Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
View Poll Results: Which is more unconstitutional?
option 1 114 83.21%
option 2 23 16.79%
Voters: 137. You may not vote on this poll

Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 12-14-2015, 09:47 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,948,900 times
Reputation: 5661

Advertisements

Regarding the OP poll, constitutionality is not a sliding scale. If something is unconstitutional, it is not offset by something "more" unconstitutional. If two laws are unconstitutional they are both unconstitutional and have no comparative weight.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-14-2015, 09:54 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,006 posts, read 44,824,472 times
Reputation: 13709
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCityTheBridge View Post
Like in Christianity, killing is a grave sin in Islam.
Apparently, not.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-14-2015, 09:59 AM
 
13,303 posts, read 7,868,942 times
Reputation: 2144
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCityTheBridge View Post

Islam is a religion like any other religion. The term "submission" in the context of Islam means "submission to God." It's not very different from the Christian doctrine of faith.

Like in Christianity, killing is a grave sin in Islam.
As grave as adultery?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-14-2015, 10:00 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
19,792 posts, read 13,948,900 times
Reputation: 5661
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009 View Post
Foreign citizens do not have rights provided by the US Constitution. The nations in which they live have thier (sic) own laws (I wonder why liberals do not understand this).

The 2nd amendment is a constitutional amendment that was felt to be so important, that is is right after freedom of speech. Oddly, guns insure that 1st amendment.
That's just not true. The Bill of Rights repeatedly uses the word "people" or "persons" in its protections, not citizens. Specific examples:
Amendment I: "the right of the people peaceably to assemble." The 1st also states that "Congress shall make no law abridging freedom of speech and religion." That clearly doesn't limit it to citizens.

Amendment II: "the right of the people to keep and bear arms"

Amendment IV: The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects...

Amendment V: "No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury..."

Amendment IX: The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

Amendment X: The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

Amendment XIV:
Section 1.

...nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

My reasoning is confirmed in two U.S. Supreme Court cases, United States v. Verdugo-Urquidez (1990) and in the District of Columbia v. Heller (2008).

So, to claim that liberals just don't understand something that you imagine to be true is exceptionally farcical.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-14-2015, 10:27 AM
 
3,569 posts, read 2,520,572 times
Reputation: 2290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyperthetic View Post
As grave as adultery?
More grave than adultery. Most Islamic doctrine believes that God weighs sin against good work in deciding whether a person should go to heaven or hell--not terribly different from Catholicism in that regard.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-14-2015, 10:42 AM
 
20,459 posts, read 12,381,706 times
Reputation: 10253
Quote:
Originally Posted by miami_winter_breeze View Post
1)Restrictions on firearm ownership, on the sale of firearms, and on the purchase of firearms

2)Immigration and tourist visa restrictions based on religion or any other criteria (such as country of origin).
well, Im not voting because the question is entirely wrong.


in the first place, it isn't the spirit of the constitution that that's impacted by restrictions to firearm ownership. its the actual constitution that is impacted.


in the second place, there is NOTHING at all anywhere in the constitution that limits America's limitations to people from other nations (not American citizens or legal residents) from coming to America.


NOTHING.
Congress could constitutionally pass a law that blocks people by race, by gender by gender identity, by religion, by sect, by tribe, by nationality or by any other identifying marker from entering this nation without being in violation of any aspect, or "spirit" of the constitution.
period. end of discussion
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-14-2015, 10:51 AM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,841,834 times
Reputation: 20030
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
That's just not true. The Bill of Rights repeatedly uses the word "people" or "persons" in its protections, not citizens. Specific examples:
Amendment I: "the right of the people peaceably to assemble." The 1st also states that "Congress shall make no law abridging freedom of speech and religion." That clearly doesn't limit it to citizens.

Amendment II: "the right of the people to keep and bear arms"

Amendment IV: The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects...

Amendment V: "No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury..."

Amendment IX: The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

Amendment X: The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

Amendment XIV:
Section 1.

...nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

My reasoning is confirmed in two U.S. Supreme Court cases, United States v. Verdugo-Urquidez (1990) and in the District of Columbia v. Heller (2008).

So, to claim that liberals just don't understand something that you imagine to be true is exceptionally farcical.
the constitution only applies to people ALREADY IN this country, not to people outside the country wanting to get in. and that is where the conflict comes in. immigration law affects those outside wnating to come in, and as such the constitution does not apply.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-14-2015, 10:54 AM
 
3,569 posts, read 2,520,572 times
Reputation: 2290
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbohm View Post
the constitution only applies to people ALREADY IN this country, not to people outside the country wanting to get in. and that is where the conflict comes in. immigration law affects those outside wnating to come in, and as such the constitution does not apply.
Yes, it does. Unless you believe that the Constitution does not apply to Congress or the INS, which would be a very radical view.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-14-2015, 10:58 AM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,841,834 times
Reputation: 20030
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCityTheBridge View Post
Yes, it does. Unless you believe that the Constitution does not apply to Congress or the INS, which would be a very radical view.
i am not talking about people already here. i have always said the constitutions applies to everyone IN THIS COUNTRY. that said however, if a person is NOT in this country, then the constitution DOES NOT APPLY TO THEM. once you realize that, you will understand exactly what i am saying.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-14-2015, 11:00 AM
 
3,569 posts, read 2,520,572 times
Reputation: 2290
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbohm View Post
i am not talking about people already here. i have always said the constitutions applies to everyone IN THIS COUNTRY. that said however, if a person is NOT in this country, then the constitution DOES NOT APPLY TO THEM. once you realize that, you will understand exactly what i am saying.
The immigration law applies in this country. It creates a rule that extends only to the border of the United States. When it is applied, it is applied within the United States. It is created by Congress, and subject to the 1st Amendment.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:16 AM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top