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Old 05-18-2015, 05:43 AM
 
Location: Annandale, VA
5,098 posts, read 4,314,560 times
Reputation: 4209

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Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post
Want to be more like Germany? Fine. Only the best and brightest will have the opportunity to attend college. Everyone else either goes to work after graduating HS, or attends the equivalent of votech. Still want to aim higher, but can't make the cut? Then pay for it out of your own pocket.

I'm all for it. It is a very sensible and sustainable approach. Not like America, where everyone goes to college because all the jobs are either done by immigrants, or have been exported.


I agree. How about eliminating scholarships for students whose parents can afford to pay their tuition? Scholarships should be for elite students who cannot afford to pay the tuition. I read an article about the kid of rocker Richie Sambora and Heather Locklear having a 4.2 GPA and 11 scholarships to choose from. Those scholarships should be going to a needy kid instead.
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Old 05-18-2015, 06:05 AM
 
Location: DFW - Coppell / Las Colinas
32,022 posts, read 36,653,418 times
Reputation: 38651
Quote:
Originally Posted by Delahanty View Post
"The government" produces nothing; taxpayers would foot this bill, as they do for K -12.
My school taxes run about $3-4,000 a year. I could see where this could cause them to go up another 30-50%.
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Old 05-18-2015, 06:11 AM
 
Location: Barrington
45,866 posts, read 34,067,070 times
Reputation: 15329
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
Germany isn't funding a war around half the world or Paying billions to Israel, Pakistan, India, North Korea, Palestine, etc.

There is your money, when do you think we will ever see it?
Germany also has the involuntary part time job thing going on, too.
Full time employment has been declining since 1991.
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Old 05-18-2015, 06:18 AM
 
1,922 posts, read 1,497,346 times
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Tuition wouldn't be free, the cost would be transferred to other people. Also, if college is too expensive, maybe the colleges should learn how to operate more efficiently... something they surely won't do with a "free tuition" government program.
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Old 05-18-2015, 06:49 AM
 
Location: Sonoran Desert
29,352 posts, read 39,775,069 times
Reputation: 18791
Quote:
Originally Posted by T-310 View Post
I am willing to bet the bill will never get out of committee.
And you will win that bet. But here's the thing: for once, there is a politician who is thinking about what we can do to improve the lives and well-being of working people in the country instead of the welfare of the defense industry and the corporate executives. A politician committed to educating our youth rather than handing out our hard earned taxes to foreign countries and domestic donors. Sanders may be off in the weeds a bit, but he is a breath of fresh air after decades of being choked by the smoke from the "big cigars".
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Old 05-18-2015, 07:17 AM
 
Location: Barrington
45,866 posts, read 34,067,070 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dechatelet View Post
College is free or very low cost in Europe, but very very few are accepted.

They're not going to waste money on dunderheads. Which would be about 90% of American college students.
About 47% of Finnish students attend vocational school begining at age 15. Children are not tested until age 16. It's not clear to me how, beyond observation, 47% are culled out of university destined programs and placed in vocational schools.

Vocational schools range from domestic/ retail/ food services workers- trades.

Teaching programs are as selective as MIT is in the U.S. Only 10% of applicants make the cut. There are as many teachers in Finland as NYC has, with half as many students. Teachers do not recieve merit pay -they are not judged on how well or poorly their students do.

Formal education does not begin until age 7. Most children are enrolled in public day care in infancy and move onto preschool. Early education focuses on socialization, speech and learning how to learn. Children and their teachers spend many years together. The teachers know their kids, well which may then play into the decision who attends vocational versus university track programs.

93% graduate high school, regardless of vocational or university tract.
Adults with work experience and demonstrated maturity have unlimited opportunities to take classes at no cost to acquire the base to enter university. Vocational school is not a life sentence. It's up to the individual. Fluency in foreign language ( usually English) is one of the many criteria used for university consideration.
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Old 05-18-2015, 07:34 AM
 
Location: Barrington
45,866 posts, read 34,067,070 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Bernie Sanders wants amnesty and effectively open borders.

Bernie Sanders on Immigration


Free education, free health insurance, free food, free rent, free phones,...anyone else see the problem here?
It appears Bernie is against expanding guest worker visas, H1b visas and is an advocate for e- verify.

No fence is high enough nor troops deep enough to deter illegal immigration so long as employers continue to recruit and hire undocumented workers.
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Old 05-18-2015, 07:40 AM
 
Location: Barrington
45,866 posts, read 34,067,070 times
Reputation: 15329
Quote:
Originally Posted by greywar View Post
I'd love to see us do some actual trade schools like this. Its 2015, high school level training is no longer enough.



Maybe the question people here should be asking themselves is....in a increasingly competitive world...can we afford not to?
Vocational training varies country to country. The trades is only a small part of it. Many throughout Europe move into domestic, retail and food services positions after vocational education.

Europe has the same " involuntary part time work" situation as the U.S. The number of low pay, part time positions has been increasing since the late 80's. Underemployment is a global issue.
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Old 05-18-2015, 07:55 AM
 
493 posts, read 310,279 times
Reputation: 162
Default College (undergrad) degree should be FREE

In many European and other 1st world countries, college education is free just like K - 12. Students may need to pay for their own housing and textbooks though. In America, college cost is among the most expensive in the world, and the cost keep raising every year it seems like. Our students and young people today are struggling with huge loan debts when there is no guarantee of finding any jobs in this economy, and many even low-paying jobs; indeed, students who find jobs right after college still must pay their huge debts, or their parents' which isn't easy. Yes, community college is more affordable, and there are "scholarships" and "financial aid" out there, but still not enough and you could talk of tens of thousands of student loans after graduating despite all of this "free" money. Going to college is very expensive, and shouldn't be! Now those who chose to attend private college is different, and graduate school should be charged. Yes, I understand college isn't for everyone and surprisingly despite college being free of charge in many other nations, not all students decide to attend college or pick "crappy" majors.

I believe undergraduate degree should be free of charge for all students just like K - 12 in public schools. However, students must do good in high school to qualify. Public colleges should not be for profit!

Last edited by MX City visiting; 05-18-2015 at 08:03 AM..
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Old 05-18-2015, 07:57 AM
 
Location: Austin Texas
474 posts, read 762,158 times
Reputation: 531
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaten_Drinker View Post
I agree. How about eliminating scholarships for students whose parents can afford to pay their tuition? Scholarships should be for elite students who cannot afford to pay the tuition. I read an article about the kid of rocker Richie Sambora and Heather Locklear having a 4.2 GPA and 11 scholarships to choose from. Those scholarships should be going to a needy kid instead.
You read an article....

Have you applied for a scholarship?

You have to complete a massive form called the FAFSA. It asks for all kinds of data, including family financial assets. Universities typically do NOT award scholarships to children of families with money unless that student is highly desirable and the university wants them.
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