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Old 09-01-2016, 09:11 AM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
1,050 posts, read 505,593 times
Reputation: 296

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quick Enough View Post
""Tax and spend"? YES! We are not taxing (enough) and we are not spending (enough) where it is most beneficial'

Wrong!
Tax burdens are at historic lows. - Tax Burden At Historic Low?
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Old 09-01-2016, 09:14 AM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
1,050 posts, read 505,593 times
Reputation: 296
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
Crony Capitalism doesn't kill itself. It kills capitalism. Crony Capitalism is what we have today.
So what are the main events you would expect as crony capitalism kills itself? Where do you see it leading?
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Old 09-01-2016, 11:36 AM
 
Location: PA
5,562 posts, read 5,682,324 times
Reputation: 1962
I feel what government spends money on will ALWAYS be a argument. So your not going to solve that.
So my idea is that government needs to be limited. Yet it also needs to balance a check book and generally have revenue.


There is my proposal

Remove the "federal income tax completely"

Replace all federal revenve will a 3% sales tax.

Exempt is food, clothes and housing Everything else is taxed


What we spend money on "stuff" is what government gets its revenue from what they spend it on is up to them.
Everyone pays 3% on crap they buy no more worrying about tax brackets and IRS nonsense.
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Old 09-01-2016, 11:51 AM
 
Location: not normal, IL
776 posts, read 580,582 times
Reputation: 917
Jealousy is when someone ask someone else to go out in the world and/or take the advise of a professional in their field over that of a one sided, probably bias t.v. show or internet article? No, the problem with low-knowledge voters is they think they are highly educated and can't learn because they know everything and will never be wrong. I admit, I could do better on giving sights and examples, but do know how to tell when someone is really stupid, they tell you to shut up because they're not smart enough to debate you or know your right, with that I'm done. Thanks to all who posted good information to make this an intellectual thread.
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Old 09-01-2016, 12:36 PM
 
Location: The ends DO NOT justify the means!!!
4,783 posts, read 3,741,829 times
Reputation: 1336
Fees for services. Have government operate like a business rather than a criminal organization of racketeering, extortion, and theft. The government "business" can offer (not force) services to people in exchange for a fee. Then the government can use the fees collected to continue offering services. They don't need to use guns to threaten their slaves into "purchasing" their "services". Our government runs like a mob. "Taxes" are virtually always nothing more that a disgusting form of racketeering, extortion, theft, or one of the "protection rackets". Then they have all of those "fees" that we must pay to keep our "rights"...er because we pay for them they really are just privileges We are not humans with rights, we are slaves, subjects, and "citizens" with "privileges" given or taken away by the whim of thug government.

IF the thug criminal government operated like a peaceful, voluntary business in a free market that actually offered services that people actually wanted, they would be a very profitable business with no need to rely only upon violence, aggression, and coercion.

No one would pay "taxes", read be robbed or extorted from, but virtually everyone would voluntarily purchase these "great" and "wonderful" services happily.
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Old 09-01-2016, 12:37 PM
 
1,304 posts, read 1,093,804 times
Reputation: 2717
Quote:
Originally Posted by LibertyandJusticeforAll View Post
I feel what government spends money on will ALWAYS be a argument. So your not going to solve that.
So my idea is that government needs to be limited. Yet it also needs to balance a check book and generally have revenue.


There is my proposal

Remove the "federal income tax completely"

Replace all federal revenve will a 3% sales tax.

Exempt is food, clothes and housing Everything else is taxed


What we spend money on "stuff" is what government gets its revenue from what they spend it on is up to them.
Everyone pays 3% on crap they buy no more worrying about tax brackets and IRS nonsense.
So, everyone who pays rent via cash to landlords, or cuts a check would skip on that 3%? Who would be responsible for filing the tax? The recipient? The tenant?

Not to pick on your specific idea, I just don't think it's pays enough attention to detail. As someone else noted, this is a very complicated country with 300,000,000 people of all walks of life. I don't think blanket statements would fix things as much as make things worse.
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Old 09-01-2016, 12:40 PM
 
1,304 posts, read 1,093,804 times
Reputation: 2717
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kode View Post
Federal tax brackets are at historical lows. We should return temporarily to the brackets (adjusted for inflation) that we had when Reagan took office before dropping them back to where he set them (adjusted for inflation). You can't cut your way to prosperity. The additional revenue should be used on huge and numerous infrastructure projects.

The defense budget should be cut in half. There's plenty of waste there. PLENTY.

Social Security is a good deal and a great program. I calculated my average IRR to be 4.5%. Not bad. But the cap should be removed to keep S.S. solvent for the future.

Obamacare is getting to be unaffordable for many. We should save money on healthcare by switching to a single-payer national healthcare system.

Private prisons are proving to be expensive and contrary to the correct goals. We should save money by eliminating them and handling them via government.

We should cut or eliminate financial support for Israel. They have free education through college, free healthcare, and who is making it possible? It's time they paid more of their own way.
I pretty much agree with all of this, but the last item should be expanded to many, many other countries. We've been paying Egypt hundreds of millions just so they NOT start a war they'd lose against Israel? That doesn't make any sense to me. Quit paying people to be nice to each other and let these countries take a black eye or two. Maybe that'll teach em to be good neighbors.
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Old 09-01-2016, 12:50 PM
 
45,225 posts, read 26,437,203 times
Reputation: 24980
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kode View Post
Tax burdens are at historic lows. - Tax Burden At Historic Low?
Maybe, but regardless the tax haul has been breaking records. What do you suppose politicians do with all our stolen loot?
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Old 09-01-2016, 01:15 PM
 
1,955 posts, read 1,759,830 times
Reputation: 5179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kode View Post
What I know is that democrats have tried to get bills through to raise tax revenue on just those who can afford it without any suffering in order to fund infrastructure projects and put people to work at good-paying jobs, and the republicans obstructed all of it, like most everything else in their zeal to make Obama a "do nothing president".

GOP senators block top Obama jobs initiative - CNNPolitics.com

Bills Republicans Have Blocked | Republicans for Obama



Education? -
https://www.goodcall.com/news/inther...senators-04345

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...nate-now-what/
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kode View Post
What I know is that democrats have tried to get bills through to raise tax revenue on just those who can afford it without any suffering in order to fund infrastructure projects and put people to work at good-paying jobs, and the republicans obstructed all of it, like most everything else in their zeal to make Obama a "do nothing president".

GOP senators block top Obama jobs initiative - CNNPolitics.com

Bills Republicans Have Blocked | Republicans for Obama
The problem with the jobs bill is that it may have unintended negative consequences.

See, the reason American companies outsource is because they can get more work done for less money outside of the country. Oftentimes, it's even higher quality work done, for less money, outside of the country. If these American companies did not outsource, then they would be beaten by their international competition, which uses overseas labor. So American companies have to outsource in order to remain competitive and no go under.

Now if you force the issue, and try to force American companies to not outsource by means of taxation and/or tax breaks, then basically you are forcing the companies to become less competitive, and more likely to fail in an international market. The only way to mitigate this problem is to remove our country from the international market and turn us seclusionary, like China used to be. But I really don't think that's a good idea, it prohibits growth and builds hostility.

The jobs bill is just a bandaid, treating a symptom, and not the root cause of the problem. The root cause of the problem is that American companies can get more high quality work done outside of the country for less money than inside of it. That's the problem that needs to be solved. I'm not entirely sure how to solve it, but the jobs bill doesn't do it. The jobs bill may make it worse. There needs to be more thought put into this problem.

Now I won't pretend for a second that the above is that actual reason that the dumb republicans are voting against it. They just want more money, just like the dumb democrats. Politicians are all crooks.


There's a giant problem with this one too. What the democrats are proposing is a bailout of the student loan industry, at the height of the student loan bubble, before it pops. Now just a few posts ago you stated that we should not have bailed out the banks. Well, the same is true here. We do not need to be bailing out the student loan industry, when they have been making bad loan upon bad loan upon bad loan.

See, the real problem here is that kids are able to borrow unprecedented amounts of money to go to school. And if a school knows that the kid will be allowed to borrow a kajillion dollars for school, then all of a sudden, the school is going to "realize" that they need to raise their tuition to a kajillion dollars. Because they need it. Etc etc barf.

Then the kid graduates from school with a degree in basket weaving, and they owe a kajillion dollars. They can't pay. The student loan industry then realizes the GIANT mistake they've made in loaning the 18 yo basket weaver a kajillion dollars, realize they are about to get stiffed and go broke, and then they call out to the government "help me help me!" And the government wants to bail them out. No, sorry, that's not going to fix anything.

Now, this problem I know how to solve. Step 1, allow student loans to be discharged in bankruptcies. Step 2, allow the student loan bubble to pop, and allow the loan agencies to fail and fold. Step 3, restructure the laws on how much a loan agency is allowed to loan to a student. It is a fairly easy matter to find out the average starting salary for a particular degree, and then calculate how much of that salary would be reasonable for paying back a loan, then extrapolate that amount over, what, 20 years or so, and then capping the allowable student loans that anyone can take for use in that degree program at that amount. No more loans for basket weaving.

Then, also you could also make the loans merit based. Every semester, the student submits their grades to the loan agency. If you have an A average, then you get the full loan amount next semester. If not, then the amount goes down. In order to prevent a particular school from handing out cheap A's, you could assign a multiplier to each school based on average starting salary of their graduates. This would be harder to implement because of the data collection requirements, but it would be an even better solution to the student loan crisis because you will no longer have folks who really didn't belong in college racking up so much debt that they'll never be able to pay off.




What I really wish... is that smart people would work together to try to find real solutions to problems outside of politics. The left vs right and my side vs your side is so blinding that it turns everything into a football game to be won at all costs. It's all about hating the other side. We're never going to solve anything that way. We're ALL Americans. We need to work together.
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Old 09-01-2016, 01:30 PM
 
1,955 posts, read 1,759,830 times
Reputation: 5179
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quick Enough View Post
Have you done an audit on defense?

By your post I would imagine that you do NOT know that defense spending under Obama has gone WAY down.

In fact we are in WORSE shape NOW then where we were before WWII.
This is so true. So many people are missing this. Sequestration happened. The defense budget took huge cuts. The effects are rippling, and they haven't been pretty.

People say just cut the defense budget and that will fix everything. Well, we DID cut the defense budget. A LOT. And it hasn't fixed anything yet. All of the means tested entitlement spending just increased to fill the gap. We have not gained a thing. And I notice that the other side of the line (the non-defense items on the budget) didn't take their part of the cuts. The defense side is the only side who kept up their end of the bargain.

Cut the rest of the spending by the same percentage as we already cut defense during sequestration. If you do that, THEN I will also allow you to raise my taxes. But we ALL have to put some blood in.
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