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Old 06-09-2016, 10:24 AM
 
17,751 posts, read 15,658,618 times
Reputation: 6391

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Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamSmyth View Post
If that is your attempt to convince me Trump is a legitimate choice then all I can say is save your time. Its not going to happen. I may not like Clinton, but there is no way I will vote for someone who I believe would be a disaster for America. Trump has spent his whole life as part of the power elite, despite whatever rhetoric he is spewing right now. I could say more, but it would be off topic and my very conservative mother advised me if I didn't have anything nice to say then perhaps I shouldn't say anything at all.
It was my successful attempt expose the thought process of your state in life what they call patzer in the chess world.
Clinton has Wall street and the press corp behind her. She is raising massive amounts of money. So to even attempt to suggest Clinton is not in the thick of it is utterly ridiculous. Anytime anyone says they don't have anything nice to say, is pusillanimously offering an insult, ya know cause they said it. The tradition I go by is to call a spade a spade, ace.

I do have a movie recommendation for you: Mr Smith goes to Washington. You'll love it.
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Old 06-09-2016, 10:46 AM
 
Location: Central Maine
4,687 posts, read 5,540,524 times
Reputation: 4966
Quote:
Originally Posted by southward bound View Post
She has also said...


The road ahead is not going to be easy for folks like you and me.

For the first time...I am proud of my country.

Black girls rock!

Museums and concert halls just donít welcome non-white visitors.

I wake up in a house that was built by slaves.


When we listen to a speech, we have to hear it in context of the whole person, their perspective, what they believe and what they have said before.

So, adding the above comments over time, you can draw some conclusions.
I bolded the part of your post I want to address, and ask that you follow your own very good, sound advice. Quoting a sentence or phrase from anyone's speech or paper almost always leads to a very biased view of that speech or paper, and the person responsible for it.

To review ... what Mrs. Obama said, with context not deleted, was:
More than anything else, graduates, that is the American story. Itís your story and the story of those who came before you at this school. Itís the story of the son of Polish immigrants named Jonas Salk who toiled for years in a lab until he discovered a vaccine that saved countless lives. Itís the story of the son of immigrant -- Jamaican immigrants -- named Colin Powell who became a four star general, Secretary of State, and a role model for young people across the country.

And, graduates, itís the story that I witness every single day when I wake up in a house that was built by slaves, and I watch my daughters Ė- two beautiful, black young women -Ė head off to school -- (applause) -- waving goodbye to their father, the President of the United States, the son of a man from Kenya who came here to American -- to America for the same reasons as many of you: To get an education and improve his prospects in life.
No one in this thread appears to be reacting to the inclusion of children of Polish immigrants in her speech, or the children of Jamaican immigrants, but when the First Lady -- the black First Lady -- mentions slaves, immediately are heard cries of racism.

When Mrs. Obama is talking about America being the land of opportunity, of how immigrants and children of immigrants have helped make this melting pot of a country great, and she's talking to the graduating class of the first public college in this country founded specifically for the poor and children of immigrants, how could she NOT include the remarkable achievement of her husband - a black man - being elected and re-elected President - and yes, living in a house built by slaves?

I see in her words a stark reminder of how far we have come as a country and a people.

I see in the words of many in this thread just how far we still need to go.
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Old 06-09-2016, 11:23 AM
 
7,142 posts, read 2,528,254 times
Reputation: 3611
Quote:
Originally Posted by epliny View Post
I'd say that it's time for the White Irish and/or Europeans to start whining!

It may surprise some that Up to one-half of all the arrivals in the American colonies were White slaves and they were America's first slaves.

These Whites were slaves for life, long before Blacks ever were.

This slavery was even hereditary. White children born to White slaves were enslaved too.



Whites were auctioned on the block with children sold and separated from their parents and wives sold and separated from their husbands. Free Black property owners strutted the streets of northern and southern American cities while White slaves were worked to death in the sugar mills of Barbados and Jamaica and the plantations of Virginia.

The one responsible for the court case making slavery legal in the U.S. .. was himself a black man from Virginia!
Quote:
The Irish Were Slaves Too”

Is it true?: If we’re talking about slavery as it was practiced on Africans in the United States—that is, hereditary chattel slavery—then the answer is a clear no. As historian and public librarian Liam Hogan writes in a paper titled “The Myth of ‘Irish Slaves’ in the Colonies,” “Persons from Ireland have been held in various forms of human bondage throughout history, but they have never been chattel slaves in the West Indies.” Nor is there any evidence of Irish chattel slavery in the North American colonies. There were a large number of Irish indentured servants, and there were cases in which Irish men and women were sentenced to indentured servitude in the “new world” and forcibly shipped across the Atlantic. But even involuntary laborers had more autonomy than enslaved Africans, and the large majority of Irish indentured servants came here voluntarily.

Which raises a question: Where did the myth of Irish slavery come from? A few places. The term “white slaves” emerged in the 17th and 18th centuries, first as a derogatory term for Irish laborers—equating their social position to that of slaves—later as political rhetoric in Ireland itself, and later still as Southern pro-slavery propaganda against an industrialized North. More recently, Hogan notes, several sources have conflated indentured servitude with chattel slavery in order to argue for a particular Irish disadvantage in the Americas, when compared to other white immigrant groups. Hogan cites several writers—Sean O’Callaghan in To Hell or Barbados and Don Jordan and Michael Walsh in White Cargo: The Forgotten History of Britain’s White Slaves in America—who exaggerate poor treatment of Irish indentured servants and intentionally conflate their status with African slaves. Neither of the authors “bother to inform the reader, in a coherent manner, what the differences are between chattel slavery and indentured servitude or forced labor,” writes Hogan.

Slavery myths: Seven lies, half-truths, and irrelevancies people trot out about slavery—debunked.
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Old 06-09-2016, 11:44 AM
 
15,489 posts, read 7,898,049 times
Reputation: 8022

Thank you for posting this.

I will also mention in regards to the person that you quoted the black man epliny mentioned did not establish slavery in America.

Slavery was in America prior to his case and there were many other cases prior to his that the court ruled in favor of a master having an enslaved person for life.

John Punch is considered by most historians as the first person legally made a slave in America. He was a black indentured servant who escaped with 2 white indentured servants. The 2 white servants got extended indentured periods as a punishiment. John Punch was enslaved for life.
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Old 06-09-2016, 12:36 PM
 
21,568 posts, read 11,623,733 times
Reputation: 12315
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
If you are going to criticize a foreigner for speaking your native language badly, try not to butcher it too much yourself. One lousy sentence, and you could not pull it off.
I really didn't mean English but...never mind
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Old 06-09-2016, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Alameda, CA
7,465 posts, read 3,963,957 times
Reputation: 1369
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwynedd1 View Post
It was my successful attempt expose the thought process of your state in life what they call patzer in the chess world.
Clinton has Wall street and the press corp behind her. She is raising massive amounts of money. So to even attempt to suggest Clinton is not in the thick of it is utterly ridiculous. Anytime anyone says they don't have anything nice to say, is pusillanimously offering an insult, ya know cause they said it. The tradition I go by is to call a spade a spade, ace.

I do have a movie recommendation for you: Mr Smith goes to Washington. You'll love it.
Where did I suggest that Clinton does not have support of Wall Street. In fact her close association with Wall Street is one of the reasons I don't care for her as President.

I love the movie "Mr Smith goes to Washington", its one my favorites.
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Old 06-09-2016, 01:08 PM
 
Location: Florida
21,673 posts, read 11,138,235 times
Reputation: 7896
Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamSmyth View Post
If that is your attempt to convince me Trump is a legitimate choice then all I can say is save your time. Its not going to happen. I may not like Clinton, but there is no way I will vote for someone who I believe would be a disaster for America. Trump has spent his whole life as part of the power elite, despite whatever rhetoric he is spewing right now. I could say more, but it would be off topic and my very conservative mother advised me if I didn't have anything nice to say then perhaps I shouldn't say anything at all.
Trump is the blue collar billionaire who spend much time with the guys who built his buildings..he didn't sit in his ivory tower... Obama is the elitist..

Trump has proved himself to be a down to earth guy who tells it like it is.. this is very upsetting to the snob elitist crowd who can't use words like liar or crooked.. they have to sweeten it up with taking the power out of the word.. to be so refined it tells the listener it is not serious at all.. that is the problem.. no accountablity today.. we can't say anything to offend someone..

And of course we have the left who loves to label people with phobias.. to clean it up using a medical term.

And everyone is a bigot or racist who does not believe the same as they do.. the media is sick too and also the Rinos.. If they had the guts to call out Obama the way they call out Trump , maybe they wouldn't look like a bunch of wimpy Rinos.
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Old 06-09-2016, 01:15 PM
 
Location: Florida
21,673 posts, read 11,138,235 times
Reputation: 7896
Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamSmyth View Post
I think Michelle said it more eloquently then you just did; she was pointing out how much America had changed for the better and used her husband and children as an example of that change.
No , she didn't.. she could have said this..

many ethnic groups built the white house from around the world including the freed slaves and some who were still slaves.. we have come together and it is a better world .. so let us put the past behind us..

far cry from what Michelle said.
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Old 06-09-2016, 02:29 PM
 
17,751 posts, read 15,658,618 times
Reputation: 6391
[quote=WilliamSmyth;44355280]Where did I suggest that Clinton does not have support of Wall Street. In fact her close association with Wall Street is one of the reasons I don't care for her as President.
[quote]

Her policy is far more in line with Wall Street. Even the hint of a trade dispute is horrifies the banking class. That is by far the biggest tell. The reason is their capital exposure internationally. I suppose its possible these days they can get the IMF or some other entity to bail them out again, but a trade war would interfere with their easy third wold money making scams. They are already out on a limb due to falling oil prices. Trump is a civil war among the billionaire class. Nice change of pace since they divide us via gender wars and race baiting routinely as class warfare on steroids.

Trump is not exactly my cup of tea. The Casino business is not exactly a bastion of good values and production. He is also part of the FIRE sector, allbiet the least bad of them being a builder. However his good parenting and no alcohol or drug position I find admirable. I also like the fact that his assets are in this country. Anyone more internationally minded with mobile assets should not be trusted any more than you can throw them.




Quote:
I love the movie "Mr Smith goes to Washington", its one my favorites.
Ah, ya sentimental sap..

This year its more like Old Yeller. Lots a yeller and Hydrophobia.
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Old 06-09-2016, 02:39 PM
 
1,260 posts, read 1,931,955 times
Reputation: 1302
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taratova View Post
No , she didn't.. she could have said this..

many ethnic groups built the white house from around the world including the freed slaves and some who were still slaves.. we have come together and it is a better world .. so let us put the past behind us..

far cry from what Michelle said.
But those other ethnic groups were free, not slaves.
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