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Old 06-22-2016, 03:16 PM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
66,092 posts, read 33,490,122 times
Reputation: 14123

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight View Post
So you agree with illegal arrests.

Unless your driving and get pulled over, if the police ask for ID, ask: I'm I being accused of a crime, sir?

Do not give it, until he says yes, you are being accused of a crime. What am I being accused of doing, sir? As you seem to be looking for the ID.
Knowing laws like the back of your hand helps when he says what you have been accused of.
Some things they will say is a crime, are not.
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Old 06-22-2016, 03:26 PM
 
14,298 posts, read 8,074,989 times
Reputation: 4247
Quote:
Originally Posted by legalsea View Post
{snip}

The Court (Justice Thomas writing, joined by four other Justices) concluded that 1) the initial stop was illegal; 2) yet the evidence was not 'illegal fruit' since the officer found said evidence after he arrested the suspect for the outstanding traffic warrant.


The reasoning got beyond me at this point.

{snip}
I think the point here, is that the law already found this man guilty of a crime, and he was essentially hiding from, or at a minimum wanted for arrest by the law.

Law enforcement has already engaged, and seeking the apprehension of this man, and as soon as the officer found out this fact, he was duty bound to arrest him, and the rest of the story unfolded during his arrest.
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Old 06-22-2016, 03:31 PM
 
14,298 posts, read 8,074,989 times
Reputation: 4247
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
Unless your driving and get pulled over, if the police ask for ID, ask: I'm I being accused of a crime, sir?

Do not give it, until he says yes, you are being accused of a crime. What am I being accused of doing, sir? As you seem to be looking for the ID.
Knowing laws like the back of your hand helps when he says what you have been accused of.
Some things they will say is a crime, are not.
So you are saying it's illegal for a police officer to ask you who you are?
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Old 06-22-2016, 03:38 PM
 
Location: Palo Alto
12,172 posts, read 7,010,348 times
Reputation: 4174
It was a bad decision.
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Old 06-22-2016, 03:39 PM
 
Location: Palo Alto
12,172 posts, read 7,010,348 times
Reputation: 4174
Quote:
Originally Posted by OICU812 View Post
So you are saying it's illegal for a police officer to ask you who you are?

An arbitrary request for ID is illegal.
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Old 06-22-2016, 03:48 PM
 
6,054 posts, read 3,077,387 times
Reputation: 4091
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight View Post
So you agree with illegal arrests.
Did justice Thomas not say "the officer's decision was not a flagrant violation of law"
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Old 06-22-2016, 03:52 PM
 
Location: Humboldt Park, Chicago
2,703 posts, read 2,336,172 times
Reputation: 1733
Quote:
Originally Posted by dman72 View Post
Yes, basically it sets up police having the right to stop you for any reason they see fit, at any time.
Don't worry, the police would never abuse that power.
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Old 06-22-2016, 03:56 PM
 
6,054 posts, read 3,077,387 times
Reputation: 4091
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
Unless your driving and get pulled over, if the police ask for ID, ask: I'm I being accused of a crime, sir?

Do not give it, until he says yes, you are being accused of a crime. What am I being accused of doing, sir? As you seem to be looking for the ID.
Knowing laws like the back of your hand helps when he says what you have been accused of.
Some things they will say is a crime, are not.
Reasonable suspicion that a crime is about to happen, is happening, or has happened and you are a suspect you're getting ID'ed.
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Old 06-22-2016, 04:08 PM
 
4,491 posts, read 1,653,033 times
Reputation: 1986
To me, there's no debate that a cop can't ask ID (or, you aren't obligated to give it even if he doesn't care about the law) if there is not reasonable suspicion of a crime being committed. Justice Thomas (a pseudo constitutionalist since he's considered a conservative judge and a true constitutionalist cannot be liberal or conservative as far as I'm concerned) doesn't seem to be saying anything different.

What he does seem to be saying is expanding what constitutes as probable cause. He saw a guy leaving a house that he believed could be a drug house based on a neighbors observation of people coming and going often. Now, that to me just isn't enough. Why specifically stop the guy leaving a house that hardly has any real suspicion outside of a neighbors opinion, but even so, what actual evidence existed to suggest this man did anything illegal? Leaving a house is not a crime, even if the house is owned by a criminal.
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Old 06-22-2016, 04:24 PM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
41,505 posts, read 51,188,639 times
Reputation: 24606
The lesson to be learned is to always pay your traffic tickets or whatever it is that has resulted in an arrest warrant. I might even go to the police station and ask them if they have any outstanding warrants for me and take care of the problem then and there.


IMHO - Even though I disagree with most drug laws I realize they have resulted in a very profitable and lawless criminal economy. I think the officer had a reasonable suspicion that the person was either engaged in illegal transport or possession of drugs and that the stop was legitimate. That suspicion based on the observation was sufficient to justify a stop and search.


I am amused that the RW always complains about liberals coddling criminals but in this case this Liberal agrees with the High Court.
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