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Old 09-09-2016, 03:44 PM
 
14,221 posts, read 6,961,631 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
No. The first stage of a child's development is the responsibility of the parents unless they are orphaned or the parents are unfit.

I've always been in favor of free K-12 education for children.
Its not FREE! NOTHING IS FREE! Why do you support free stuff!??!? If you really believe it is the responsibility of parents to pay for their children, then naturally both pre-school and K-12 should be paid out-of-pocket by the parents and not burden the taxpayers with their choices.
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Old 09-09-2016, 03:44 PM
 
1,423 posts, read 1,050,389 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
Simply not true. In many northern European countries the only way to not attend high school if you really want to is to basically be mentally challenged. Many go to vocational training out of a desire to become a plumber or whatever.
It's perfectly true because I am from such a country.
You just cherry pick.
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Old 09-09-2016, 03:45 PM
 
34,619 posts, read 21,615,505 times
Reputation: 22232
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
Its not FREE! NOTHING IS FREE! Why do you support free stuff!??!? If you really believe it is the responsibility of parents to pay for their children, then naturally both pre-school and K-12 should be paid out-of-pocket by the parents and not burden the taxpayers with their choices.
True, it's not free.

Do you want the government to provide everything for everyone?
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Old 09-09-2016, 03:49 PM
 
14,221 posts, read 6,961,631 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t206 View Post
1. The "other countries" example is not a solution.
2. Putting regulations on public schools to limit what they can charge will limit their ability to compete to attract the best students and administration as they won't have the revenue to continually upgrade campus facilities, waste on football programs, and hire the best staff. You will likely see the quality of public schools diminish fairly quickly.

Now, what is your issue with actually digging to the root cause of the rapid inflationary costs that are likely a result of government involvement, greedy administrations, and others like teachers unions, lobbyists, athletic programs, etc?

I don't understand why the gut reaction is to try and giveaway something as soon as it becomes too expensive, rather than to take a serious look at WHY its so expensive and try to fix it. If its too expensive for the individual, its going to be too expensive for the tax payer to subsidize, because the tax payer is mostly just the individual who cant afford it collectively.
OH, yes, lets privatize them and see how that goes. Terrible idea. The taxpayer benefit massively from making it tuition free. Tax systems work PROGRESSIVELY so obviously the rich will pay more into the system than the middle class. The best students will go to public schools as the best and the brightest with limited means will always see this as a great option. Let the lazy children of the elite go to the private schools where the size of their wallet and not their IQ matters the most.
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Old 09-09-2016, 03:52 PM
 
34,619 posts, read 21,615,505 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
OH, yes, lets privatize them and see how that goes. Terrible idea. The taxpayer benefit massively from making it tuition free. Tax systems work PROGRESSIVELY so obviously the rich will pay more into the system than the middle class. The best students will go to public schools as the best and the brightest will limited means will always see this as a great option.
Do you want government to pay for everything for everyone via taxes are total privatization?
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Old 09-09-2016, 03:52 PM
 
14,221 posts, read 6,961,631 times
Reputation: 6059
Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
True, it's not free.

Do you want the government to provide everything for everyone?
Nope, but pre-school, education and health care should definitely be a public undertaking. The same with support for the disabled. The market is NOT the best solution in every instance, even a far right person like you seem to admit that.
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Old 09-09-2016, 03:55 PM
 
14,221 posts, read 6,961,631 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yueng-ling View Post
It's perfectly true because I am from such a country.
You just cherry pick.
So you just generalized the entire world outside of America and point to ONE single country? Ridiculous.
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Old 09-09-2016, 03:56 PM
 
34,619 posts, read 21,615,505 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
Nope
So you want everything privatized.
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Old 09-09-2016, 03:58 PM
 
Location: On the phone
1,227 posts, read 633,459 times
Reputation: 2435
Quote:
Originally Posted by marigolds6 View Post
Wait a sec....
There are over 12 million students enrolled at public universities. Take that over 10 years, and that is 120 million student-years of enrollment. That's only $4.2k per student per year.
And that assumes that there is no growth in the number of students at public universities when tuition is free.
Average tuition _now_ at public universities is $9.4k/year. How are you going to cut the cost of providing a college education in half despite 10 years of inflation and have the same quality education?

I suspect that education at public universities will become very bare bones, actually deepening the haves vs have nots divide by damaging the reputation of degrees from public universities vs private universities.
Pull the lever, vote for Hillary and advance to the 13th grade. Your Masters Degree will be as valuable as today's High school diploma. Universities will have to create a "Super Doctorate Program" so some grads can stand out in the crowd.
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Old 09-09-2016, 04:01 PM
 
18,802 posts, read 8,471,648 times
Reputation: 4130
Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
Why not print up $1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 and let everyone quit their jobs, buy mansions and Bentleys and call it a day?
Inflation.

Higher education for the willing masses will have a much better long term positive economic and social impact and investment return then simply everyone buying luxuries.

As will HC and massive infrastructure development.
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