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I have some friends who are Teamsters warehouse workers here in Washington state. They make about $27/hr with good benefits, and a defined-benefit pension. Amazon non-union warehouse workers average $12/hr for the same thing. I don't know what their benefit package is, but I'm guessing it's Obamacare. Pension...are you kidding me?
Collective bargaining is basic common sense. With your union dues, you are hiring skilled negotiators to get the best deal for the most important economic transaction of your life: your paycheck. Only an idiot would buy a house without a lawyer and other pros in his corner, yet we negotiate pay as a lone worker against a behemoth corporation with an army of lawyers, accountants, and ***holes.
My union local has several lawyers on staff, including one who is an Oxford grad. I pay a lot in dues, but without them I would probably be making those Walmart/Amazon wages.
More likely people want the perceived or actual benefits of private sector union membership without paying union dues.
Public sector unions are a different ball game. It's all about benefits, especially pensions.
If the union is that big of a benefit to the workers at your place of employment, they will freely choose to join and pay the union dues without coercion.
If enough choose not to join the union and it weakens the unions and if the union is right that this would hurt the workers - then the workers will freely choose to rejoin the union and pay the dues.
The union is afraid to make the case to the workers why they are important enough to deserve union dues and afraid for the workers to have the liberty to choose if they join and pay union dues.
Stand with liberty. Make Unions earn their members, not coerce their members.
What I dislike the most about working within a union is that it doesn't matter in terms of my compensation if I work as hard as I possibly can or do just enough to not get fired. My salary is determined by years served and my college degree. Effort and results mean nothing in terms of compensation.
I work in a union shop, and we are admittedly "overpaid" for the work. It's back breaking and extremely long hours, but it's still unskilled manual labor. If it wasn't for the union we would make a small fraction of what we make now. I've only got a few years in so I am not totally in tune with the politics of the job.
An old timer with 35 years was talking to me today and basically telling me if our state becomes a right to work state we are screwed. I know a lot of people think unions are worthless and crooked, but I am wondering if you guys think all states will eventually become right to work, and unions will all disappear? In my own selfishness, I hope not. I do see how people think some blue collar stiff riding a forklift doesn't deserve much, but we can't all be in IT making 6 figures while working remotely from home. If only it were that easy...
Personally, I think it's cyclic. Unions are in the doldrums now in part because they participated in many practices that were unreasonable (for example, even after there were no longer cabooses, trains for a while had to have the staff for one). However, the general practice of employers taking advantage of employees will eventually lead to an upswing in labor unions.
Wages and salaries in the real world are set by the market, i.e., supply and demand.
That's fine for an econ 101 introduction to micro economics but it falls apart real quick in real world applications and analysis. Employers historically have, can, do distort the price of labor through a number of mechanism up and including near monopolistic influence on labor markets.
Additionally, why should companies have the sole and exclusive right to determine the price of their goods and services and workers should not? Without the bargaining power of collective bargaining can workers even attempt to set the price of their labor?
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Unions upset this relationship, which really screws everything up, and it hurts the consumer in the end,
That too is a questionable argument. Workers you seem to forget are also consumers. Higher wages allow those consumers to purchase more goods and services which in turn fuels higher levels of productivity throughout the economy. In short, the real job creators are people who buy stuff!
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because it forces products to sell at a higher price than their true value.
Value isn't some objectively determined figure, the value of a good and service is purely subjective so there is no such thing as "true" value. Value is based upon desire, how bad do I want something and how much am I willing to pay to have it, that's what determines value.
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That's what paying someone more than they are worth, in terms of the labor and skills they provide, does.
The only true determinate of a workers value is based upon acceptable profit margins. I will concede that if all things are equal, the only perceived negative value of a good or service is its price and that price is adversely affected solely by the price, then the price of labor is too high. But, if a profit can still be realized at the current price of labor then the price of labor is not over valued. So the issue then becomes what is an price of labor as a percentage of realizable profit.
I have some friends who are Teamsters warehouse workers here in Washington state. They make about $27/hr with good benefits, and a defined-benefit pension. Amazon non-union warehouse workers average $12/hr for the same thing. I don't know what their benefit package is, but I'm guessing it's Obamacare. Pension...are you kidding me?
Collective bargaining is basic common sense. With your union dues, you are hiring skilled negotiators to get the best deal for the most important economic transaction of your life: your paycheck. Only an idiot would buy a house without a lawyer and other pros in his corner, yet we negotiate pay as a lone worker against a behemoth corporation with an army of lawyers, accountants, and ***holes.
My union local has several lawyers on staff, including one who is an Oxford grad. I pay a lot in dues, but without them I would probably be making those Walmart/Amazon wages.
Union Yes!.
"Yes, but all those teamsters probably beat the crap out of guys down by the docks while Jimmy Hoffa meets with the mobsters in a smoke filled back room. Also, socialism." - The Fox News crowd
"Yes, but all those teamsters probably beat the crap out of guys down by the docks while Jimmy Hoffa meets with the mobsters in a smoke filled back room. Also, socialism." - The Fox News crowd
So you will deny Unions had involvement with organizaed crime?
You obviously did not ever live in Brooklyn, New Jersey or Chicago....
I have some friends who are Teamsters warehouse workers here in Washington state. They make about $27/hr with good benefits, and a defined-benefit pension. Amazon non-union warehouse workers average $12/hr for the same thing. I don't know what their benefit package is, but I'm guessing it's Obamacare. Pension...are you kidding me?
Collective bargaining is basic common sense. With your union dues, you are hiring skilled negotiators to get the best deal for the most important economic transaction of your life: your paycheck. Only an idiot would buy a house without a lawyer and other pros in his corner, yet we negotiate pay as a lone worker against a behemoth corporation with an army of lawyers, accountants, and ***holes.
My union local has several lawyers on staff, including one who is an Oxford grad. I pay a lot in dues, but without them I would probably be making those Walmart/Amazon wages.
Union Yes!.
Unions Yes!- until they no longer have a company to work for
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