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Old 02-19-2015, 06:20 AM
 
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Italy invaded Greece. England sent troops to help. England was at war with Germany. So Greek violated the terms of neutrality by hosting a belligerent's troops. Germany's invasion thus had the patina of legitimacy. (Even though its real reason was to rescue Mussolini.)

Thus, it could be argued Germany owes Greece no reparations. Although WWII reparations we settled in the 1950's.
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Old 02-19-2015, 07:32 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Both Portugal and Greece used to have their periods of greatness in the distant past. Today they are small countries, it doesn't really matter anymore whether they exist or not, there is no critical mass so to speak.
When you have no ambition and means to achieve something great, of course there is no excellence, you just try to muddle your way through.

Another aspect is geopolitics and war. Portugal is a very peaceful country now, whereas the countries you mentioned (Japan, China, Israel) are all paranoid, aggressive, and basically preparing for conflict. Unfortunately, war has always been a driving force behind development, just think of the Nazis' innovations.
Israel is paranoid?

I don't think that word means what you think it does.
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Old 02-19-2015, 01:43 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
Israel is paranoid?
The old quote goes 'just because you are paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you.'
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Old 02-19-2015, 01:48 PM
 
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Originally Posted by lilyflower3191981 View Post
Greeks have already taken their reparations from Germans.
Yep; they are not likely to ever pay off the debt living they have done for some years financed most by Germany. In fact if they do not stop the stupid rethoric they may feel sharper pain. They have not been asked to anything Ireland; Spain and Italy aren't with success. They have been on the coach so long; they can get up .
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Old 02-21-2015, 07:26 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
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There is an article in the German news magazine Spiegel today where they investigated that whole mess. They found that based on internal documents from the years 1989/90 the Kohl government back then used various tricks to deliberately avoid having to pay Greece and a few other countries due reparations and other forms of compensation for the Nazi era.
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Old 02-21-2015, 08:20 PM
 
Location: Dangling from a mooses antlers
7,311 posts, read 12,209,745 times
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Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Germany owes Greece billions by now, some say about 12b euros, including the interest on the money the Nazis forced Greece to give to the Nazis.
I am not sure the events back then have had no effect on Greece's current situation. One can't go back and see how things would have evolved without the Nazis in Greece.

Either way, I think Germany should pay Greece the money back. Germany got away way too easy after the war. The terms under which the Germans had to pay back their debt were more favorable than the ones for South European countries today. And the latter have not even committed a giant genocide. Something is definitely wrong in the way things are being handled...

Greece should make the Nazi's pay. In the mean time they should leave Germany out of it.
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Old 02-22-2015, 11:01 AM
 
5,532 posts, read 5,982,812 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
There is an article in the German news magazine Spiegel today where they investigated that whole mess. They found that based on internal documents from the years 1989/90 the Kohl government back then used various tricks to deliberately avoid having to pay Greece and a few other countries due reparations and other forms of compensation for the Nazi era.
Yeah sure, that's the Greek problem! Now, in 2015 when in big trouble they suddenly remembered that 75 years ago there were Nazis and...wait, what was I saying?
Ahh, the Greeks aren't responsible, one way or another. They simply aren't.
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Old 02-22-2015, 11:08 AM
 
Location: Miami, FL
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As Troyfan said above Italy invaded Greece first in Oct. 1940. Germany invaded Greece in April 1941. The occupation of Greece was partly Italian and German until Sept. 1943. Germany invaded because the Greeks were defeating the Italians and because Greece accepted help from Britain and allowed British forces within their borders. Germany and the British war at war and so it was considered necessary.

Sooo, the Greeks also looking to Italy for reparations? I bit sticky as Italy became a co-belligerent in 1943.

I am sure folks looked up the treaty in 1989/1990 when Germany unified and was freed by the Allies surrendered to in 1945(USSR, USA, UK, & France) from any more wartime obligations.

BTW, Germany only recently paid off the Versailles Treaty debt of 1919. The British only recently paid off their debts to the USA from WW2. The Brits never paid off their debts to the USA from WW1 as they forfeited in the 1930s.
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Old 02-22-2015, 11:47 AM
 
20,611 posts, read 13,021,541 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
There is an article in the German news magazine Spiegel today where they investigated that whole mess. They found that based on internal documents from the years 1989/90 the Kohl government back then used various tricks to deliberately avoid having to pay Greece and a few other countries due reparations and other forms of compensation for the Nazi era.
Many countries got beat up a whole lot WORSE than Greece did 70 years ago and, are doing pretty well in 2015 like Poland. I read about Warsaw being burnt to the ground by the Nazis and went "OMG". Too, Greece had a big Communist problem pitting Greek against Greek after WW 2 which didn't help things.

It seems to me it's easier for a place to fix itself up after an "outside" mess like being invaded by another country then that country gets kicked out than after a civil war. Because people unite against outsiders but; when it's brother against brother, that crap can hang around for many years. A quick look at our Civil War kinda explains a lot of the bad attitudes even in 2015.
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Old 02-22-2015, 02:57 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
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Originally Posted by stiffnecked View Post
Greece should make the Nazi's pay. In the mean time they should leave Germany out of it.
Why is that? Modern Germany is the legal successor to Nazi Germany. If there were no legal succession, any country could simply shed its responsibilities.

And again, to those who defend Germany: it was German investigators, not Greek ones, who unearthed those embarrassing documents...
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