Does Joe Wilson deserve an apology? (Clinton, biased, election, state)

[Tominftl]

If this moron shouted "you Lie " to any other president they would have shown him the door. Why do Republicans do these disrespectful things? Maybe their parents never taught them any manners. Why is this so important now anyway? I guess the OP is just trying to stir the pot?

[michiganmoon]

Originally Posted by Daytonnatian

Because people are idiots

New evidence out that the Republicans were correct on their obvious criticism that Obama refusing to put a verification system in Obamacare to make sure people getting subsidies were here legally would result in illegal immigrants getting subsidies.

Yes, Obama is an idiot if he thought that illegal immigrants wouldn't get Obamacare subsidies simply because the law says you can't, but won't verify if you are or aren't when handing out the freebies.

Obama is either an idiot or a liar to the tune of at least over 500,000 illegal immigrants getting $750,000,000.00.

Originally Posted by Tominftl

If this moron shouted "you Lie " to any other president they would have shown him the door. Why do Republicans do these disrespectful things? Maybe their parents never taught them any manners. Why is this so important now anyway? I guess the OP is just trying to stir the pot?

Is Obama not a disrespectful moron for telling countless lies on the topic of Obamacare?

When someone is telling a bald face lie to not only your face but to millions of people at the same time, why shouldn't you call them out for lying? When does Obama allow himself to be opened up to questions where he can be confronted on his continual lies?

I think this country would be better off if we called the political elites liars when they lie.

Obama was lying (unless he is a blithering idiot) - what is wrong with calling a liar a liar?

[Daytonnatian]

^i was referring to people like you

[pknopp]

Originally Posted by Tominftl

If this moron shouted "you Lie " to any other president they would have shown him the door. Why do Republicans do these disrespectful things? Maybe their parents never taught them any manners. Why is this so important now anyway? I guess the OP is just trying to stir the pot?

Manners don't dictate that you have to be respectful to someone lying to your face........No, Obamacare does not state "Open to illegals" but it was set up to where just anyone could sign up and get benefits. You didn't have to prove anything.....your status, your income or anything.

He knew that.

I'm not "right wing whatever you want to call them". I'm voting for Sanders. For years I've condemned lying politicians and said many times I would prefer someone I disagreed with that is being honest over someone telling me what I want to hear but is lying to me.

There are things I disagree with Sanders on but he is a rare honest politician. He can be hypocritical at times but I've noted that was his biggest weakness.

Obama lies about everything, even when the truth is a better answer. I would even defend Obama here if he had been honest even not believing Obamacare is the answer.

"Yes, it's possible for illegals to initially sign up. We need to get this program off the ground and getting people signed up ASAP is the best way to do it. We will weed out the illegals as the program gets off the ground".

If Obamacare had been led by honest politicians as opposed to the three stooges maybe it could have been something good and not just a payoff to the insurance and pharmaceutical companies.

[dsjj251]

Originally Posted by michiganmoon

I agree.




Your whole argument rests on Obama being an incompetent idiot. How can you promise something won't happen when you aren't taking real steps to prevent it?

The whole argument at the time was that there apparently were no serious safe guards being put in to prevent illegal immigrants from getting subsidies. Saying that they can't get a subsidy, but not properly checking to see if they are here legally when tossing out freebies will result in ________?

Apparently it will result in 500,000 Illegal Immigrants getting $750,000,000.00 in subsidies.

At least it allowed the administration to puff up its enrollee numbers!


Hey, Obama the pathological liar lied about the circumstances of how his own mother died to score political points on Obamacare. He lied about lowering the premiums as much as he said - he is not that stupid to think that was possible. He lied about keeping your doctor and your plan. Etc...

The article never claims there isnt a mechanism to stop it, it says it was an error in the system.

So again, you are wrong, but wont admit you didnt read your own article, because your real goal here is to attack President Obama, not actually have a discussion or debate issues.

[Haakon]

Originally Posted by Old Gringo

Did congress pass the president's health care plan or did congress modify it into an unrecognizable form?

You think Obama actually ever had a fleshed out plan? Of course not he had a sound bite and let everyone else do the work so you'll have to ask the democrats since they are 100% responsible for every line in it. They're the only ones who took part in writing it and the only ones who voted for it.

Of course Obama is the one who has illegally continued to defer and delay implementing parts of his plan in an attempt to buy votes in every election since his party was shellacked in 2010.

[dsjj251]

Originally Posted by pknopp

Since it was all done in secret behind closed doors I suppose we will never know. I know that isn't how Obama promised it would happen.

That isnt true at all, the ACA was only years ago and already you guys are rewriting history.

Originally Posted by pknopp

If Obama claimed it, it was a lie but that isn't what was being discussed. What was being discussed was whether or not the GOP contributed any amendments to it. They didn't get to add anything to it.

And there lies the proof that some people are so against the president that even when proven wrong,you would still stick to your false belief.

[michiganmoon]

Originally Posted by dsjj251

The article never claims there isnt a mechanism to stop it, it says it was an error in the system.

So again, you are wrong, but wont admit you didnt read your own article, because your real goal here is to attack President Obama, not actually have a discussion or debate issues.

Obama’s Health Care Speech

From FactCheck....

Obama said that his proposal would not cover illegal immigrants, a remark that prompted Republican Rep. Joe Wilson of South Carolina to shout "You lie!"

Obama: There are also those who claim that our reform effort will insure illegal immigrants. This, too, is false – the reforms I’m proposing would not apply to those who are here illegally.

The president is correct: The House bill contains a section (Sec. 246) titled "NO FEDERAL PAYMENT FOR UNDOCUMENTED ALIENS," which states: "Nothing in this subtitle shall allow Federal payments for affordability credits on behalf of individuals who are not lawfully present in the United States."

However, conservative critics object to a lack of specific enforcement measures in the bill. They argue that the lack of a specific verification mechanism constitutes a loophole that would allow illegal immigrants to get benefits despite the legal prohibition. Republican Rep. Dean Heller of Nevada proposed an amendment to the bill that would have required the use of the Systematic Alien Verification for Entitlements program to check the immigration status of anyone applying for federal coverage or affordability credits. SAVE is the program used by Medicaid and similar entitlement programs. That amendment was voted down along party lines by the House Ways and Means Committee.

Republicans have a point here: More could be done to enforce the ban.

Obama said illegal immigrants could not get subsidies.

However, Republicans pointed out that there were no specific enforcement measures nor any verification system and hence illegal immigrants would be getting Obamacare subsidies.

Republicans try to add an amendment to Obamacare to use verification for subsidies to make sure that illegal immigrants don't get subsidies -- and Democrats vote it down.

Democrats then celebrate the inflated numbers of new enrollees for Obamacare, which included 500,000+ illegal immigrants getting $750,000,000.00!



If Obama was not lying then he is an incompetent idiot, essentially saying: 'I will not allow illegal immigrants to get Obamacare subsidies, but I will refuse to check to see if they are legally here when passing out the freebies, illegal immigrants wouldn't break any of our laws.' Any sane person with a decent IQ would realize that by not checking the legality of those getting freebies is in fact giving subsidies to illegal immigrants.

[michiganmoon]

Originally Posted by Daytonnatian

^i was referring to people like you

Obama is either lied or is an incompetent idiot.

"There are also those who claim that our reform effort will insure illegal immigrants. This, too, is false – the reforms I’m proposing would not apply to those who are here illegally." -Obama

Republicans proposed adding a citizenship verification and the Democrats voted against this.

How can Obama make the above claim if he and his party were refusing to check the citizenship status. Hence, by any logical manner Obama's statement is wrong, Obamacare would in fact give subsidies out to illegal immigrants.

Do you think Obama was lying and intended to give Obamacare subsidies to illegal immigrants so the program's numbers could be inflated OR do you think he is a blithering idiot that is so incompetent that he doesn't realize failing to check for citizenship status when passing out freebies guarantees that illegal immigrants will get freebies (at least 500,000 illegals got over $750,000,000.00).

[dsjj251]

Originally Posted by michiganmoon

If Obama was not lying then he is an incompetent idiot, essentially saying: 'I will not allow illegal immigrants to get Obamacare subsidies, but I will refuse to check to see if they are legally here when passing out the freebies, illegal immigrants wouldn't break any of our laws.' Any sane person with a decent IQ would realize that by not checking the legality of those getting freebies is in fact giving subsidies to illegal immigrants.

You are still arguing the same fallacy, but at least you have admitted the falsehood with in it which is that illegals an get subsidies without lying.

Illegals can not get the subsides without first lying to get them, no different than any other criminal that forges documents.

WHy are you blaming the President because other people lied ?????

Again, the thread you started is about whether or not the president lied, not if people know how to game the system.


By your logic, every republican lies when they say they dont want criminals to have guns since loopholes in the way guns are sold allow it to happen.