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It has always struck me as unusual that someone with so much authority and trust over life and death decisions, would be able to get in with a High School diploma and after 8-12 weeks of training at the academy, they are on the streets with their field training officer. I'm sure I'm not the only one that has met Police that had questionable reasoning skills to say the least.
I really think there should be a higher standard. Sadly, a Bachelors degree isn't always a guarantee of critical thinking skills, but there should be a higher standard than High School and a couple months at the academy....
But even at that, there are plenty of people, highly educated people in high paying positions, who have questionable thinking skills.
Also, it is not just thinking skills, it is doing all of this under stress, with decisions sometimes having to come in under a second.
A person has to have a certain mind set to do this, education will not automatically make someone think correctly in a stressful situation.
I think more training, their entire career, is needed, and more critical assessment of the results of that training including dismissal. Simply going to the gun range twice a year and taking some classroom instruction is not enough. I also think the police need to stop going out of their way to protect the obvious problem police.
Also, the community needs to realize just how stressed out cops are getting due to the huge numbers of violent offenders that engage in some places every day. The stress level wondering if you are going to get shot or killed on any given call does take its toll, as does the constant needing to physically apprehend someone. As I stated, it takes a specific mindset to do this day in, day out, year after year.
It has always struck me as unusual that someone with so much authority and trust over life and death decisions, would be able to get in with a High School diploma and after 8-12 weeks of training at the academy, they are on the streets with their field training officer. I'm sure I'm not the only one that has met Police that had questionable reasoning skills to say the least.
I really think there should be a higher standard. Sadly, a Bachelors degree isn't always a guarantee of critical thinking skills, but there should be a higher standard than High School and a couple months at the academy....
How do you have "community policing" if no one in the community can qualify for the job and if they DO meet the requirements you want, why waste your life doing police work?
It has always struck me as unusual that someone with so much authority and trust over life and death decisions, would be able to get in with a High School diploma and after 8-12 weeks of training at the academy, they are on the streets with their field training officer. I'm sure I'm not the only one that has met Police that had questionable reasoning skills to say the least.
I really think there should be a higher standard. Sadly, a Bachelors degree isn't always a guarantee of critical thinking skills, but there should be a higher standard than High School and a couple months at the academy....
Do you know how many police related deaths there were in 2015?
But even at that, there are plenty of people, highly educated people in high paying positions, who have questionable thinking skills.
Also, it is not just thinking skills, it is doing all of this under stress, with decisions sometimes having to come in under a second.
A person has to have a certain mind set to do this, education will not automatically make someone think correctly in a stressful situation.
I think more training, their entire career, is needed, and more critical assessment of the results of that training including dismissal. Simply going to the gun range twice a year and taking some classroom instruction is not enough. I also think the police need to stop going out of their way to protect the obvious problem police.
Also, the community needs to realize just how stressed out cops are getting due to the huge numbers of violent offenders that engage in some places every day. The stress level wondering if you are going to get shot or killed on any given call does take its toll, as does the constant needing to physically apprehend someone. As I stated, it takes a specific mindset to do this day in, day out, year after year.
Straw man argument. The vast majority of police work is NOT gun fights and car chases every waking minute of their shift. It's actually rare, I have many friends who are intelligent Police. But for the others, if they can't even figure out simple situations that are non stressful as is often the case, I can only imagine what they are like when they are under stress.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinm
How do you have "community policing" if no one in the community can qualify for the job and if they DO meet the requirements you want, why waste your life doing police work?
Felons and drug addicts are also part of the community. As are illiterate people. So are HS drop outs. Should we make them cops too, using that logic? They are after all part of the community...
Also, when I lived in Tacoma, and I called each of the Community Policing Officers after one of the responding officers gave me their info. I called for months. Left voice mails. Not one call returned. Same with the neighbor next to me who did the same after I moved. All about a drug house behind me. I mean they were selling and smoking it in broad daylight in the alley behind me...
Tell me again about community policing.
And as far as paying them more, most cops in Seattle with about the same amount of time on the job as an IT person will out earn an IT Engineer. UNIONS....They are already paid a lot of money in most places.
Straw man argument. The vast majority of police work is NOT gun fights and car chases every waking minute of their shift. It's actually rare, I have many friends who are intelligent Police. But for the others, if they can't even figure out simple situations that are non stressful as is often the case, I can only imagine what they are like when they are under stress.
Felons and drug addicts are also part of the community. As are illiterate people. So are HS drop outs. Should we make them cops too, using that logic? They are after all part of the community...
Also, when I lived in Tacoma, and I called each of the Community Policing Officers after one of the responding officers gave me their info. I called for months. Left voice mails. Not one call returned. Same with the neighbor next to me who did the same after I moved. All about a drug house behind me. I mean they were selling and smoking it in broad daylight in the alley behind me...
Tell me again about community policing.
And as far as paying them more, most cops in Seattle with about the same amount of time on the job as an IT person will out earn an IT Engineer. UNIONS....They are already paid a lot of money in most places.
Frankly, the paperwork and judicial process that underpins the justice system would benefit from cops with more education. As would the actual, not informal, rules of police interaction with society.
Police unions are among the most politically powerful unions in any city.
Straw man argument. The vast majority of police work is NOT gun fights and car chases every waking minute of their shift. It's actually rare, I have many friends who are intelligent Police. But for the others, if they can't even figure out simple situations that are non stressful as is often the case, I can only imagine what they are like when they are under stress.
It does not matter how often it happens, point is that it can and does happen.
Most of the military, hell, all of it, never or rarely engages in any kind of combat or disaster type scenario, yet they train constantly for it, and the standards for recruitment and training are in mind for when they do have to do it.
Same with the police, most of the time they are not doing anything stressful, but fact is they can encounter it at any time.
You recruit based upon worst case scenario, and the fact the employee has to be able to completely full fill the requirements of the position, no matter how rare it occurs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tac-Sea
And as far as paying them more, most cops in Seattle with about the same amount of time on the job as an IT person will out earn an IT Engineer. UNIONS....They are already paid a lot of money in most places.
It does not matter how much they are currently paid, if you want to attract better talent, you are going to have to pay more.
It has always struck me as unusual that someone with so much authority and trust over life and death decisions, would be able to get in with a High School diploma and after 8-12 weeks of training at the academy, they are on the streets with their field training officer. I'm sure I'm not the only one that has met Police that had questionable reasoning skills to say the least.
I really think there should be a higher standard. Sadly, a Bachelors degree isn't always a guarantee of critical thinking skills, but there should be a higher standard than High School and a couple months at the academy....
Well first, do you actually know what the screening process is? If not, why are you commenting? Police go through a rigerious process. They even do lie detector tests in many districts. They give them psychological evaluations. They usually require an associates degree or some college.
I think cops need more training on how to react in stressful situations. A lot of times the force they use is not necessary because they panic.
Navy Seals don't all have a college degree so your education comment is not relevant.
So Sandra Bland was arrested and beaten because it was stressful for the cop to see her smoking in her car at the end of the traffic stop? Or was it another power hungry cop that got into a position of authority with little barrier to entry, then didn't realize the dash cam video would contradict his alleged assault by Ms. Bland as he noted in his report, because he couldn't think beyond his own nose?
Another straw man argument. Navy SEALs (correct spelling, FYI...) get 3 years of training before hey are deployed to a combat zone, and the process to weed them out is intense both physically and educationally. Furthermore, SEAL's are commanded by college educated OFFICERS....Your argument is invalid, as you are comparing people who are trained to kill for YEARS, to people who are trained to protect and enforce laws that determine your fate, after a few months of training...
Note that commissioned military officers, military pilots, etc. have to have a Bachelors degree minimum. When you are the decision maker about peoples lives, there is a higher standard. Except in Law Enforcement, so you can come at me with all the "well Delta Force doesn't have a degree so why do cops need one" arguments, but really, try to think a little more critically than that...You're comparing an elite team of people that has an extreme selection process very few people ever make it through, to a 21 year old beat cop in Oklahoma who got hired onto the force by his buddy...
The point you seem to miss is that college education provides another barrier to entry, common for many professions with far less responsibility over others.
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