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The guy knew why, he refused to comply with orders from the flight crew. Law enforcement arrived and he still refused to comply, so they had to use force.
Flight crew stated he has been selected to be bumped, and need to leave the plane; I do not see how anyone can interpret this anything other than that. He refused to do as instructed, so the flight crew had to call for law enforcement.
Go do this in any store and see what happens, the same thing will occur. Go sit in Walmart and refuse to leave when the staff tells you to, they will call the cops. If you fail to comply with the cops, they will use force. You can go try this out this weekend and please report the results back to us.
But if I purchased a product from Walmart, I have the right to take my purchase with me. See the difference?
The guy knew why, he refused to comply with orders from the flight crew. Law enforcement arrived and he still refused to comply, so they had to use force.
Flight crew stated he has been selected to be bumped, and need to leave the plane; I do not see how anyone can interpret this anything other than that. He refused to do as instructed, so the flight crew had to call for law enforcement.
Go do this in any store and see what happens, the same thing will occur. Go sit in Walmart and refuse to leave when the staff tells you to, they will call the cops. If you fail to comply with the cops, they will use force. You can go try this out this weekend and please report the results back to us.
Yeah, but how often have you gone to Walmart, paid for your stuff, and then been told to leave without what you just paid for?
You people are absurd. Youve gotten so scared & submissive that you think shutting your mouth & meekly accepting is the only proper behavior. You are actually BLAMING this guy for being dragged out of a plane. Wow, that is truly pathetic.
I'm shocked to see on TV that the hosts are claiming that United and other airlines have in the small print that they can throw you off the flight for overbooking while you are already seated!
That is insane if that is even true!
It looks like a dictatorship and Russian roulette of who can stay=live and who will be eliminated=dead, off the flight!
In reading about this incident, as well as various reports about how the airlines typically 'overbook' a flight (on the assumption that a certain number of people will not show), got me to thinking: is this 'overbooking' explanation still valid?
We shall ignore, for now, the United incident. From what I read it was not a true 'overbooking' situation, but rather they needed the four seats so United employees could get to their work in another city.
Now, I have been flying since the 1970s. It used to be, you called your travel agent (or the airline) and reserved seats on a particular flight, although I do not recall actually being assigned a particular seat number or row. No money was required, or paid, until you arrived at the airport.
Indeed, I have read that back in the 1950s and 1960s (and probably into the 70s), it was not uncommon for travelers to reserve seats on multiple flights (since no money was required up-front), and then decide later which flight they would actually take. Hence, overbooking a flight back then would be common.
Here is my point: nowadays, when I travel, I go directly to the airline website (usually American, since I am in Fort Worth). I look at my flight options for each flight (to and from) and make my flight selection; I am then taken to a chart showing the 'available seats', and I then make my selection of seats; I then finish up and charge the fare to my credit card.
My presumption is that American (and the other airlines) are only showing me, on said charts, seats that are actually available for purchase. It seems unlikely that American would show seats 13A and B, Row 15, for instance, if said seats were already sold. When all seats on the flight have been purchased, then said flight would no longer be available.
Of course, people may still show up at the airport and get on 'stand by', since people do still fail to appear (like me, once, when I became ill the day before).
Does anyone have actual knowledge about the procedures today? Do airlines engage in the tactic I mention, i.e., show as 'available' seats that have already been purchased? I do not see how an airline, in this modern computer age, can 'overbook' seats.
They Overbook with people who don't yet have an assigned seats, so they show up at the airport and hope to get a seat (which most do). In decades of flying I have never seen someone removed from a plane.
The Doc had an assigned seat and, as a lawyer mentioned, the Airline right to deny boarding extends only to the gate area and not to removing a seated passenger from the plane unless he is a safety risk.
The guy knew why, he refused to comply with orders from the flight crew. Law enforcement arrived and he still refused to comply, so they had to use force.
Flight crew stated he has been selected to be bumped, and need to leave the plane; I do not see how anyone can interpret this anything other than that. He refused to do as instructed, so the flight crew had to call for law enforcement.
Go do this in any store and see what happens, the same thing will occur. Go sit in Walmart and refuse to leave when the staff tells you to, they will call the cops. If you fail to comply with the cops, they will use force. You can go try this out this weekend and please report the results back to us.
I realize this might be a difficult concept to grasp, but there is a difference between between trespassing and being robbed of something you have purchased.
Regardless of the fine print, this passenger had purchased a ticket, checked in, and was sitting in his assigned seat.
To get your Walmart analogy to make sense, imagine you've purchased a box of diapers and on your way out of the store, the police wrestle it from you, saying someone else needs these diapers. They assure you the fine print on your receipt says they are entitled to steal purchased items back.
You people are absurd. Youve gotten so scared & submissive that you think shutting your mouth & meekly accepting is the only proper behavior. You are actually BLAMING this guy for being dragged out of a plane. Wow, that is truly pathetic.
Nobody is scared and submissive, we are just not screaming cry babies that understand that resisting like that is a great way to get thrown in jail. I'm happy to stand up for my rights, but also understand that acting like a lunatic on a plane these days is a great way to get thrown in jail, and possibly never be allowed to fly again. Unlike this man, most people that you claim are "scared and submissive" are just rational adults who have the mental capacity to deal with a bad situation and not make it worse.
Leaked United CEO Email To Employees About Incident
Below is a leaked email sent to employees about this incident:
Quote:
Dear Team,
Like you, I was upset to see and hear about what happened last night aboard United Express Flight 3411 headed from Chicago to Louisville.
While the facts and circumstances are still evolving, especially with respect to why this customer defied Chicago Aviation Security Officers the way he did, to give you a clearer picture of what transpired, I've included below a recap from the preliminary reports filed by our employees.
As you will read, this situation was unfortunately compounded when one of the passengers we politely asked to deplane refused and it became necessary to contact Chicago Aviation Security Officers to help.
Our employees followed established procedures for dealing with situations like this. While I deeply regret this situation arose, I also emphatically stand behind all of you, and I want to commend you for continuing to go above and beyond to ensure we fly right.
I do, however, believe there are lessons we can learn from this experience, and we are taking a close look at the circumstances surrounding this incident. Treating our customers and each other with respect and dignity is at the core of who we are, and we must always remember this no matter how challenging the situation.
Oscar
Summary of Flight 3411
On Sunday April 9, after United Express Flight 3411 was fully boarded, United's gate agents were approached by crew members that were told they needed to board the flight.
We sought volunteers and then followed our involuntary denial of boarding process (including offering up to $1,000 in compensation) and when we approached one of these passengers to explain apologetically that he was being denied boarding, he raised his voice and refused to comply with crew member instructions.
He was approached a few more times after that in order to gain his compliance to come off the aircraft, and each time he refused and became more and more disruptive and belligerent.
Our agents were left with no choice but to call Chicago Aviation Security Officers to assist in removing the customer from the flight. He repeatedly declined to leave.
Chicago Aviation Security Officers were unable to gain his co-operation and physically removed him from the flight as he continued to resist - running back onto the aircraft in defiance of both our crew and security officials.
I'm shocked to see on TV that the hosts are claiming that United and other airlines have in the small print that they can throw you off the flight for overbooking while you are already seated!
That is insane if that is even true!
It looks like a dictatorship and Russian roulette of who can stay=live and who will be eliminated=dead, off the flight!
Wow!
Not quite.
Read my previous response.
United is trying to justify their actions based on the fine print, but that print only deals with denied boarding. They have no legal basis for their actions, and now the blind United supporters are focusing on the passengers actions instead of criticizing United for their ineptitude.
Quote:
“Denied boarding” means exactly that, argues Banzhaf – a passenger may be prevented from boarding an over-booked flight providing the compensation required by law is offered. But this passenger was clearly not ” denied boarding ,” since he had already been permitted to board, and to take his seat.
Having boarded and been seated, a passenger is generally entitled to keep a seat and remain on the flight, except in rare instances: e.g., a legitimate concern about terrorism, unruly or drunken behavior by the passenger, it is suddenly discovered that he is ill, is using a forged or stolen ticket, etc. Here, none of these rare exceptions applied, so the carrier had no right to eject him once he had validly boarded, says Banzhaf.
I'm shocked to see on TV that the hosts are claiming that United and other airlines have in the small print that they can throw you off the flight for overbooking while you are already seated!
That is insane if that is even true!
It looks like a dictatorship and Russian roulette of who can stay=live and who will be eliminated=dead, off the flight!
Wow!
In order to change this, Congress has to amend Federal law.
In the late 1990s there was a big push to pass the Airline PASSENGER's Bill of Rights. It was mostly opposed by GOP other than John McCain who was a co-sponsor.
Then, 9/11/2001 hit and that bill was set aside.
It's another good example of CORPORATE GREED most often defended by GOP.
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Leaked United CEO Email To Employees About Incident
