The big ObamaCare bubble is about to explode! (Pelosi, examples, retired)
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Realistically, just calculate exactly how much each person has contributed, calculate interest on that and when they've spent what they contributed, they are done. No more health coverage for them. They can go pay for it themselves after they've spent their allowance.
Works for me!!!
I would agree to that as long as my heirs would inherit tax-free the balance of what I've paid for decades, plus interest, but didn't receive in benefits.
The ACA paves the way for fully nationalized healthcare. People will clamor for it. In my opinion, that was the long game.
Wrong. Majority still have superior Employer Insurance. I guess you forgot the 2010 election backlash-nat'l care would create an affect against Democrats (Socialists) 5x as harsh.
I haven't worked in 15 years. I'm not a slave. No one is forcing me to work.
I don't work, either. I retired and laid off all my employees. I refuse to be a tax slave anymore.
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Drop it you failed.
On the contrary, my post with the data citing the fact that 45.3% of all income-earning tax units pay no federal income tax whatsoever PROVES the fact that the 54.7% who DO pay, are forced into slavery to support the others.
Wrong. Majority still have superior Employer Insurance. I guess you forgot the 2010 election backlash-nat'l care would create an affect against Democrats (Socialists) 5x as harsh.
I still have employer-paid health care (that I haven't used in seven years) for $722 / year. I would call that superior. I actually intend to NEVER use it. I've had exactly two medical incidents in my entire life -- I double-dislocated my left index finger in 2009 and had very good occupational therapy until the finger surgeon insisted upon finger surgery which negated all of the therapy, and last year I had a vasectomy which I just paid for out of pocket without involving my insurance at all.
But, as you can see from much of the thread, I'm an anomaly and my coverage is an anomaly.
Watch what happens as more premiums skyrocket, as more young people come online as voters, as more older people age out as voters.
I predict a government takeover of the industry by 2025.
I don't work, either. I retired and laid off all my employees. I refuse to be a tax slave anymore.
On the contrary, my post with the data citing the fact that 45.3% of all income-earning tax units pay no federal income tax whatsoever PROVES the fact that the 54.7% who DO pay, are forced into slavery to support the others.
And the flip side of that one is the tax that employers pay for having employees. It gets counted against the employer but it comes out of what the employee would've otherwise made.
While I do not doubt your sincerity, I do doubt the wisdom of instituting a single-payer.
The underlying problem that Obama never bothered to solve first: Escalating healthcare costs. It's been forever since the Reader's Digest pointed out some of the ugliest examples of overcharging. Nothing has changed since though. It was $15 per Tylenol pill. Now it costs more. It costs $8 for a box of tissues (billed as mucus recovery system). Now it costs more. A pair of sterile gloves cost $53 per pair. Now it costs more. The little plastic cup they put your meds in cost $10 each. Now it costs more. The use of the Blood Pressure cuff (which ended up getting reused anyways) was $20 per use. Now it costs more. An alcohol swab cost $23 each. Now it costs more. The same prescription drugs made by the same RX manufacturers cost vastly more in the USA than they do in Europe and Canada.
Yes, those costs are billed to the private insurance companies and not the patients. And yes, single payer programs like Medicare can refuse to pay the ripoff prices. When they do that, hospitals and clinics just refuse to take Medicare. The solution? You have to do something to stop them from overcharging insurance companies like that. And when they are no longer overcharging insurance companies, then you can start doing what ACA was intended to do: Getting insurance companies to stop charging such insanely high premiums, so that lower income Americans can actually afford them.
First, get the average costs of healthcare down to European levels and then talking about single payer systems starts to make sense. If you don't solve that first, you get exactly what we're seeing with Obamacare: Insurance companies actually losing money and ultimately being forced to withdraw from the exchanges. Make it a federally owned system and that system will turn into a giant black hole sucking down money faster and faster.
Eight pages into the thread and no one gets to the heart of the issue which is: ^^^^^ all this.
We can squabble back and forth until were blue in the face, but at the core cost is THE issue, the elephant in the room no politician will discuss. Health care costs skyrocketed in part due to insurance subsidization. Prior to ACA people paid their fairly reasonable premiums and deductibles and didn't see an itemized bill showing those individual charges of $50 latex gloves and $10 kleenex. As long as the premium money came pouring in insurance companies could foot those exorbitant costs and make a tidy profit, too.
So now, we want to have more - actually ALL- people insured. Great idea, right? Obamacare right off the bat utterly FAILED to approach coverage for all from the cost angle, which is hardly a minor consideration. Liberals decide the best plan of attack is to make it cost MORE for the average person. Makes so much sense Same thing with student loans, housing, everything- I just don't get it. I tend to be socially more liberal but fiscally very conservative. Yes we want to create safety nets, but you can't just enable and De-incentivize work even more than it already has been. You also can't have your cake and eat, and the government knows this. Single payer would be an even bigger disaster. Even more expense, less coverage, and once again the working/middle class gets stiffed with the bill.
ETA: Someone upthread suggested charging premiums by waist measurement. That's...actually not a bad idea. Waist measurement is a fairly accurate indicator or overall health, especially if it reaches a certain point- better than BMI according to health professionals: https://health.clevelandclinic.org/2...e-your-health/
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Same thing with student loans, housing, everything- I just don't get it. I tend to be socially more liberal but fiscally very conservative. Yes we want to create safety nets, but you can't just enable and De-incentivize work even more than it already has been. You also can't have your cake and eat, and the government knows this. Single payer would be an even bigger disaster. Even more expense, less coverage, and once again the working/middle class gets stiffed with the bill.
