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It seems Spanish speakers moving to the U.S. are the only people in the world not trying to learn English.
My inlaws, long gone, came to the U.S. from Eastern Europe in 1950. They managed to work, own property, pay taxes, worship, become citizens, collect SS and go about their business , without understanding or speaking a word of English.
One of the many neighborhoods I grew up in was Greek. The immigrants did not speak English. Second generation was bilingual.
Chicago has been a long time destination for a substantial Polish immigrant population. The immigrants often struggle with English, especially if they were middle aged or older upon immigration.
The younger immigrants tend to be bilingual, upon arrival.
U.S. expats are notorious for not learning the language of the country they reside. They tend to live in isolated communities and socialize amongst themselves. Their children are often educated at " American " schools.
U.S. expats are notorious for not learning the language of the country they reside. They tend to live in isolated communities and socialize amongst themselves. Their children are often educated at " American " schools.
Yet, it appears you give those who choose to immigrate here, a free pass when it comes to not wanting to learn English. Then you complain about American expats not learning the language. Double standard much?
We don't have a defacto national language and various governments are required to provide language sevices. We have a predominant language but that can always change if a free people choose another one. Kinda the beauty of being free, no?
Or, I'm assuming many of you love free markets except when you want bureaucracy to control people like in this situation. Just let the market sort it out. If people need to speak a language to work, they'll learn whatever language that is.
English is the language that binds us all here in the US. Period.
Doubt it? Pay attention when you're out and about. Go shopping at a large department store where the sales clerks are foreign born and all hail from different countries. English is a second language for them. Yet when they communicate with their co-workers, they do so in English.
For example, in one place where I worked, I had as co-workers, a woman from Hungary and one from India. They used to have many conversations---do I even have to tell you what language they conversed in?
My inlaws, long gone, came to the U.S. from Eastern Europe in 1950. They managed to work, own property, pay taxes, worship, become citizens, collect SS and go about their business , without understanding or speaking a word of English.
One of the many neighborhoods I grew up in was Greek. The immigrants did not speak English. Second generation was bilingual.
Chicago has been a long time destination for a substantial Polish immigrant population. The immigrants often struggle with English, especially if they were middle aged or older upon immigration.
The younger immigrants tend to be bilingual, upon arrival.
U.S. expats are notorious for not learning the language of the country they reside. They tend to live in isolated communities and socialize amongst themselves. Their children are often educated at " American " schools.
I too have observed that, for immigrants who are 40-ish and above, even speaking passable English after studying earnestly is extremely hard. Most people can't get to the level. Of course, some try hard and fail, while others don't try at all and fail. It is also difficult to study long hours when you are scrapping at a super low wage job for long hours and then taking public transpiration to go home (cheaper housing is further away from commercial centers where jobs are = sometimes, it involves like a 3 hour roundtrip commute daily).
I think every immigrant needs to make an honest effort to learn English. And that's all we can ask for: sincere effort. Results cannot be guaranteed.
Kids who are, let's say, 13 and younger will pick up English pretty quickly at school and from friends and TV. Within a couple of years, they typically can speak pretty good English and eventually come close to, or achieve, speaking perfect English.
I have noticed that many immigrants who cannot speak English to save their life, can write at the native level. Like perfect English. Like better than many CD posters who are anti-immigration (irony).
If it's so easy to learn another language when you are older, us Americans should not be so monolingual. I like how our countrymen would go to another country and just start speaking English like it's the magical master language. And we are amazed when the natives don't understand us. "No English? What kind of sorry country is this? We can buy people like you!!"
I mean, yeah. If you move to any country, it's a good idea to speak the language that at least half the people speak so you can effectively communicate. I don't think it necessarily needs to be a prerequisite, but it's a good idea for their own sake really. I've worked with people who don't speak very good English, and even that is tough, and not just on me.
American's are very self important, and I'm not saying that in a way that doesn't include me at all because I've done it too, but whenever we run into someone who doesn't speak our language, we get offended by how frustrating it is for us. What about them? They can't talk to anyone except the people who were the plane with them when they got here. That's gotta be lonely and difficult. Have some sympathy.
So I think you should always put an effort into learning the language of the area you're going to. Not necessarily 'the countries language.' I know in a lot of European countries there's a French side and a German side or whatever, so if you move to the Netherlands and live in the French speaking side, you probably don't need German. But they probably have it. Pretty much everywhere besides the US and Canada minus Quebec speak multiple languages.
But yeah, overall it's best to learn the language that will help you communicate the most. I don't think it needs to be a requirement, but it should be encouraged.
Yeah, that pretty much covers it. Of course people coming to America should learn English. But Americans, who likely speak no other language than English, need to show a little humility. They also need to recognize just how hard it is to learn a foreign language to the point of fluency, especially as an adult.
English is the language that binds us all here in the US. Period.
Doubt it? Pay attention when you're out and about. Go shopping at a large department store where the sales clerks are foreign born and all hail from different countries. English is a second language for them. Yet when they communicate with their co-workers, they do so in English.
For example, in one place where I worked, I had as co-workers, a woman from Hungary and one from India. They used to have many conversations---do I even have to tell you what language they conversed in?
Ok. That's great. The market led them to learn English. I've also shopped places in the U.S. where nobody spoke any English and I had to use gestures. That's how my ancestors were when they arrived, too.
I have no problem with either because this is a free country and I don't want you big government lovers building all sorts of bureaucracy to make people behave a certain way. You're not changing my mind on this because I'm a real American who cherishes freedom for all so long as they're not hurting anyone else.
And how people choose to talk isn't hurting anyone but themselves if they don't want to make themselves more competitive in the marketplace for a job, or have found a way to get by without learning another language - like some of my ancestors did.
Their children will speak English; just be patient.
I got reemed out as a racist on the Orlando forum for saying this...but I don't think people who move here should be speaking only different tongues and waving flags of different nations or islands and having parades. I don't speak Hispanic and I'm getting tired of hearing it everywhere I go. What nation am I in now?
Well it is only Americans that know one and only one language. We should take the time to learn at least one more. I was recently in Barcelona and had no problem communicating with natives because they spoke both Spanish and English. And maybe others languages too.
It already is a requirement that one know passable English in order to become a naturalized citizen. Some elderly are excluded, however. I don't care what flag ones chooses to fly or culture they choose to practice on their own private property and I don't hold Americans living abroad at any different standards either.
There are also a lot of foreigners here who never became American citizens, but have lived here for decades.
One solution is to make English language ability a part of the Immigration standards. There are International language testing systems that rate an applicant on their reading, writing, and speaking abilities. Make this a basic requirement of the Immigration application process, and have the applicant PAY for the testing, in their own country. Canada does this as a matter of basic testing for all Immigrants.
Instead of saying that people should learn English when they get to America, why not test them before they are accepted ? Doesn't that make more sense ? By doing so, the USA would get a better type of applicant, one who has all ready prepared themselves to succeed in America ? Language ability is the basis for making a better life in a new country, I think .
I got reemed out as a racist on the Orlando forum for saying this...but I don't think people who move here should be speaking only different tongues and waving flags of different nations or islands and having parades. I don't speak Hispanic and I'm getting tired of hearing it everywhere I go. What nation am I in now?
It is economically wise for them to learn English. If they moved here for opportunity and a better life, why WOULDN'T they try to learn it?
And how is it "racist"? People from Europe are predominantly white, and Hispanics are often considered "white" (Zimmerman), a lot of Latinos are white, so again, how is it racist? Do people even know what that word means anymore?
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