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What made America the greatest country on earth was the amount of personal freedom that citizens had, unfortunately that has been slowly taken away over the last 100 years culminating now with a tax against individuals who make a personal decision on purchasing health insurance.
Actually, that's not what made the U.S. one of the greatest counties on earth. What made it one of the greatest countries on earth is that "can do" and "can solve" attitude that Americans had up until conservatives went nuts.
Well maybe if the private sector offered a comfortable living condition like the past, we wouldn't be looking to the government to do something about how difficult it is becoming to make ends meet in the USA.
I agree it's not the governments place to provide much of this stuff to most people. I think it's in the best interest of this nation, however, to have the best quality of life we can - and to foster a private sector which can provide that.
They have, nite they don't. Business leaders also didn't get multi million dollars each and every year either. My how some things change.
Quote:
Originally Posted by neko_mimi
Best quality of life for who? Why should someone else get a better quality of life at the expense of my quality of life?
You feel that way until the shoe is on the other foot. They are always hurray for me, screw u. Just about everyone believes in egoism, the theory of doing things in their own self interest(s).
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Originally Posted by pghquest
Ever think that maybe businesses get away with not offering "comfortable living conditions" because the public has government there to subsidize their way of life?
Perhaps but then they complain about government giving out the hand-outs because it comes out of their pockets they want it both ways: no government assistance, no comfortable living conditions... Well until it effects their bottom line.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtl1
As a conservative, of European descent , I support working people earning a comfortable living and even unionizing as a private sector solution to negotiating with an employer. But people should work and negotiate with their employers. They shouldn't have the government subsidize them (and their employers) with tax payer's money.
I would too but the problem is companies aren't offering them too much because they are worried about the bottom line. Why pay someone $45k when you can pay someone say $30-35k?
It's just free food.
It's just a free place for them to live.
It's just free healthcare.
It's just welfare.
It's just a free phone.
It's just free college.
It's just free internet.
It's just some disaster relief money.
The list just goes on and on. They just don't seem to realize that all these "benefits" add up to huge burdens. Maybe they would have more of an appreciation for it if they saw the government skimming 40% off of the top of every paycheck like I do.
Then surely you quite strongly agree with this point recently made by a spokesman for the Oklahoma Republican Party:
"The Food Stamp Program, administered by the U. S. Department of Agriculture, is proud to be distributing this year the greatest amount of free Meals and Food Stamps ever to 46 million people. Meanwhile, the National Park Service, administered by the U. S. Department of the Interior, asks us "Please Do Not Feed the Animals'. The animals will grow dependent on handouts and will not learn to take car of themselves." Thus ends today's lesson in irony."
Actually, that's not what made the U.S. one of the greatest counties on earth. What made it one of the greatest countries on earth is that "can do" and "can solve" attitude that Americans had up until conservatives went nuts.
So when did conservatives stop people from having a can do attitude?
The segments of society that represent "can do" attitude are business and industry, which is mostly conservatives.
Why are Republicans so quick to want to back endless military spending and wars but don't want to spend a penny to help people in our own country? It's hard to take them seriously about cutting spending when they rub their hands together in glee over the thought of starting wars all over the place.
Congrats on what has to be the most cartoonish starw man of this entire thread. Which Republican, just name one for us, that has said they "don't want to spend a penny to help people in our own country" when it comes to social welfare, or governmental assistance.
Then surely you quite strongly agree with this point recently made by a spokesman for the Oklahoma Republican Party:
"The Food Stamp Program, administered by the U. S. Department of Agriculture, is proud to be distributing this year the greatest amount of free Meals and Food Stamps ever to 46 million people. Meanwhile, the National Park Service, administered by the U. S. Department of the Interior, asks us "Please Do Not Feed the Animals'. The animals will grow dependent on handouts and will not learn to take car of themselves." Thus ends today's lesson in irony."
Food stamps serving 46 million people is proof, in and of iself, that these welfare programs are expanded way beyond just serving the people who truly need the assistance.
Ever think that maybe businesses get away with not offering "comfortable living conditions" because the public has government there to subsidize their way of life?
Or because globalization and automation has shifted jobs to other parts of the world or eliminated them completely.....
Is it really hard to understand the effect of capitalism and efficiency? America was strong mid 20th century due to unions and lack of competition.... Unsurprisingly.... In the 21st century profits and productivity are rising while the wealth ain't trickling down.
Well maybe if the private sector offered a comfortable living condition like the past, we wouldn't be looking to the government to do something about how difficult it is becoming to make ends meet in the USA.
I agree it's not the governments place to provide much of this stuff to most people. I think it's in the best interest of this nation, however, to have the best quality of life we can - and to foster a private sector which can provide that.
The increased amount of regulations and taxes on the private sector businesses just might be why it's getting tougher for the private sector to provide a comforatable living wage like we had in the past. We add tens of thousands of new regulations each and every year, consisting of fees, mandates, and other things which add greatly to the cost of doing business, and this reduces the take home pay for their employees.
Now add the growing third world nations that are inserting themselves into the global market. So in the US we increased the cost of running a business and producing a product, while at the same time third world nations are now able to compete at a fraction of the cost. Our wages and take home pay is going down, because the footprint of third world nations with cheap labor are increasing.
It's just free food.
It's just a free place for them to live.
It's just free healthcare.
It's just welfare.
It's just a free phone.
It's just free college.
It's just free internet.
It's just some disaster relief money.
The list just goes on and on. They just don't seem to realize that all these "benefits" add up to huge burdens. Maybe they would have more of an appreciation for it if they saw the government skimming 40% off of the top of every paycheck like I do.
Since most of the handouts are going to white people, many who will ever be employed again, and mostly have families with dependent children, it is a huge burden. And since most of that group are between 40 to 50 years of age, it is not one that will be going away any time soon. All that stuff is more likely to go to a homeowner who is working a part-time low wage job, or has lost the home, lived off the credit card until the card was cut up, and now is down to nothing.
That person is more likely a former highly-educated white-collar worker who spent his working life in a cubicle than a welder, or a miner or a lifelong welfare bum. All the others have some degree of manual working skills, and they all never expected to live a prosperous life.
An unemployed miner can find temp work as a framer, a concrete layer or something. A street bum knows how to say alive on the streets, but a former suit-wearing corporate drone doesn't have any of those basic skills, and only knows what he knows. His former expertise now grows more obsolete with each passing day, and his competition is 20 years younger, right on top of the technological curve, and willing to work for any wage just to get ahead. They don't have much to lose, as they're all starting out, not looking at the end of their lives as a wage earner.
It is indeed a problem, and it does fall on the shoulders of those who are still stable and are making enough money to live a stable life. But they are voters, too, and citizens. Citizens who need care, as they have no way to make it on their own again without some kind of substantial assistance.
They aren't going to magically disappear, and they're not going away. What they will do is make the same stupid decisions the poor always make, like blowing half a month's food budget in a night out for the family at McDonald's. Like buying a bottle of cheap liquor to kill the tooth pain instead of going to a dentist. Like keeping a kid home because there's no lunch money, and the kid doesn't want to go into the poor-kid line, where the lunch is free.
You can gripe about them until forever, and all your griping won't change a thing. You can pigeon-hole them any way you want- that they are all one color, or speak some other language, or live only in ghettos, and that will change nothing at all, because it's not the truth.
Since you aren't going away either, and won't change your opinions and notions of who is a welfare bum or isn't, don't expect your personal burden to decrease. It's all a dead end until your own thoughts change. If and when they do, you could easily become a part of the solution to these problems, rather than perpetuating them.
No one person can ever come up with all the solutions you desire. Any of them will take the thoughts of many people, all dedicated to finding solutions for each of the things on your list to be solved and changed. They are individual pieces of a puzzle that combines to make up poverty, and none are easy to eliminate.
Eliminating only one won't change anything. It's still poverty, still an identifiable picture, even if it has a little hole in the middle of it. Eliminating 4 out of your list of 8 makes a much bigger hole. Eliminating 6 makes the puzzle picture so incomplete it can't be easy to see any more. Eliminating all 8 would be wiping out poverty.
Or because globalization and automation has shifted jobs to other parts of the world or eliminated them completely.....
Is it really hard to understand the effect of capitalism and efficiency? America was strong mid 20th century due to unions and lack of competition.... Unsurprisingly.... In the 21st century profits and productivity are rising while the wealth ain't trickling down.
After WWII, the only manufacturing sector still standing was in the USA. There was no third world nation manufacturing sector like we have today. We had no comperditor, hell, the rest of the world was either trying to rebuild after the devistaion inflicted by WWII, or they were fighting insurgents within their own coutries and try to create a country from the rubble.
Rememner the phrase used to ridicule cheap, junky products, as being "made in Japan" and later on it was rediculed as being "made in China."
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My how some things change.
, I support working people earning a comfortable living and even unionizing as a private sector solution to negotiating with an employer. But people should work and negotiate with their employers. They shouldn't have the government subsidize them (and their employers) with tax payer's money.
