Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Closed Thread Start New Thread
 
Old 12-01-2015, 10:56 AM
 
73,009 posts, read 62,585,728 times
Reputation: 21929

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellion1999 View Post
thank you, you made my point bolder.


99% of the people in the South didn't own slaves and could care less.......they weren't going to let a tyrant from the North sent federal troops to burn down their towns and crops because they wanted to be INDEPENDENT and have their sovereignty.


I don't use drugs and could care less but if the Feds come to my town and using as an excuse their war on drugs and start burning towns, destroying homes, killing civilians and violating every individual right as Lincoln did, then I will fight the tyrant to death.....I don't have to be for drugs if people can't see why the majority of the South were fighting for their lands and homes then people here are really dense.....anybody in any country would do the same.
The majority of slave owners were in the South. The majority of persons calling for secession first were the elites and the slave owners. They had an irrational fear that Lincoln would free the slaves. This was stated in newspapers.

Maybe that "tyrant" would not have gone to the South and burned the crops out if they had not attacked Fort Sumter.

And something else. When an individual is doing drugs, the main victim of said drug use is SELF. In owning slaves, the slave is being harmed, not the owner. Big difference.

I look at this from the perspective of what my life would have been in those days. Alot of Blacks, once freed, fought for the Union. I would have gladly taken up arms for freedom. Freedom of death is the way I look at this. I would rather be dead than be a slave. This perspective comes from having ancestors who were slaves. For as much carnage that took place during the Civil War, I don't think much of it. My ultimate priority is freedom.

 
Old 12-01-2015, 10:58 AM
 
73,009 posts, read 62,585,728 times
Reputation: 21929
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
Are you just playing stupid now?

I guess they didn't accept it.... Now did they. They were forced.
The protected class.... Don't tell me you don't know what that is... And you live in the USA?
OK, I'll do your homework for you. Since you didn't do it in school either.(maybe your not playing)

a protected class is a characteristic of a person which cannot be targeted for discrimination.
See: Affirmative Action and the Civil Rights Act

Now, consider yourself educated.
Kind of like how Blacks were forced to live until quasi-dictatorship known as Jim Crow.

And while you bring up Affirmative Action, look up Regents of the University of California v. Bakke
 
Old 12-01-2015, 11:00 AM
 
73,009 posts, read 62,585,728 times
Reputation: 21929
One lesson the government should have learned is this. There are individuals who will behave irrationally. Elites and planters were so desperate to keep slavery. And they feared that Lincoln would take that way of life away from them. They were willing to wage war to defend it.
 
Old 12-01-2015, 12:39 PM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,863 posts, read 46,611,558 times
Reputation: 18521
Quote:
Originally Posted by green_mariner View Post
One lesson the government should have learned is this. There are individuals who will behave irrationally. Elites and planters were so desperate to keep slavery. And they feared that Lincoln would take that way of life away from them. They were willing to wage war to defend it.

Under the US Constitution, Lincoln couldn't take it.
That is why the south succeeded. He broke the US Constitution, by punishing the southern states. To economically ruin them, without any vote to do so in Congress.

Instead of amending the Constitution and doing it the right way, when the abolitionists saw that would never happen, they chose to break the US Constitution to get it done(Progressive for 1000, Alex)

Of coarse, the contract with the states was broken right then. All the States saw that.
The Supreme Court even ruled that and the reason the slaves were not actually freemen, until the Constitution was amended. No law or Act, could do that without violating the Constitution.


To get it done 8 years after the wars end, the federal government had to toss ALL Southern State legislatures that were elected by the people and the federal centralized government appointed northerners that were not even citizen of the state(carpetbaggers) as the representation, to pass an amendment without a vote of the people. It was never ratified.
 
Old 12-01-2015, 12:47 PM
 
73,009 posts, read 62,585,728 times
Reputation: 21929
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
Under the US Constitution, Lincoln couldn't take it.
That is why the south succeeded. He broke the US Constitution, by punishing the southern states. To economically ruin them, without any vote to do so in Congress.

Instead of amending the Constitution and doing it the right way, when the abolitionists saw that would never happen, they chose to break the US Constitution to get it done(Progressive for 1000, Alex)

Of coarse, the contract with the states was broken right then. All the States saw that.
The Supreme Court even ruled that and the reason the slaves were not actually freemen, until the Constitution was amended. No law or Act, could do that without violating the Constitution.


To get it done 8 years after the wars end, the federal government had to toss ALL Southern State legislatures that were elected by the people and the federal centralized government appointed northerners that were not even citizen of the state(carpetbaggers) as the representation, to pass an amendment without a vote of the people. It was never ratified.
Actually, all of this started because of an attack on a US fort. That was still technically US property. The CSA fired the first shot. Once that happens, all bets are off.
 
Old 12-01-2015, 12:54 PM
 
46,948 posts, read 25,979,166 times
Reputation: 29441
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
Under the US Constitution, Lincoln couldn't take it.
Slavery? Correct. And he never did, until the constitution was amended. As much as he loathed slavery, he was very aware it being constitutionally protected. He considered his duty as preserving the Union first, with everything else - including slavery - a very far second.

The Emancipation Proclamation? Only valid in the states that were in open rebellion and as such did not enjoy the protection of the Constitution. It may be considered hair-splitting, but it's legally sound - as CINC, he could command their cities bombarded and their ships sunk, he could certainly confiscate what they considered property.

Quote:
That is why the south succeeded.
Secession began before Lincoln was even sworn in.

Quote:
He broke the US Constitution, by punishing the southern states. To economically ruin them, without any vote to do so in Congress.
The seceded states could enjoy no protections under the constitution - they themselves had declared they wanted no part of it. From the US legal point of view, this was an armed insurrection, and it is specifically within the government's power to put these down. Hell, Washington led the army against one.

Quote:
Instead of amending the Constitution and doing it the right way, when the abolitionists saw that would never happen, they chose to break the US Constitution to get it done...
Where was the Constitution broken?

Quote:
The Supreme Court even ruled that and the reason the slaves were not actually freemen, until the Constitution was amended. No law or Act, could do that without violating the Constitution.
Which is why the slaves in the Union states remained slaves until the 13th, yes.
 
Old 12-01-2015, 12:58 PM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,863 posts, read 46,611,558 times
Reputation: 18521
Quote:
Originally Posted by green_mariner View Post
Actually, all of this started because of an attack on a US fort. That was still technically US property. The CSA fired the first shot. Once that happens, all bets are off.


Technically it was not US property any longer. It was South Carolina's.

They were given a chance to leave peacefully and declined. When they didn't they were evicted. They hadn't paid their rent.

Right! South Carolina was going to leave a occupied U.S. Military Fort, in the middle of The Port of Charleston.
 
Old 12-01-2015, 01:00 PM
 
73,009 posts, read 62,585,728 times
Reputation: 21929
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
Technically it was not US property any longer. It was South Carolina's.

They were given a chance to leave peacefully and declined. When they didn't they were evicted. They hadn't paid their rent.

Right! South Carolina was going to leave a occupied U.S. Military Fort, in the middle of The Port of Charleston.
If a US military based is on foreign soil, that is still technically property of the USA. Attack USA property and there will be a problem.
 
Old 12-01-2015, 01:05 PM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,863 posts, read 46,611,558 times
Reputation: 18521
Quote:
Originally Posted by green_mariner View Post
If a US military based is on foreign soil, that is still technically property of the USA. Attack USA property and there will be a problem.

They were told to leave, or else... It was no longer loaned to them to use. They had a peaceful choice or a violent choice.
They chose wisely, wouldn't ya say? How many survivors were there, again?


If I tell you to leave my house and you refuse, I guarantee you are going to be bruised and battered, out on the street. You may even get shot, if you push it.


If Europe told us to get the F out of Germany... Would we pack up and leave?
 
Old 12-01-2015, 01:15 PM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,863 posts, read 46,611,558 times
Reputation: 18521
Quote:
Originally Posted by green_mariner View Post
Actually, all of this started because of an attack on a US fort. That was still technically US property. The CSA fired the first shot. Once that happens, all bets are off.

And the reason today, We The People, got told by that very government, you cannot have the same weapons as us.

When the 2nd amendment says they cannot tell us that, or even be involved, or have any say so in Manufacture, Distribution, or Use.


There was a reason for the 2nd Amendment and the Civil War was it!
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:53 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top