U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
View Poll Results: Should marijuana be legal, federal level.
Yes, I am liberal. 25 17.01%
No, I am liberal. 1 0.68%
Yes, I am conservative. 36 24.49%
No, I am conservative. 10 6.80%
Yes, I do not identify as liberal or conservative. 63 42.86%
No, I do not identify as liberal or conservative. 12 8.16%
Voters: 147. You may not vote on this poll

Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 07-27-2016, 04:27 AM
 
Location: Secure, Undisclosed
1,984 posts, read 1,293,385 times
Reputation: 3702

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Propulser View Post
That's United States Code, NOT the Constitution. Please get your Civics 101 tuition back.
Wow. I love it when clueless people display their ignorance.

The constitution gives the government the authority to regulate interstate commerce. 21 USC 301 et seq is how they regulate drugs in interstate commerce.

Free civics lesson. You're welcome.

Last edited by Rescue3; 07-27-2016 at 04:52 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 07-27-2016, 04:46 AM
 
Location: Secure, Undisclosed
1,984 posts, read 1,293,385 times
Reputation: 3702
Quote:
Originally Posted by mishigas73 View Post
Except, of course, for the people for whom it does work.

Now, I haven't been privy to any *gasp* proprietary, non-public studies. What I have been privy to, however, are the testimonials of cancer patients who swear by it. I also just heard from someone who is using it in lieu of muscle relaxers after a back injury to really good effect.

It's been legal here in Washington state for a couple of years now. Have yet to see the "societal consequences". Actually, aside from seeing stores selling pot and pot products, the average person would have absolutely no idea that pot was legal here.
With respect to trials, someone else commented on a 160 patient, double-blind controlled study. Same topic. So the question is, did they seek approval? No, they didn't. There is a ton of anecdotal evidence that people suffering everything from nausea to glaucoma find relief by smoking marijuana. I can tell you that from over 30 years in the medicolegal community that three times as many find relief from their symptoms in a strong vodka and tonic. But a vodka and tonic isn't approved as a drug, either. Neither one has been submitted to FDA in an application seeking approval as a drug. The one sponsor who was granted special permission to raise and test marijuana on humans could not produce a single trial result that showed it was safe and effective at treating anything. Hence, it remains unapproved as a drug in interstate commerce.

Now, as to a recreational intoxicant? I have no argument with that. But the user has be responsible for its sequellae.

As to societal consequences, there are a few. In Colorado, the number of accidental ingestions (in children) showing up at emergency rooms has increased since legalization. The incidence of people losing their licenses for driving under the influence has increased. The number of possession arrests in neighboring states has increased several fold. Tax revenue has increased. The number of people fired from their jobs secondary to drug use has increased. Finally, and this is really ironic, it has increased the black market in drug dealing. The reaon is that local law enforcement will no longer pursue local marijuana dealers who are not licensed. To their mind, if you legalize marijuana in a store, then the guy selling it on the corner is just evading a tax scheme - not a cop's job. So there are consequences - not the 'world is ending' consequences that some would have you believe, but mostly negative consequences for users who use it at the wrong time or place.

Can't speak to Washington - haven't seen any stats from there.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-27-2016, 04:51 AM
 
Location: Secure, Undisclosed
1,984 posts, read 1,293,385 times
Reputation: 3702
Quote:
Originally Posted by Propulser View Post
You're a real expert at being wrong
Thank you. Sorry - I didn't notice you working for me over the last 35 years or attending any of my classes over the last 20 years. So if you think I'm wrong, tell me why.

But bring your A game, because I was there.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-27-2016, 05:03 AM
 
6,062 posts, read 3,107,000 times
Reputation: 4096
Quote:
Originally Posted by notmeofficer View Post
Granny twelve plant... maybe..if we can get compliance under control
Full scale FDA testing ..yes
Reschedule...yes
Full legalization... Maybe..but only with appropriate controls.. over the next twenty years...tied to FDA testing...
Duid roadside test vetted... absolutely..with national 2 ngm limit..or zero tolerance

Welfare benefits and drug testing tied
Absolute right of employers to reject users with testing

There's more..begin there
I think it's time we all put retired ofc drug warrior on ignore
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-27-2016, 05:08 AM
 
Location: Secure, Undisclosed
1,984 posts, read 1,293,385 times
Reputation: 3702
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raddo View Post
Ok, I'm one. I live in Colorado. We are doing just fine here, thanks. Check back with me anytime you want.

You are deliberately trying to mislead.

Again, you are just making things up. This is just one of many:

Do cannabis-based medicinal extracts have general or specific effects on symptoms in multiple sclerosis? A double-blind, randomized, placebo-controlled study on 160 patients

Wow, are you misguided or what? All you have to do to find that you are absolutely wrong about that is FOLLOW THE MONEY.

I have a feeling that in reality you are not misguided, it's just that you have an agenda (as in, you work you law enforcement or the prison industry).
See my comments above about Colorado.

See my comments above about clinical trials. There are thousands of little trials published that say zillions of things are great for zillions of ailments. Until somebody submits them to the government and seeks approval for the article as a drug to treat a specific illness, condition or disease, it will forever languish in the annals of published - but otherwise meaningless - medical literature. If you want to be a pioneer, submit it.

Not trying to mislead; trying to inform. There is a great deal of noise about why marijuana is not legal at the federal level, and virtually all of it is wrong. I happen to have worked in that small community that actually knows why it isn't legal. You may not like the reasoning, but that is for you to fix at the ballot box.

Followed the money for years. Seized a lot of it, too.

Don't have an agenda, either. I'm retired. If I had an anti-marijuana agenda, I would strongly object to its use as a recreational intoxicant. I don't - but the user has to be responsible for any unintended consequences.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-27-2016, 05:10 AM
 
26,354 posts, read 24,519,986 times
Reputation: 16022
Quote:
Originally Posted by peequi View Post
Should marijuana be legal, federal level?


At the federal level, should marijuana be legal. Please note, even if you believe it is a state issue, for the sake of keeping this poll simple, please just assume it is a federal matter. We can make another poll about should the federal government regulate drugs or not. I want to see where this forum stands on the issue as I believe this forum has somewhat of a wide range of people in the USA.
No, it shouldn't be, we have enough problems with stupid people getting behind the wheel of a car, drunk...and marijuana can be lined with any stronger drug...it's just not always pure marijuana.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-27-2016, 07:26 AM
 
3,144 posts, read 886,771 times
Reputation: 2472
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rescue3 View Post
With respect to trials, someone else commented on a 160 patient, double-blind controlled study. Same topic. So the question is, did they seek approval? No, they didn't. There is a ton of anecdotal evidence that people suffering everything from nausea to glaucoma find relief by smoking marijuana. I can tell you that from over 30 years in the medicolegal community that three times as many find relief from their symptoms in a strong vodka and tonic. But a vodka and tonic isn't approved as a drug, either. Neither one has been submitted to FDA in an application seeking approval as a drug. The one sponsor who was granted special permission to raise and test marijuana on humans could not produce a single trial result that showed it was safe and effective at treating anything. Hence, it remains unapproved as a drug in interstate commerce.

Now, as to a recreational intoxicant? I have no argument with that. But the user has be responsible for its sequellae.

As to societal consequences, there are a few. In Colorado, the number of accidental ingestions (in children) showing up at emergency rooms has increased since legalization. The incidence of people losing their licenses for driving under the influence has increased. The number of possession arrests in neighboring states has increased several fold. Tax revenue has increased. The number of people fired from their jobs secondary to drug use has increased. Finally, and this is really ironic, it has increased the black market in drug dealing. The reaon is that local law enforcement will no longer pursue local marijuana dealers who are not licensed. To their mind, if you legalize marijuana in a store, then the guy selling it on the corner is just evading a tax scheme - not a cop's job. So there are consequences - not the 'world is ending' consequences that some would have you believe, but mostly negative consequences for users who use it at the wrong time or place.

Can't speak to Washington - haven't seen any stats from there.
Myself and the others were right, you are indeed clueless.

If you look at the 160 patient study I submitted, you would see it was conducted in the UK by UK doctors. It was submitted to the government and it was approved. UK citizens who are suffering with MS can now legally get a cannabis-based medicine to help relieve their suffering.

There is also a tremendous amount of cannabis related medical research that has been done in Israel that you are ignorant of (or are conveniently ignoring).

So you seem to think that US studies and FDA approval are the only valid places to get information or validation. Well, another thing you are conveniently forgetting is that federal law makes it a crime to research cannabis in this country. We are way, way behind the rest of the world in cannabis research, largely caused by people like you wearing well positioned blinders, and with an inherent bias created by either your professional agenda or the nearly 80 years of government brainwashing that both yourself and your parents have endured.

If you would simply look around, you will find ample evidence indicating you are completely wrong about cannabis not having medicinal properties. Not only are they present, they are strong. If you would like to appear less embarrassingly cluless, start with CNN's "Weed" series, then follow that up with offshore Internet research.

As to Colorado, the small handful of people who got paranoid from eating too many edibles and then going to the emergency room for no reason is completely overshadowed by all the positive aspects of legalization. Some learning and growing pains are to be expected on a venture this new and unprecedented, and I believe those pains have been less than anticipated. I live here, and invite you to come visit. The sky isn't falling, and the ground has not opened up and swallowed Colorado.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rescue3 View Post
Finally, and this is really ironic, it has increased the black market in drug dealing. The reaon is that local law enforcement will no longer pursue local marijuana dealers who are not licensed. To their mind, if you legalize marijuana in a store, then the guy selling it on the corner is just evading a tax scheme - not a cop's job.
I had to re-quote this one because it is so far off base that I wanted to use it as an example of how you are making things up. Nothing could be further from the truth.

The cops now have more time to find illegal grows and stamp them out. Check out Pueblo West, it is a daily occurrence there. If it is a big grow operation, the Feds will be asked to help out, and they do. I assure you, if someone if selling pot on the street outside a dispensary and the owner calls the cops, the illegal seller will be arrested. The counties and the state are keenly aware that every black market sale now directly affects tax revenues, so the cops are being told to aggressively target black market growers and sellers. The results are a state that is much better off than a state like California, a state that is still having to live with and fight the consequences of prohibition (but those days are numbered, fortunately).

Also, you think the black market has expanded, but you are wrong again. Yes, there is plenty of cannabis leaving this state for the black market, and there has been for a long time. Legalization has caused the surrounding states to more vigorously stop cars leaving the state, which might make it appear the black market has grown, but it is only because more violators leaving the state are getting caught.

The truth is that the black market is taking a hit, and the hit will get bigger as more states legalize. I personally have not put any money in the black market for several decades, and there are many millions of people across this country that will stop funding the black market as soon as it is legal in their state.

Last edited by Raddo; 07-27-2016 at 08:00 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-27-2016, 08:42 AM
 
Location: Inland FL
1,254 posts, read 720,876 times
Reputation: 2179
Yes marijuana should be legal. It's a plant for crying out loud!!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-27-2016, 09:09 AM
 
Location: The Windy City
5,300 posts, read 3,305,544 times
Reputation: 4513
Seems like there is only a small portion of Americans who actually support marijuana continuing to stay illegal. In reality, it stays illegal because the "system" profits from it being illegal.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-27-2016, 09:33 AM
 
Location: Secure, Undisclosed
1,984 posts, read 1,293,385 times
Reputation: 3702
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raddo View Post
Myself and the others were right, you are indeed clueless.

If you look at the 160 patient study I submitted, you would see it was conducted in the UK by UK doctors. It was submitted to the government and it was approved. UK citizens who are suffering with MS can now legally get a cannabis-based medicine to help relieve their suffering...
(Sigh...)

I'm sure it was submitted to the UK government, since medicine in the UK is all government sponsored.

But the discussion on the thread is about legalization in the US.

Can you show me a successful Phase III trial submitted to an approved NDA in the US? If you can, then your drug is on its way to approval. If you can't, you may wish to review your 'clueless' comment, because that is how drugs get approved in the US.

I've been retired for a couple years now, but when I left, there still wasn't even a successful Phase II clinical trial that had been submitted.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top