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Old 03-25-2016, 10:29 AM
 
Location: Old Mother Idaho
29,184 posts, read 22,227,289 times
Reputation: 23813

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Quote:
Originally Posted by stburr91 View Post
They did, the damage was done by the holdouts after the Bundys were arrested.
4 people? Possible, but doubtful, considering the Anderson couple lived outside in a make-do shelter most of the time because they were so paranoid about being captured. While it's probable that they moved indoors in the nighttime, they sure contributed to the trashing that occurred in the parking lots. And they used a propane construction heater that was govt. property to keep their trashy hovel warm in the daylight hours, burning govt. paid propane fuel canisters.

So- how did 2 people who stayed inside the headquarters buildings manage to accomplish that much destruction? If they alone did it, they must have been very, very busy.

And the videos that were taken by Cox and others while the Bundys were there showed major vandalism long before they were arrested. Ammon Bundy was no disciplinarian, that's for sure.

Those vids were interesting; there was a lot of complaining being done about the buildings that weren't used very much, like the firefighter's bunkhouse, being mousy and unkempt, but once they scrubbed them down, they proceeded to mess them up with their own trash, garbage, and left behind articles. Housekeeping was never a major objective in the takeover, despite their claims to the contrary.

I guess few of them ever spent any time in wilderness habitation. Any cabin in the boonies always develops a mouse problem over time. That's a given, just like dust and grime buildup is, during all the extended times when a building isn't populated at all. Insects and vermin always find a way in, no matter what measures are taken, especially as the building ages.
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Old 03-25-2016, 10:56 AM
 
497 posts, read 425,793 times
Reputation: 584
I think most of the heavy equipment used to damage the refuge belonged to the USFWS already. The crazy thing is that the Jeehawdists are allowed to come claim the property they abandoned at the refuge. I wonder if the USFWS employees will be allowed to claim their personal property that to occupiers stole.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
Not to mention heavy equipment donated to build barricades etc.. Confiscate all that stuff and put a major hurt on all those billy-bobs who thought that stupid fracas was a good idea..
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Old 03-25-2016, 10:58 AM
 
Location: Old Mother Idaho
29,184 posts, read 22,227,289 times
Reputation: 23813
Quote:
Originally Posted by Livejack View Post
I hope they can collect it. No way taxpayers should have to foot this bill. What a bunch of sorry jackasses. Also hope the can collect all the back rent for grazing on public lands that the Bundy's felt they didn't have to pay.

Cowardly and despicable acts.
The government can collect for the damages for sure. They've done it before in other, less publicized, events.
Bankruptcy has become a very effective tool against domestic terrorism. If the government can't use it, there are plenty of private organizations what will. Just ask the KKK, whose back was broken as an organization through financial accountability for their actions.

The problem for us taxpayers may be that so many of them don't have two pennies to rub together before they every showed up at the bird sanctuary.

Since they were on the government dole before they came, they'll be back on the welfare after they're declared bankrupt, and we won't be able to get much of anything of value out of them in the process.
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Old 03-25-2016, 11:03 AM
 
18,986 posts, read 9,018,747 times
Reputation: 14688
Quote:
Originally Posted by banjomike View Post
The government can collect for the damages for sure. They've done it before in other, less publicized, events.
Bankruptcy has become a very effective tool against domestic terrorism. If the government can't use it, there are plenty of private organizations what will. Just ask the KKK, whose back was broken as an organization through financial accountability for their actions.

The problem for us taxpayers may be that so many of them don't have two pennies to rub together before they every showed up at the bird sanctuary.

Since they were on the government dole before they came, they'll be back on the welfare after they're declared bankrupt, and we won't be able to get much of anything of value out of them in the process.
When the occupation first began and they were calling on fellow "patriots" to come and join them, many responses they received were variations of, I would love to come but I have to wait for my disability check to arrive first, or I'll be there as soon as the government deposits my Social Security check into my bank account. Basically, yeah, I'll come help you overthrow the government right after I get my government welfare.

I think anyone who participates in an armed occupation against the government should automatically forfeit the right to collect anything from said government for the rest of their lives.
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Old 03-25-2016, 11:27 AM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,550,875 times
Reputation: 20674
Quote:
Originally Posted by JAMS14 View Post
I guess you missed this. It was recorded by David Frey after the Bundys were arrested. He documents the state of the barracks after everyone left, saying that after the arrests, "People so scared didn't even pack their stuff. Thought feds were coming to kill everyone. Waco style."


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glsQEwWZLqg

The four pathetic holdouts didn't do all of that damage and create all of that mess by themselves. They had the help of a whole bunch of "patriots," you know, all those "good stewards of the land," Ammon and Ryan Bundy included.
My daughter's bedroom used to look a whole lot worse than those rooms.
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Old 03-25-2016, 11:32 AM
 
Location: Old Mother Idaho
29,184 posts, read 22,227,289 times
Reputation: 23813
Quote:
Originally Posted by JAMS14 View Post
When the occupation first began and they were calling on fellow "patriots" to come and join them, many responses they received were variations of, I would love to come but I have to wait for my disability check to arrive first, or I'll be there as soon as the government deposits my Social Security check into my bank account. Basically, yeah, I'll come help you overthrow the government right after I get my government welfare.

I think anyone who participates in an armed occupation against the government should automatically forfeit the right to collect anything from said government for the rest of their lives.
Yup. But I hate to visit the sins of the fathers on their children. God knows the kids have enough working against them from the get-go as it is. Not all of the Bundy Bunch were elderly or incapacitated; most of the gunslingers were in their 30s and 40s, (with a few kids among them) their prime income earning years.

Remember that one of them passed up a good paying roofing job so he could go play the noble minuteman out in the middle of the Oregon desert in the middle of winter. Never mind their families going hungry at home, never mind their kids needing some money for the heating bills at home, or that last year's overcoat isn't fitting that growing child any more.

These 'men' were nothing more that little boys who refused to grow up. A real man wouldn't take off like that and abandon his family.

That they ignored their adult responsibilities to their own to go play with their toys is something bankruptcy won't fix. But for the few who had enough valuables in property, money, or whatever, I think bankruptcy would be a good move.
For the others, a decade in prison, or more, is a mighty good way of making them regret the fruits of their folly.

When all of this is over and done, the overwhelming lesson that needs to be taught to them all is to give up their foolish hopes of an armed insurrection becoming a possibility. That's what drives them all when all the superficials are stripped away.
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Old 03-25-2016, 12:01 PM
 
Location: Del Rio, TN
39,809 posts, read 26,369,236 times
Reputation: 25699
Quote:
Originally Posted by banjomike View Post
The government can collect for the damages for sure. They've done it before in other, less publicized, events.
Bankruptcy has become a very effective tool against domestic terrorism. If the government can't use it, there are plenty of private organizations what will. Just ask the KKK, whose back was broken as an organization through financial accountability for their actions.

The problem for us taxpayers may be that so many of them don't have two pennies to rub together before they every showed up at the bird sanctuary.

Since they were on the government dole before they came, they'll be back on the welfare after they're declared bankrupt, and we won't be able to get much of anything of value out of them in the process.
Obvious question is why other groups have so rarely been sued for restitution. BLM blocks roads and disrupts major highways, disrupting thousands, costing thousands of dollars per hour...never charged. BLM riots and burns down entire neighborhoods. Have any paid restitution to rebuild them? OWS trashes parks in urban areas for months, displacing who knows how many people from legal use of said park. Any restitution?

Yet a couple guys occupy an insignificant piece of dirt in the middle of BFE...and they are either shot to death, imprisoned for decades or sued? Not that they don't deserve punishment, but where is the balance?

Oh yeah, these people actually stood up to the federal government-they must be made an example.
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Old 03-25-2016, 12:29 PM
 
1,166 posts, read 750,768 times
Reputation: 1877
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
My daughter's bedroom used to look a whole lot worse than those rooms.

Really, your daughter often urinated and defecated on the floor and left it for you to clean up?
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Old 03-25-2016, 12:33 PM
 
1,166 posts, read 750,768 times
Reputation: 1877
Quote:
Originally Posted by banjomike View Post
Yup. But I hate to visit the sins of the fathers on their children. God knows the kids have enough working against them from the get-go as it is. Not all of the Bundy Bunch were elderly or incapacitated; most of the gunslingers were in their 30s and 40s, (with a few kids among them) their prime income earning years.

Remember that one of them passed up a good paying roofing job so he could go play the noble minuteman out in the middle of the Oregon desert in the middle of winter. Never mind their families going hungry at home, never mind their kids needing some money for the heating bills at home, or that last year's overcoat isn't fitting that growing child any more.

These 'men' were nothing more that little boys who refused to grow up. A real man wouldn't take off like that and abandon his family.

That they ignored their adult responsibilities to their own to go play with their toys is something bankruptcy won't fix. But for the few who had enough valuables in property, money, or whatever, I think bankruptcy would be a good move.
For the others, a decade in prison, or more, is a mighty good way of making them regret the fruits of their folly.

When all of this is over and done, the overwhelming lesson that needs to be taught to them all is to give up their foolish hopes of an armed insurrection becoming a possibility. That's what drives them all when all the superficials are stripped away.

I believe that some of these sov cit man children were hoping to go out in a blaze of glory so they wouldn't have to admit to themselves that they were complete failures at life. Most of them were drug users, collecting disability checks and/or chronically unemployed losers.


These right wing militia groups like the Bundys and Oathkeepers attract the dregs of the white trash world.
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Old 03-25-2016, 12:43 PM
 
14,905 posts, read 8,531,032 times
Reputation: 7345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Livejack View Post
I hope they can collect it. No way taxpayers should have to foot this bill. What a bunch of sorry jackasses. Also hope the can collect all the back rent for grazing on public lands that the Bundy's felt they didn't have to pay.

Cowardly and despicable acts.
I have a better idea … perhaps the costs can be taken from the profits the BLM made in stealing private property and livestock from our fellow Americans you and others want to condemn?
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