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Old 11-20-2006, 03:21 PM
 
Location: Springfield, Missouri
2,814 posts, read 11,892,295 times
Reputation: 2000001281

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I'm not sure that reinstituting a draft would help. Yes, it would relieve the volunteer troops who've been involuntarily extended in their missions and possibly allow "Stop-Loss" to be discontinued, but... I think one of the reasons we haven't seen widespread protests and college riots, etc. with the Iraq war (besides the fact that the basis for the war is different than Vietnam), is because the people fighting it signed up knowing they would most likely be sent. So far, the people on the line have signed up voluntarily, that makes it a different issue than conscription. I think if we have a draft, it's not going to put any more Congressmen's sons or daughters in harms way as they'll find their traditional loopholes to avoid service. And, since we last had a draft, women now fight in combat...are we going to draft them too? Is that even on the table? Should it be? I think it's a big mess waiting to happen if they try. When it comes to our enemies...why don't we stop trying to occupy these countries and instead blow the F@@K out of them and let them pick themselves up when it's over. We would have accomplished the same thing in Iraq had we truly used our power, snagged Hussein, then left. If it comes to blows with Iran, forget about occupying them, just erase the b@@@@@@ds.
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Old 11-20-2006, 03:55 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
985 posts, read 2,550,314 times
Reputation: 812
Quote:
Originally Posted by pslOldTimer View Post
Charlie Rangel proposed this bill. He's done it before, and voted against his own bill. He's not serious, he's just doing it to illustrate the fact that if we intend to continue the present foreign policy, we're going to have to reinstate the draft. He's doing it to embarrass the administration -- and doing a pretty good job of it, if the most recent election was any indication. The present administration does not like to talk about the cost of the "war", in terms of lives, money, influence abroad or social upheaval. Mr. Rangle's bill creates that kind of discusion, or else we would not have this thread.

Good job, Charlie. Too bad some die hard right wingers totally misunderstand, just like they do about almost everything else.
I am one of those "right wingers" that totally agrees with you about Charlie Rangle. He did this once before. I really believe they will never reinstate the draft. Thank God because we only want the best in our military!!!
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Old 11-20-2006, 04:57 PM
 
Location: Central Jersey - Florida
3,314 posts, read 12,255,762 times
Reputation: 2094
Quote:
Originally Posted by pslOldTimer View Post
Charlie Rangel proposed this bill. He's done it before, and voted against his own bill. He's not serious, he's just doing it to illustrate the fact that if we intend to continue the present foreign policy, we're going to have to reinstate the draft. He's doing it to embarrass the administration -- and doing a pretty good job of it, if the most recent election was any indication. The present administration does not like to talk about the cost of the "war", in terms of lives, money, influence abroad or social upheaval. Mr. Rangle's bill creates that kind of discusion, or else we would not have this thread.

Good job, Charlie. Too bad some die hard right wingers totally misunderstand, just like they do about almost everything else.
I just caught part of the local news (C.B.S. New York) and I think what Charles Rangel is getting at is that it's the young men and women of color that are carrying the load in the U.S. military these days. I don't know the demographics of our people in the service so I will not comment. I think he believes that if the draft is reinstituted the burden would be more evenly distributed. Anyway, if I heard him right I think that's what he was getting at. I'll listen more closely tonight at 11.
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Old 11-20-2006, 05:32 PM
 
Location: Haddington, E. Lothian, Scotland
752 posts, read 593,693 times
Reputation: 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoMark View Post
When it comes to our enemies...why don't we stop trying to occupy these countries and instead blow the F@@K out of them and let them pick themselves up when it's over. We would have accomplished the same thing in Iraq had we truly used our power, snagged Hussein, then left. If it comes to blows with Iran, forget about occupying them, just erase the b@@@@@@ds.
Hi,

As I recall Germany was one of those countries that had the F@@K blown out of it and was left to pick itself up after WWI. We saw what happened after that.
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Old 11-20-2006, 05:42 PM
 
Location: Springfield, Missouri
2,814 posts, read 11,892,295 times
Reputation: 2000001281
Quote:
Originally Posted by FistFightingHairdresser View Post
Hi,

As I recall Germany was one of those countries that had the F@@K blown out of it and was left to pick itself up after WWI. We saw what happened after that.
Your recall is faulty. The Versailles Treaty that ended WW1 called for Germany to repay Reparations to France, Belgium and all the countries it fought against, amounts so huge that no country could ever have paid them, as well as allowing an outside and foreign interference that would have been intolerable to any nation. I am not suggesting anything of the sort. I'm saying, and it's pretty clear..., that if we feel compelled enough to fight a war, fight it. We shouldn't be there to pick up the pieces and try to make it something it is not. There's a big difference between that and what happened in Germany after WW1.
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Old 11-20-2006, 06:11 PM
 
Location: Haddington, E. Lothian, Scotland
752 posts, read 593,693 times
Reputation: 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoMark View Post
Your recall is faulty. The Versailles Treaty that ended WW1 called for Germany to repay Reparations to France, Belgium and all the countries it fought against, amounts so huge that no country could ever have paid them, as well as allowing an outside and foreign interference that would have been intolerable to any nation. I am not suggesting anything of the sort. I'm saying, and it's pretty clear..., that if we feel compelled enough to fight a war, fight it. We shouldn't be there to pick up the pieces and try to make it something it is not. There's a big difference between that and what happened in Germany after WW1.
Thanks for clarifying the obvious, but you missed the rhetorical point of my post: blowing the F@@K out of people rarely means problem solved.
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Old 11-20-2006, 06:35 PM
 
Location: Springfield, Missouri
2,814 posts, read 11,892,295 times
Reputation: 2000001281
Quote:
Originally Posted by FistFightingHairdresser View Post
Thanks for clarifying the obvious, but you missed the rhetorical point of my post: blowing the F@@K out of people rarely means problem solved.
There was no rhetorical point in your other post. You made a statement, it was incorrect, and you posited a conclusion drawn from it. It's clear in this last posting that you meant something else. Why not state that in the first place?
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Old 11-20-2006, 07:42 PM
 
Location: Tucson, AZ
1,696 posts, read 3,055,990 times
Reputation: 1535
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoMark View Post
I'm not sure that reinstituting a draft would help. Yes, it would relieve the volunteer troops who've been involuntarily extended in their missions and possibly allow "Stop-Loss" to be discontinued, but... I think one of the reasons we haven't seen widespread protests and college riots, etc. with the Iraq war (besides the fact that the basis for the war is different than Vietnam), is because the people fighting it signed up knowing they would most likely be sent. So far, the people on the line have signed up voluntarily, that makes it a different issue than conscription. I think if we have a draft, it's not going to put any more Congressmen's sons or daughters in harms way as they'll find their traditional loopholes to avoid service. And, since we last had a draft, women now fight in combat...are we going to draft them too? Is that even on the table? Should it be? I think it's a big mess waiting to happen if they try. When it comes to our enemies...why don't we stop trying to occupy these countries and instead blow the F@@K out of them and let them pick themselves up when it's over. We would have accomplished the same thing in Iraq had we truly used our power, snagged Hussein, then left. If it comes to blows with Iran, forget about occupying them, just erase the b@@@@@@ds.
That's exactly what I was thinking tonight when I saw this story on the news. All it is going to take is for families who thought their kids were going to college to get drafted, and watch disapproval turn into outright rage.
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Old 11-20-2006, 08:38 PM
 
9,716 posts, read 12,938,315 times
Reputation: 3315
You can't blow the F@@K (what the heck is that anyway?) out of Iran because it is surrounded by our friends... Plus, we need their (our friend's) oil.

If we start blowing the F@@K out of Iran, we might find Russia, China, France and all those other guys thinking about blowing the F@@K out of us just to stop the aggression!

Stop and think *why* Russia, China, France and other countries aren't helping us in Iraq... Remember when they said "Don't go there. Don't do that"?
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Old 11-20-2006, 09:11 PM
 
311 posts, read 549,335 times
Reputation: 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by pslOldTimer View Post
Charlie Rangel proposed this bill. He's done it before, and voted against his own bill. He's not serious, he's just doing it to illustrate the fact that if we intend to continue the present foreign policy, we're going to have to reinstate the draft. He's doing it to embarrass the administration -- and doing a pretty good job of it, if the most recent election was any indication. The present administration does not like to talk about the cost of the "war", in terms of lives, money, influence abroad or social upheaval. Mr. Rangle's bill creates that kind of discusion, or else we would not have this thread.

Good job, Charlie. Too bad some die hard right wingers totally misunderstand, just like they do about almost everything else.
Yes, this die hard right winger understands! "He's doing it to embarrass the administration..." and all the while telling everyone that he wants "bipartisan" to be the name of the game! He is doing a good job
I heard what he "finally" said about raising taxes when he was on the radio with Hannity.
The good thing in all this: The libs will have to walk the walk now. We know they can talk.....
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