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I have to wonder why people would cling to a religion that tells them they're going to hell.
My mom was divorced and remarried and that meant she was condemned in the eyes of the catholic church. She took us to church until the day my brother looked at her and said that he didn't want to go to a church that condemned his mother to hell. It makes no sense to cling to a religion that condemns you or those you love. IF you truly believe that THAT is THE true religion then you're damned anyway. Far better to find one that doesn't condemn you like my mother did.
I'll stand corrected. I thought the Mormons excommunicated them like the Catholic church did my mother for divorcing and remarrying. Still why stay in a religion that tells you your lifestyle is sinful if you don't plan on changing your lifestyle? My mother was not going to go back to my father (who was abusive largely due to untreated bi-polar disorder) so she left the Catholic church behind and converted to Baptist. That seems the logical thing to do when one religion openly denounces your lifestyle.
I'll stand corrected. I thought the Mormons excommunicated them like the Catholic church did my mother for divorcing and remarrying.
They do. Well, that is, unless they are gay and celibate, in which case they may remain members of the Church in good standing. But Mormons don't believe that excommunicating someone means they're going to Hell. Mormons pretty much believe that the vast, vast majority of mankind will actually end up in Heaven.
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Still why stay in a religion that tells you your lifestyle is sinful if you don't plan on changing your lifestyle? My mother was not going to go back to my father (who was abusive largely due to untreated bi-polar disorder) so she left the Catholic church behind and converted to Baptist. That seems the logical thing to do when one religion openly denounces your lifestyle.
I'm with you there. To me, if I was a lesbian and didn't plan to remain celibate for the rest of my life, I can't imagine remaining LDS.
I stand corrected. I thought they were excommunicated the way divorcee's were from the Catholic church. Still, why stay with a religion that tells you that your lifestyle is sinful if you don't plan on changing the lifestyle? Why fight for acceptance in one particular religion? Why not find one that already accepts you?
My mother could not find forgiveness in the Catholic church so she changed religions to one that offered her forgiveness. It doesn't make sense to expect a religion to change to your liking.
Well excommunication is a bit different in lds theology.So is 'hell'.Mormons believe in three levels of heaven or 'kingdoms of glory' and 'outer darkness' which is essentially hell but almost no one ends up there.We end up on the level and with the people we would be most comfortable with......some of us lds are slackers and don't even aspire to the top level,we're content to spend eternity down a level or two with our friends.
The point of this thread however is that if someones children aspire to the 'top tier', the church shouldn't be throwing roadblocks in their way based on one of the parents actions and they generally don't unless your parents engage in polygamy or gay relationships.
Read their rules it tells you otherwise......this is a sign to find one that will. I don't need some church bending their ways for me. Jesus already did that!
Sometimes a teenager from a non-member family will desire to join the church and if their parents give permission they are allowed.Some parents who aren't religious don't object if their children are.Sometimes a parent in the church will decide that they no longer believe in God,or that the baptists or hindus have it right but don't force that belief on their 16 and 17yo sons that were raised in the church and continue to allow them to 'stay the course'.
A lot of parents of converts wouldn't be accepted now for a variety of reasons.If I were 16 and my 'straight' parents have been living together,unmarried,since 1974 I could join the church with their consent.They couldn't however join the church themselves unless they got married,[and quit smoking,drinking,etc].They could however come to church with me if they desired and their lifestyle would have no bearing upon my status or advancement within the church.I could live with them until I went on a mission,I wouldn't have an obligation to renounce their lifestyle of 'living in sin'.I would be treated as any other young mormon,judged on my actions, not my parents.
Until last week a 16yo living with his lesbian non-member mom and her girlfriend would have been treated the same way.....now they won't....how does this make sense???
I still don't understand how they are going to handle things when Dad leaves Mom for Steve but Mom is still a member of the church??They are going to tell the mother of an 8yo that her son can't be baptized for ten more years even though hes still attending church with her every sunday because her husband left her for another man while it would have no impact on the kid if dad left mom for another woman?
Church leaders made some statement about doing this so the kids can mature and consider the impact that gay relationships have on 'family temple sealings',which are important to the church, but plenty of other things impact that too.If your dad leaves your mom for the girl next door or the boy next door or joins the church of scientology that ceremony isn't going to happen and only one of them impacts your baptism,ability to go on a mission,etc.
I think if one knows the Mormon church there are other things directed at non-gay people, that are just as easy to be excommunicated for. So gays don't need to feel so "special" they are not being picked on.
I can understand a patriarchal organization of adulterous males are frightened by ANY of the flock that does not submit to complete obedience to the "Father Knows Best" tyranny but what I cannot understand is why ANY person with more than three functioning brain cells would ever want to be a Mormon. I can see why some weak men are literally enamored with the child rape is acceptable policies of the Mormon elders but why would any woman tolerate it?
I think the victims of this evil cult should be offered deprogramming and the current male elders a long drop on a short rope.
This sure sounds like hate speech. I'm surprised it's allowed to stand.
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Originally Posted by tinytrump
well Jesus did--
Yes, and Jesus said, "go and don't do that any more."
The problem with the religiosity we see in denominations/churches is that it's the church (the religion)that is being worshiped, not God, and organized religion is a way to maintain control over people.
It's not the church or denomination that saves the soul.
I think if one knows the Mormon church there are other things directed at non-gay people, that are just as easy to be excommunicated for. So gays don't need to feel so "special" they are not being picked on.
Well I spend several hours most Sundays at my local lds meetinghouse so i'm pretty familiar with what goes on there and what things are easy to get excommunicated for.
I never voiced any objection to the policy stating that members who enter into gay marriages face excommunication.Adults know the rules and the consequences.My problem is penalizing their children and a parent who hasn't broken any rules.
Under the new policy if I have 3 minor children and my wife divorces me and marries her girlfriend MY children are no longer eligible for baptism even if they attend church with me weekly,even though i'm still a member in good standing,and even if my ex-wife doesn't object to their being baptized.....that is unfair,it punishes people who haven't done anything wrong in the churches eyes.....on the otherhand if my wife cheats on me with another man and moves in with her boyfriend she may get excommunicated but that would have absolutely no effect on me or my children.Do you see the difference??
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