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I didn't read this thread other than it's heading. .
For years people against gun ownership by private citizens, have come up against a brick wall.
If control is what they want, then perhaps targeting ammunition is the way to go.
That could put a stop to gun ownership if ammunition were curtailed.
If one reads the 2nd amendment, no where does it mention ammunition, it only states the right of the people to bear arms shall not be infringed.
In that statement, I wonder just what is considered arms.
No kind of weapons were mentioned in the amendment.
I guess guns, knives, cannons, hand grenades are all accepted arms.
Interesting process the state of California is taking on.
I"m sure someone will chime in and say that not supplying ammunition is infringement.
I think the founders never considered the lack of ammunition as an infringement.
In fact, I would hazard a guess ammunition never came up when discussing the 2nd amendment.
What they were concerned with(according to some) is that arms could not be taken away from people, no mention of ammunition.
I would bet the farm, those working on this bill in California, will sight this obvious omission in the 2ndamendment, to further their cause.
This should get interesting.
Bob.
If I was stupid enough to live in California I would get around those ridiculous laws by reloading my own ammunition. I can crank out hundreds of rounds in a single afternoon.
I myself am completely for this type of approach. I am a firm believer that states have the total right to do this sort of thing. I hate what the 14th amendment has become. I just can't stand this sort of thing happening at the FEDERAL Level of Government. After all gun control might make more sense in lets say California or Illinois then Texas or Alaska. As far as I am concerned you can take just about any idea you want and implement it at the state level. Regulate this regulate that, gun control, welfare, social security, you name it. The only thing I would add to it is that the state in no way can get help from the Federal Government. So that these programs can really be tested. If the state can't make them work within their state budgets, or if state taxes go to high, or regulations get to steep. The people and businesses in that state will start to move out and the programs will start to fail. And then we can have an honest talk based of factual numbers (and not spun theoretical or cultural reports or ideas) on a program or a program structure will or won't work.
When these programs are done at the FEDERAL Level they don't have to be self supported they can be propped up with tax money indefinitely. Nor can you escape them cause they are coast to coast. So they are never truly tested.
Once again, show me exactly where in the 2nd amendment "ammunition" is stated.
This issue is bound to come up in any legislation having to do with gun control.
If it isn't clearly stated, and is an assumption, that will be the argument.
Assumption is not fact, it is an idea that something exist, but that does not make it so.
I can assume I am going to own a Corvette C7, but unless I dole out the big bucks, and sign a legal document showing ownership, it becomes an assumption.
The 2nd amendment mentions arms, but nowhere does it mention ammunition.
Ammunition is an assumed fact of the amendment, but unless stated in the legal document, it just isn't enforceable .
Perhaps had the founders included "the right to bear arms, and ammunition, shall not be infringed", the rights would be protected under the constitution, but that is not the way the amendment was written , and ratified.
You can bet those on the side of gun control in the California legislature will argue this point to the hilt.
Assuming, and fact are two entirely different things.
I believe this case will go forward in the legislature, and may well be passed.
If it is passed, and becomes law, you can bet other forms of ammunition will also be questioned.
I believe this is just the beginning.
Many laws and policies throughout the country, got their start in California.
There is an old saying, 'As California goes, so goes the nation".
Regardless of how others in the country view California, it is the leader in how the rest of the country performs.
One very good example of that is in auto emissions.
Started in California, and now is practiced not only in this country, but world wide.
Too those of you who don't think California wheels clout in this world, you best read up on history.
Hi Packard, the thing is if a law abiding person refuses to submit, they become a criminal in the eyes of the state. Get your house robbed and the robber drops your hi cap mag, cops find it and arrest YOU!
I just don't understand the CA mindset. They seem to prefer only criminals have gns, and this apparently is a ballot iniciative, so the People will vote to slit their own throats. And freedom dies to a thousand cheers.
I stay east of the Colorado river. But my rights as an American should not stop there. Why should I be an upstanding citizen and pillar of the community in AZ, but were I to walk across to the other side of the bridge be considered a multi count felon by carrying the same legal firearm.
CA must be stopped.
So given your two statements; it is you who wish to behave like a tyrannical dictator.
What about States rights as afforded by the same constitution that affords you the 2nd amendment? Only some parts of that document give you moral imperatives and your ethical underpinnings? Why is that gun thing is so freak'n important to you that you seem willing to overlook the sacrificing of the rest of the document that's already happened before your very eyes without even a whimper.
It strikes me oxymoronic in the extreme that so many important rights and freedoms have already gone by the wayside, while the very amendments supposedly crafted to prevent that, has now become a 'cause-celebre' all it's own while doing nothing whatsoever by way of it's original intent.
You now don't give a rip about protecting your country, but are instead now willing to bash each other over the head about the perceived loss of the right of self defence from YOUR OWN FELLOW CITIZENS! Cripes ahmighty, it beggars the imagination how you people can go on about this nonsense.
This whole thing is about the UN agenda 21. gun removal from the citizens .
Look how the country is being flooded with illegals and business is being driven out .
How are your gun rights impacted if a store does an instant background check when you buy ammunition? They aren't keeping records of what you bought, they aren't making you wait to get it, they aren't limiting how much you can buy. People have to show their ID to buy alcohol or cigarettes, but this is violating your 2nd amendment rights?
Location: When you take flak it means you are on target
7,646 posts, read 9,944,809 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan
So given your two statements; it is you who wish to behave like a tyrannical dictator.
What about States rights as afforded by the same constitution that affords you the 2nd amendment? Only some parts of that document give you moral imperatives and your ethical underpinnings? Why is that gun thing is so freak'n important to you that you seem willing to overlook the sacrificing of the rest of the document that's already happened before your very eyes without even a whimper.
It strikes me oxymoronic in the extreme that so many important rights and freedoms have already gone by the wayside, while the very amendments supposedly crafted to prevent that, has now become a 'cause-celebre' all it's own while doing nothing whatsoever by way of it's original intent.
You now don't give a rip about protecting your country, but are instead now willing to bash each other over the head about the perceived loss of the right of self defence from YOUR OWN FELLOW CITIZENS! Cripes ahmighty, it beggars the imagination how you people can go on about this nonsense.
You're fiddling while Rome is burning.
Not a tyrannical dictator, a patriotic citizen.
We have a Constitution to stop overstepping by govt, State or Federal.
Protecting the country? We are protecting it from those who would destroy it from within.
The right to self defense and defense of home and business supersceeds State decrees.
Once again, show me exactly where in the 2nd amendment "ammunition" is stated.
Haven't you been embarrassed enough on that one yet?
Ammunition is an integral component of the firearm.
It won't function without it; therefore ammo is part of the weapon.
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