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A better choice with quicker results would be the targeting of gangs and drug sales.
Unfortunately no one is ready to address the largest root source of violence upstream of gun crime.
Gun laws after a point are like trimming the tops of weeds and expecting them to die. You have to reach down and pull out the roots. Removing guns is the same strategy a parent might use when harmful objects are put out of reach. what works for toddlers is not applicable to criminals, as are gun laws piled high and deep with zero impact on crime.
It is a shame that the agenda following sensational crime is to pass more legislation that has zero bearing on the safety of citizens. Lives are being sacrificed by anti gun activists and left wing democrats who tolerate killing fields in places like newark and chicago to achieve a theoretical goal of banning all firearms.
I'll admit, I'm definitely a gun guy. I've owned dozens over the years. For the longest time, I've been against any form of gun control. I still pretty much am against gun control.
That being said, I think that... If all gun and ammo sales were banned and all guns had to be turned in, crime would increase for a short time (because only the criminals would have guns and citizens couldn't defend themselves), then plummet after a few years (maybe 5-10). If law abiding citizens do not own guns, cannot purchase guns. and cannot purchase ammo or any reloading supplies, that prevents criminals from stealing guns, and also prevents them from getting their girlfriend or whoever else can pass a background check to buy them. Even if the thugs have a gun, they will eventually run out of ammo (or run out of luck by being caught by the cops). There will still be guns out there, but at least 75% of the crimes caused by guns will be eliminated.
The likelihood of a complete gun ban is slim to none, but it's probably the only thing that will help with gun crime in the country.
Now I'm not saying this is at all a good idea, these are just my thoughts. I'm sure I'm forgetting some things.
yes you are forgetting a lot. it sounds good to eliminate guns, but the knowledge of how to build them doesnt go away, unless you plan on eliminating several million people that have such knowledge, and do so for several years to make sure they dont pass along that knowledge.
second this cannot be done in one country, but rather would have to be done world wide, including eliminating all civilian and military firearms completely, not possible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lepoisson
The black market does exist, but the majority of the crimes committed using firearms probably didn't come from the black market. They were probably bought legally or stolen from someone who bought it legally.
not correct. the black market is where most criminals get their guns. they cant walk into a gun store and buy them, and they might steal a few, but then they would turn around and sell those guns, and again they cant go into a pawn shop to sell the guns, so they have to sell them to fellow criminals, again on the black market.
I'll admit, I'm definitely a gun guy. I've owned dozens over the years. For the longest time, I've been against any form of gun control. I still pretty much am against gun control.
That being said, I think that... If all gun and ammo sales were banned and all guns had to be turned in, crime would increase for a short time (because only the criminals would have guns and citizens couldn't defend themselves), then plummet after a few years (maybe 5-10). If law abiding citizens do not own guns, cannot purchase guns. and cannot purchase ammo or any reloading supplies, that prevents criminals from stealing guns, and also prevents them from getting their girlfriend or whoever else can pass a background check to buy them. Even if the thugs have a gun, they will eventually run out of ammo (or run out of luck by being caught by the cops). There will still be guns out there, but at least 75% of the crimes caused by guns will be eliminated.
The likelihood of a complete gun ban is slim to none, but it's probably the only thing that will help with gun crime in the country.
Now I'm not saying this is at all a good idea, these are just my thoughts. I'm sure I'm forgetting some things.
Swell idea, but how do you propose getting the criminals to turn in their guns and ammo? And you don't think there will be a black market for ammunition if it is banned?
Swell idea, but how do you propose getting the criminals to turn in their guns and ammo? And you don't think there will be a black market for ammunition if it is banned?
That's the issue. They won't turn in anything. It will take 5-10 years (if not more) of police catching people with illegal firearms, then confiscating them.
I'm sure criminals who REALLY want a gun would be able to get one, but the common thug who wants to rob the local 7-11 won't have those kinds of connections.
Fully automatic firearms are strictly controlled. But you mentioned a black market. Why don't more criminals use fully automatic firearms when committing crimes? My guess is that because they are strictly controlled. Sure, if you were the member of some kind of terrorist group, you could probably have one smuggled in, but common folk won't have that kind of connection.
But then there's still the problem of people (including myself) not fully trusting the government.
Like I said, this was just a thought.
All of these 10rnd limits, magazine bags, assault weapon bans won't make a hill of beans difference.
That's the issue. They won't turn in anything. It will take 5-10 years (if not more) of police catching people with illegal firearms, then confiscating them.
I'm sure criminals who REALLY want a gun would be able to get one, but the common thug who wants to rob the local 7-11 won't have those kinds of connections.
Fully automatic firearms are strictly controlled. But you mentioned a black market. Why don't more criminals use fully automatic firearms when committing crimes? My guess is that because they are strictly controlled. Sure, if you were the member of some kind of terrorist group, you could probably have one smuggled in, but common folk won't have that kind of connection.
But then there's still the problem of people (including myself) not fully trusting the government.
Like I said, this was just a thought.
All of these 10rnd limits, magazine bags, assault weapon bans won't make a hill of beans difference.
the black market would be able to supply criminals with pretty much all the weapons they want.
as to why criminals dont use automatic weapons when committing robbery, do you think that one good reason is that an automatic weapon is generally NOT concealable? if you were to commit armed robbery, would you rather use a thompson sub machine gun, like this one;
or the colt 1911 pistol, like this one;
personally i would go with the colt since i can conceal it.
You sound just like the ignorant anti gun nuts. GUNS don't cause crime, your fantasy that banning them will ever cause a drop in crime is just that - fantasy. Do you think there was no violent crime before guns were invented? Of course not.
Is this their new tactic? Claim to be a gun owner and supporter of the 2nd amendment, and then in the next breath support bans?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lepoisson
I'll admit, I'm definitely a gun guy. I've owned dozens over the years. For the longest time, I've been against any form of gun control. I still pretty much am against gun control.
That being said, I think that... If all gun and ammo sales were banned and all guns had to be turned in, crime would increase for a short time (because only the criminals would have guns and citizens couldn't defend themselves), then plummet after a few years (maybe 5-10). If law abiding citizens do not own guns, cannot purchase guns. and cannot purchase ammo or any reloading supplies, that prevents criminals from stealing guns, and also prevents them from getting their girlfriend or whoever else can pass a background check to buy them. Even if the thugs have a gun, they will eventually run out of ammo (or run out of luck by being caught by the cops). There will still be guns out there, but at least 75% of the crimes caused by guns will be eliminated.
The likelihood of a complete gun ban is slim to none, but it's probably the only thing that will help with gun crime in the country.
Now I'm not saying this is at all a good idea, these are just my thoughts. I'm sure I'm forgetting some things.
black market guns will sky rocket. they will walk right through the Mexican American border..
I'll admit, I'm definitely a gun guy. I've owned dozens over the years. For the longest time, I've been against any form of gun control. I still pretty much am against gun control.
That being said, I think that... If all gun and ammo sales were banned and all guns had to be turned in, crime would increase for a short time (because only the criminals would have guns and citizens couldn't defend themselves), then plummet after a few years (maybe 5-10). If law abiding citizens do not own guns, cannot purchase guns. and cannot purchase ammo or any reloading supplies, that prevents criminals from stealing guns, and also prevents them from getting their girlfriend or whoever else can pass a background check to buy them. Even if the thugs have a gun, they will eventually run out of ammo (or run out of luck by being caught by the cops). There will still be guns out there, but at least 75% of the crimes caused by guns will be eliminated.
The likelihood of a complete gun ban is slim to none, but it's probably the only thing that will help with gun crime in the country.
Now I'm not saying this is at all a good idea, these are just my thoughts. I'm sure I'm forgetting some things.
SO for those 5-10 years as the gun and ammo well runs dry How many people will die at the hands of criminals who by definition Do Not care about laws to begin with?
Imagine being a victim, confronted by a gun wielding thug who holds your life in his trigger finger and all you can do is pray he lets you live or that the police get their quick so they can tazer or mace the guy since the cops won't have guns either.
As others have pointed out criminals will find a way with bombs, knives, clubs.... Imagine a machete wielding maniac forcing his way onto a school bus, he wouldn't need a gun to destroy lives.
Imagine a cop or a ordinary citizen being confronted by a group of as little as 3 thugs with clubs. A single gun in the hands of a good guy or gal is a great equalizer.
I'll admit, I'm definitely a gun guy. I've owned dozens over the years. For the longest time, I've been against any form of gun control. I still pretty much am against gun control.
That being said, I think that... If all gun and ammo sales were banned and all guns had to be turned in, crime would increase for a short time (because only the criminals would have guns and citizens couldn't defend themselves), then plummet after a few years (maybe 5-10). If law abiding citizens do not own guns, cannot purchase guns. and cannot purchase ammo or any reloading supplies, that prevents criminals from stealing guns, and also prevents them from getting their girlfriend or whoever else can pass a background check to buy them. Even if the thugs have a gun, they will eventually run out of ammo (or run out of luck by being caught by the cops). There will still be guns out there, but at least 75% of the crimes caused by guns will be eliminated.
The likelihood of a complete gun ban is slim to none, but it's probably the only thing that will help with gun crime in the country.
Now I'm not saying this is at all a good idea, these are just my thoughts. I'm sure I'm forgetting some things.
Yup. It's not a good idea.
And what you're forgetting about is the 2nd Amendment.
You sound just like the ignorant anti gun nuts. GUNS don't cause crime, your fantasy that banning them will ever cause a drop in crime is just that - fantasy. Do you think there was no violent crime before guns were invented? Of course not.
Is this their new tactic? Claim to be a gun owner and supporter of the 2nd amendment, and then in the next breath support bans?
I've been a gun owner all my life. My Glock 19 is right beside me as we speak. But I was just thinking how ridiculous it is today that I have to own and carry a gun for protection. I could understand if I lived in Mexico, but I live in a 1st world country. I never felt the need to own a gun when I lived in France or Germany.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cape Cod Todd
SO for those 5-10 years as the gun and ammo well runs dry How many people will die at the hands of criminals who by definition Do Not care about laws to begin with?
Imagine being a victim, confronted by a gun wielding thug who holds your life in his trigger finger and all you can do is pray he lets you live or that the police get their quick so they can tazer or mace the guy since the cops won't have guns either.
As others have pointed out criminals will find a way with bombs, knives, clubs.... Imagine a machete wielding maniac forcing his way onto a school bus, he wouldn't need a gun to destroy lives.
Imagine a cop or a ordinary citizen being confronted by a group of as little as 3 thugs with clubs. A single gun in the hands of a good guy or gal is a great equalizer.
I understand where you're coming from, but how often do we here about someone was blown up, stabbed, clubbed to death, compared to someone who was shot. I live in Kansas City, I guarantee someone is being shot or someone is shooting at someone as we speak.
Yes, the guns really aren't the problem, the person holding the gun is. However, it's a lot easier when the person doesn't have the gun at all.
I'd love to make it so that only good guys could have guns, but I don't see an effective way to do this. If you solve poverty and lack of education, that would solve the crime problem, but once again, I don't see this ever happening.
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