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Old 05-31-2015, 01:08 PM
 
11,058 posts, read 3,731,002 times
Reputation: 5189

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Quote:
Originally Posted by radiolibre99 View Post
Read my post again. There is nothing exceptional in US history. That was my only point. Not that the US is the best nation is the greatest country in the history of the world ever to exist in the world because the world sucks and only the USA can truly be called the best ever because the US is exceptionally unique among all other sucky nations that can't compare because we were blessed by God yada yada yada yada.

You never had a point to make in the first place. You were arguing with a phantom. A misguided belief that if someone inserts some nuance into US history then they're traitors.

who called you traitor? you sound like you have thin skin.

the rest is your opinion and I can see you don't want to debate the "negative" things you brought up about the U.S.A in details......good day.
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Old 05-31-2015, 01:13 PM
 
10,097 posts, read 7,507,384 times
Reputation: 5225
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellion1999 View Post
who called you traitor? you sound like you have thin skin.

the rest is your opinion and I can see you don't want to debate the "negative" things you brought up about the U.S.A in details......good day.
You're acting as though the low points in American history I brought up were somehow erroneous and akin to defaming the US from its rightful position as king of all nations.

This is silly. The US Spanish War was and is still billed by all historians as the US imperialist adventures. Just cause we were better at occupying the island nations than the Spanish doesn't diffuse my argument that the history of the US is still mired in conquest. You just see it as being a more benevolent conquest.

We don't have to debate the details when you've brought up straw man arguments.
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Old 05-31-2015, 01:15 PM
 
20,611 posts, read 12,964,835 times
Reputation: 5904
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellion1999 View Post
part of Oregon and Idaho, back then those states didn't have today's state line.



All Mexico???? buy yourself an atlas..........so you think California, New Mexico, Arizona, Texas, Colorado and Utah are better off today under the government of Mexico and Drug Cartel rule?


you think under Mexican rule those U.S. states would have evolved and have the standard of living they have today that benefits millions of people including the 20 million illegals that escaped Mexican rule?


would you be proud of a country that is run by drug cartels and have no rule of law?
Please read my post again. I said the US should've taken ALL of Mexico, NOT what you said. Sheesh!
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Old 05-31-2015, 01:16 PM
 
10,097 posts, read 7,507,384 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Packard fan View Post
Please read my post again. I said the US should've taken ALL of Mexico, NOT what you said. Sheesh!
He or she has a habit of inserting words or arguments in your posts that you never said.
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Old 05-31-2015, 01:18 PM
 
11,058 posts, read 3,731,002 times
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lets look at some facts:

California and Texas have the best economies in the U.S.A., you have 66 million residents who benefit from those economies and standard of living not counting the ILLEGALS who escaped Mexican rule to be in those 2 states.


you think California and Texas would have the same economies and standard and living under Mexican Rule and the Drug Cartel rule?....you think millions wouldn't be under extreme poverty under NO rule of law?



if the answer is NO, then why feel guilty about the outcome of the American/Mexican war?.....why have a guilt trip?.............Look at the results not the action.


we judge things in life by results.
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Old 05-31-2015, 01:25 PM
 
Location: Oceania
8,623 posts, read 6,227,817 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motion View Post
I know that most countries in the western hemisphere have a similar history as far as the removal of their native peoples(and slavery) but my issue has always been with those Americans who want to romanticize about the U.S having some righteous founding.
Stop everything you are doing, pack your bags and go elsewhere because you will have problems with Americans for the rest of your life. Righteous founding? It's the same as Rome and any other civilization, including American Indians, Africans, Japanese, Russians, Mongols, Moors, whatever.

Veni, Vidi, Vici... I came, I saw, I conquered. Every civilization has done so and it happened several times over millions of years before Europeans came to these shores. Why single out the USA when you can start millions of years ago? You got an axe to grind or are you hating yourself?
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Old 05-31-2015, 01:27 PM
 
11,058 posts, read 3,731,002 times
Reputation: 5189
Quote:
Originally Posted by radiolibre99 View Post
He or she has a habit of inserting words or arguments in your posts that you never said.

I'm a he,....freeradio99.....and this is the first time we ever crossed posts for you to say I have a "habit" of anything.


Quote:
ou're acting as though the low points in American history I brought up were somehow erroneous and akin to defaming the US from its rightful position as king of all nations.

This is silly. The US Spanish War was and is still billed by all historians as the US imperialist adventures. Just cause we were better at occupying the island nations than the Spanish doesn't diffuse my argument that the history of the US is still mired in conquest. You just see it as being a more benevolent conquest.

We don't have to debate the details when you've brought up straw man arguments.
I said debate them in details why are those points "negative"....is that too much too ask? if you refuse or don't want to, that's fine but why have a thin skin about it when I called you on it.


and the Mexican government didn't have imperialistic adventures up north? how is that a "negative" thing when the results are very positive to millions of Americans and millions of Mexicans today?

how is that "negative"?



of course your arguments are intelligent and anyone that challenges that is using straw man arguments.
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Old 05-31-2015, 01:33 PM
 
11,058 posts, read 3,731,002 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Packard fan View Post
Please read my post again. I said the US should've taken ALL of Mexico, NOT what you said. Sheesh!

I read your post and taking over whole populated Mexico would have been unwise.......when I said buy at Altas, it was meant to show you that at the time the population in Mexico south of the border were loyalist to the Mexican government and culture and still are......they would never accept U.S. rule.
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Old 05-31-2015, 01:36 PM
Status: "Nevertheless, America's baseball team -- Roar, Tigers, ROAR!" (set 29 days ago)
 
Location: Nescopeck, Penna. (birthplace)
12,320 posts, read 7,464,777 times
Reputation: 15893
The driving force behind all human progress is the desire for a better life; everything else is simply so much "fallout"; there will be winners and losers, and those unprepared to cope with these events, whether through faults of their own character or simple technical backwardness and inefficient use of available resources. are going to wind up among the latter.

That is what happened those who were brought here in slave ships, and to the American Native peoples, and no amount of hand-wringing or so called "reparations" in the name of collective guilt is going to undo it. We can only offer minor adjustments to some of the legatees still at a disadvantage; that, and to try to recognize the mechanisms, usually involving the corrupt use of power and the misuse of the monopoly on coercion and force by a too-strong central government.

To date, the United States, with its written, but highly-flexible Constitution, its diversity among component states, its early emphasis on common markets, and its system of checks and balances, has demonstrated the strongest capability to fine-tune itself in response to external challenges. That has not come about by accident, and most of those who seek do denigrate it do so only because the free flow of human opinion and commerce continues to prove them wrong.
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Old 05-31-2015, 01:47 PM
 
11,058 posts, read 3,731,002 times
Reputation: 5189
we judge our history "positive" or "negative" by results and who benefits today and that can be debated depending in which side your in.....that is the bottom line.


some say the Civil War was a "negative" part of our history but it ended slavery.....again, look at the results.

Some say fighting WW 2 and the Cold War were "negative" in our history but look at the results and imagine the world if we didn't fight those wars or lost.


to say the American/Mexican war is a "negative" part of our history without debating the details and the outcome and who benefits today of that outcome then why bother coming to this topic.



if you look at the economies and standard of living of today of Texas, California, Utah, Colorado, New Mexico, Arizona, that millions of people benefit including millions of Mexicans that escape Mexican rule and corruption, there is no way that would ever happen under Mexican rule and no way that would happen if the U.S. didn't win the Mexican war and Mexico's president didn't sell those lands to the U.S.A......then the Eastern states today would be really over-populated with Mexicans going that way by the millions escaping Mexican rule.


the results to me is what counts in history......if the actions of our country by the government and people made the lives of millions better and future generations better then its a "positive" thing for me.....of course they are some losers, that's life.
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