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Bluefly, just don't even waste your time anymore with these idiots. They can't even cite any useful sources for their claims, let alone any rational counter arguments vs trying to find pointless holes in what you've typed. You're correct that most people on here want to deduce things down into political, societal based argument as opposed to just looking at raw scientific evidence, because that was the way this issue was framed to them by their politicians and media. I know plenty of people that aren't liberal that believe in climate change, but apparently that's a unicorn that doesn't exist to posters here. The good news is most of them will be dead soon in the next 20-30 years, and so will their backwards thought processes. :]
I know, but there are others who read this. It's obvious, with enough back and forth, which side has the facts and reason (the scientific side) and which side is just desperately lashing out with Google searches, trying to find any headline (they never read the articles they post) that sounds like the silver bullet to bring the entire scientific community down (the political side).
I mean, look at these arguments they've made that have long been known and/or refuted by researchers: it used to be warmer, the climate always changes, there's ice in Canada... These are the arguments of people who don't have even the most basic clue about this field.
But such misinformed people are legion, particularly with the rise of political propaganda media. I like to think that when they fade away from these discussions (as they always do after an inevitable ad hominem attack on me), deep below an ego that will never concede defeat regardless of the evidence against them, there's a part of themselves that looks at science's refutation of their baseless claims and thinks, "Huh."
What does this have to do with global warming? At the end of the last glacial period the total human population was less than one million, so I guess we barely made it.
Maybe it's time the dumbest and least adapted humans are taken out then. I have complete confidence my descendents will find a way to survive and thrive in a warmer world. 7 billion is too many.
Let`s stop pretending computers available today and the climate models they use have the ability to accurately represent the climate.
Cloud cover has a huge effect on climate, but cloud cover is poorly understood and presently impossible to correctly quantify in computer models, so it really is a lot of guess work.
But studies have shown that if we cripple the USA with economy busting, draconian greenhouse gas and carbon reduction laws and regulations, we could reduce global temps by 0.01 degree by the end of this century.
"Deniers" is a politically oriented term that AGW alarmists constantly use to try to insult, denigrate and de-legitimize people who disagree with them for the purpose of trying to stifle discussion and the expression of dissenting viewpoints on this topic.
The term “deniers” is what people who have denied the holocaust are commonly referred to – as in “holocaust deniers”. By using this term, the AGW alarmists are collectively trying to associate people who have doubts and concerns about this alarmist movement with Adolph Hitler and his murderous campaign against the Jews.
Each and every time they do this, they are invoking Godwin's law, which states that if a discussion goes on long enough, it will eventually devolve to a point where comparisons to the Nazis are made, and whoever invoked the Nazis reference automatically loses whatever debate was in progress.
Since the common leftist name-calling slurs, including "Racist," "Bigot," "Homophobe," "Sexist," and "Misogynist" are clearly out of place here, they had to dig down deep to come up with an insult that was at least as vile and hateful as these other appellations are. The comparison with Hitler and the Nazis is what they have collectively agreed upon.
So these are the tactics that the left has devolved to here.
Meanwhile, those same people deny any science that threatens their catastrophic man-made global warming hoax.
Meanwhile, those same people deny any science that threatens their catastrophic man-made global warming hoax.
But there's yet to emerge enough legitimate science to challenge what every national science organization has concluded based on thousands upon thousands of studies: Office of Planning and Research - List of Organizations
These scientific organizations periodically review the literature on topics for which they have a position and, if valid new research has emerged, they adjust their conclusion. That's how science works.
As of now, the evidence clearly shows we are warming and it is due to humans. To deny that is, quite literally, to be a denier. It's not a pejorative; it's just a way of describing people who deny the scientific synthesis of data.
"Deniers" is a politically oriented term that AGW alarmists constantly use to try to insult, denigrate and de-legitimize people who disagree with them for the purpose of trying to stifle discussion and the expression of dissenting viewpoints on this topic.
The term “deniers” is what people who have denied the holocaust are commonly referred to – as in “holocaust deniers”. By using this term, the AGW alarmists are collectively trying to associate people who have doubts and concerns about this alarmist movement with Adolph Hitler and his murderous campaign against the Jews.
Each and every time they do this, they are invoking Godwin's law, which states that if a discussion goes on long enough, it will eventually devolve to a point where comparisons to the Nazis are made, and whoever invoked the Nazis reference automatically loses whatever debate was in progress.
Since the common leftist name-calling slurs, including "Racist," "Bigot," "Homophobe," "Sexist," and "Misogynist" are clearly out of place here, they had to dig down deep to come up with an insult that was at least as vile and hateful as these other appellations are. The comparison with Hitler and the Nazis is what they have collectively agreed upon.
So these are the tactics that the left has devolved to here.
As a sociological phenomenon it is interesting to watch because they are so predictable. They really do have a limited inventory of tools and techniques that they use. Mostly they rely on parrot like repetition till people wear out, die of boredom or run away screaming. I guess it goes along with being an automaton.
The amount of radiation from the sun coming in versus the amount of radiation going back out. It's physics.
But we're not coming out of an Ice Age. The peak of this Holocene Interglacial period was about 8000 years ago and the earth had been on a long slow cooling trend - until the last 100 years or so.
The earth has been warming ever since the end of the last great ice age , with one exception that I know of. Never heard of The Little Ice Age that began roughly late 13th century and ended roughly mid 19th century?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceist
Where do you think the earth currently is in the Milankovitch orbital cycles? Not in a warming phase.
What is your source for this?
I've heard folks from your side claim that the Milankovich cycle is irrelevant because over time all those eccentricities have been smoothed out. I have also heard your side claim that th LIA was a local event of limited impact (kinda like those last few extra freezing winters east of the Mississippi) having little if any worldwide climate effect.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceist
Has there been more radiation from the sun coming into the earth's systems in the past 100 years? No.
Has the sun been increasing it's total solar irradiance over the last 100 years? No.
Says who? Do you think the sun's radiant output never fluctuates? You would be wrong. Why do you think the LIA ended? Or the last great ice age, for that matter? It is the sun itself that causes weather which in turn creates climate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceist
Is there less radiation going back out into space than radiation coming in? Yes. (It's measured by satellites)
So what is causing less radiation to escape back into space? Hmmm....what could it be?
And if the sun is in a cooling cycle, so what? Less solar input, therefore cooling occurs. Or all that CO2 keeps the planet mild when it should be headed back into another major ice age.
But there's yet to emerge enough legitimate science to challenge what every national science organization has concluded based on thousands upon thousands of studies: Office of Planning and Research - List of Organizations
These scientific organizations periodically review the literature on topics for which they have a position and, if valid new research has emerged, they adjust their conclusion. That's how science works.
As of now, the evidence clearly shows we are warming and it is due to humans. To deny that is, quite literally, to be a denier. It's not a pejorative; it's just a way of describing people who deny the scientific synthesis of data.
Non thinking drone response here folks. You are a denier because you question the knowledge of the "authorities" on AGW. Like I said, they don't know anything for sure, they just don't. For them to say so is a damn lie.
As a sociological phenomenon it is interesting to watch because they are so predictable. They really do have a limited inventory of tools and techniques that they use. Mostly they rely on parrot like repetition till people wear out, die of boredom or run away screaming. I guess it goes along with being an automaton.
Paid automatons. With OFA money from taxpayers. Though some are using their warming grant money from taxpayers.
It's all leechery in search of more loot.
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