it down and trapping it. He says more than 400 agencies and police departments have expressed an interest in it.

More: ‘Airbag For A Bullet': Is It A Game-Changer For Police? | Here & Now

http://youtu.be/A8xDDx1O3dA

If you are an average gun owner who truly is only interested in protecting themselves, I don't see what excuse you could have to not get this, if it works.

This is a brilliant idea and I imagine it could now be perfected in some way so every bullet can non-lethal but have stopping power.

What if the bullets themselves were shaped a certain way to provide just the right amount of air resistance?
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Old 02-07-2015, 04:52 AM
 
17,027 posts, read 9,533,008 times
Reputation: 5701
Now if LE can consistently hit their target with just one shot fired.................
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Old 02-07-2015, 05:52 AM
 
Location: NJ
16,826 posts, read 11,769,807 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesjuke View Post
Now if LE can consistently hit their target with just one shot fired.................
Reminds me of the night i came upon a deer on the side of the road, sitting up, with obvious car parts around it and broken legs. Called a local cop on duty, he shows up and shoots it in the jaw. I politely suggest he shoot it again. He confidently said, 'I shot it in the brain, it will die in a few minutes'. After a few minutes he shot again and finally put the deer out of its misery.

Now if we could just get gangs to use this new theoretical 'improvement'.

That looks like a one shot deal.
How does that fit in your holster?
Good info for thugs to know.
Any obstruction can deflect a bullet.
Bullet construction has to be a large part of this.

Remember john eric hexson, the actor, and bruce lee's son? both shot at close range with blanks, the wad penetrated and killed in both circumstances.

Furgeson will embrace any gimmick, incantation or suggestion no matter how dumb, just to appease the false narrative perpetuated by holder, sharpton and their profoundly jaded supporters.
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Old 02-07-2015, 06:04 AM
 
78,289 posts, read 33,358,137 times
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Totally unworkable. How do you determine before the fact whether you need lethal force or not? I'm a pretty big critic of stupid police actions but there are indeed times lethal force is needed.

If the other guy has a gun also, you don't want to just knock him down.
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Old 02-07-2015, 06:26 AM
 
Location: The Island of Misfit Toys
2,767 posts, read 2,295,559 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
Totally unworkable. How do you determine before the fact whether you need lethal force or not? .
How do you determine that before you make any arrest? So by your logic cops should go lethal every time?...lol. Talk about unworkable.
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Old 02-07-2015, 06:31 AM
 
78,289 posts, read 33,358,137 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shankapotomus View Post
How do you determine that before you make any arrest? So by your logic cops should go lethal every time?...lol. Talk about unworkable.
Did you address my point? No, you did not. The other guy has a gun without this device and the police officer has one with it. Who has the advantage?

We want the police to make better decisions but that does not mean putting them at a disadvantage when they legitimately need to protect themselves. So if you want to dismiss my point, actually address it.

If lethal force is not needed, what we want is for the police to restrain themselves from using it. When it is needed it needs to be readily and quickly available. The idea is not to put the police at a disadvantage but rather, for them to make better decisions.
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Old 02-07-2015, 07:44 AM
 
Location: The Island of Misfit Toys
2,767 posts, read 2,295,559 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
Did you address my point? No, you did not. The other guy has a gun without this device and the police officer has one with it. Who has the advantage?

We want the police to make better decisions but that does not mean putting them at a disadvantage when they legitimately need to protect themselves. So if you want to dismiss my point, actually address it.

If lethal force is not needed, what we want is for the police to restrain themselves from using it. When it is needed it needs to be readily and quickly available. The idea is not to put the police at a disadvantage but rather, for them to make better decisions.
It's a modification to the gun that can be added or removed within seconds. Plus it would only be the first bullet that would be non-lethal but still powerful enough to break ribs. There would be nothing preventing the officer from firing off multiple rounds in succession, the rest of them deadly.

The point is the non-lethal bullet can be used in situations where it's clear the suspect only has something like a knife or bat and is resisting arrest.

Also the problem is not that police use deadly weapons against gun weilding assailants.

The problem is we see police using deadly force at the wrong time. "Could have had a gun" is not really a good excuse for a dead person. Especially, when we see police shooting at people merely because they were doing as instructed and retrieving their wallet and license.

You can't kill somebody and say "They could have had a gun" when they didn't.

If you're killing people who don't have weapons (and that is certainly happening) that tells me there is a grey area in your occupational conduct that might require a middle ground weapon to address.

You can't continue to sweep dead weaponless people under the rug as occupational collateral damage.
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Old 02-07-2015, 09:26 AM
 
Location: zooland 1
3,744 posts, read 3,411,242 times
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Dead weaponless people?

Pretty obvious you have never struggled to keep your gun in your holster when some amped thug tries to remove it...

CD police use of force authorities are funny to read about... but.. reality stops there
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Old 02-07-2015, 10:26 AM
 
78,289 posts, read 33,358,137 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shankapotomus View Post
It's a modification to the gun that can be added or removed within seconds. Plus it would only be the first bullet that would be non-lethal but still powerful enough to break ribs. There would be nothing preventing the officer from firing off multiple rounds in succession, the rest of them deadly.
Outside of the other guy firing a lethal shot first?

Quote:
The point is the non-lethal bullet can be used in situations where it's clear the suspect only has something like a knife or bat and is resisting arrest.
In those cases there are better options.

Quote:
Also the problem is not that police use deadly weapons against gun weilding assailants.

The problem is we see police using deadly force at the wrong time. "Could have had a gun" is not really a good excuse for a dead person. Especially, when we see police shooting at people merely because they were doing as instructed and retrieving their wallet and license.

You can't kill somebody and say "They could have had a gun" when they didn't.

If you're killing people who don't have weapons (and that is certainly happening) that tells me there is a grey area in your occupational conduct that might require a middle ground weapon to address.

You can't continue to sweep dead weaponless people under the rug as occupational collateral damage.
The idea there is to better train officers and fire and prosecute the officer that doesn't follow their training. Not place them at a disadvantage.
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Old 02-07-2015, 10:59 AM
 
Location: Palo Alto
12,172 posts, read 7,025,882 times
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Deaths will go UP, not DOWN. Police will simply state they tried non-lethal force first before firing off the other 16 rounds. The first hit rate for all police shootings is below 15% depending on which study you believe.

If you point a deadly weapon and discharge it, the only intent should be to kill. If you want non lethal guns, Wal-Mart sells Nerf guns.
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