Of Those Who Are Against 'Socialized' Medical Care.... (NAFTA, England, race)

[anifani821]

Originally Posted by Acupunk

I'm not sure the hospitals and Pharma want the government involved because if the people demand controls on those industries it could hurt them.

I agree increased education on holistic preventive care will not likely be funded, meditation is free, there aren't any meditation industry lobbyists out there.

Me! And you! We can have our own march - and I bet we may be surprised how many other "regular citizens" would show up!

[LNTT_Vacationer]

Originally Posted by Acupunk

This is using misinformation and scare tactics, I have chosen to focus on reform, but these type of posts are ridiculous and I thought we had move past this silliness.

I can see why you fear getting flamed


There is no misinformation in stating that anyone should be scared to have their personal choices in healthcare reduced; or to actually dare question whether the gov't can run such a program better than a private, market-based capitalist system. Look at what they've done to social security. The same one's that have managed that retirement system are now proposing to manage everyone's healthcare. Try calling the SSA and informing them how you'd like to "choose" your retirement portfolio be set-up.

But I'll concede that if one wants to have the gov't responsible for their retirement system; having them take over their health is a logical next choice. Then they can clamor for universal auto insurance, universal food, universal shelter. . . countries have gone this route.

In any event, it's a virtual impossible goal. Those with more resources are always going to have access to better anything. Nothing "universal" about any of this stuff. Healthcare is a commodity to be purchased; not a constitutional right.

[detshen]

Originally Posted by LNTT_Vacationer

I can see why you fear getting flamed


There is no misinformation in stating that anyone should be scared to have their personal choices in healthcare reduced; or to actually dare question whether the gov't can run such a program better than a private, market-based capitalist system. Look at what they've done to social security. The same one's that have managed that retirement system are now proposing to manage everyone's healthcare. Try calling the SSA and informing them how you'd like to "choose" your retirement portfolio be set-up.

But I'll concede that if one wants to have the gov't responsible for their retirement system; having them take over their health is a logical next choice. Then they can clamor for universal auto insurance, universal food, universal shelter. . . countries have gone this route.

In any event, it's a virtual impossible goal. Those with more resources are always going to have access to better anything. Nothing "universal" about any of this stuff. Healthcare is a commodity to be purchased; not a constitutional right.

I didn't say I feared being flamed, someone else did, your post was ridiculous and I stated why, if you had read this entire thread you would know that. Flame away!

I have stated my opinions on the reforms I believe are important and most of the anti UHC posters and myself are in agreement.

[LNTT_Vacationer]

Originally Posted by Acupunk

. . . most of the anti UHC posters and myself are in agreement.

If you've got the numbers here I'm sure you're right!

[detshen]

Originally Posted by LNTT_Vacationer

If you've got the numbers here I'm sure you're right!

I don't understand this statement.

[detshen]

Originally Posted by LNTT_Vacationer

There are a number of reasons but those against socialized medical care likely feel:

- they can manage their own healthcare better than a gov't employee

- they would prefer to pick their own doctor rather than be assigned one by a gov't bureaucrat

- a private company with healthcare professionals will likely run a better healthcare program than a gov't hack. (Really, do you want your personal healthcare managed by the same people who have run their own primary elections and the mess with Florida and Michigan?!)

COLOR=black]- a career in the medical field; nurse, doctor, hospital admin, etc. is likely to better give one the experience to oversee someone's health than just being married to a past president[/color]

- they like the idea of choice

- and wonder why socialized medical care hasn't worked well anywhere and question why would the US be any different?

I apologize for being so harsh. I wasn't criticizing you for your opposition to UHC. I have been heavily involved in this thread and a few people have put forth effort to keep it civil and avoid exagerated statements and scare tactics from both sides. We are actually trying to listen to each other and come up with real possiblilities. Your post is full of inaccuracies. Hillary Clinton will not be overseeing my health instead of my doctor no matter what plan we end up with. When you post onto a very long thread it's a good idea to read as much as you can of the thread.

[mimimomx3]

Originally Posted by Acupunk

I'm not sure the hospitals and Pharma want the government involved because if the people demand controls on those industries it could hurt them.

I agree increased education on holistic preventive care will not likely be funded, meditation is free, there aren't any meditation industry lobbyists out there.

We need more medititation lobbyists!
The people can demand all they want, but look at the FDA as it is right now...a mess. The Dept of Agriculture? Another mess...tainted meat from mad cows. No, the push for socialized medicine will be a giant money grab.
PS, happy birthday!

[detshen]

Originally Posted by mimimomx3

We need more medititation lobbyists!
The people can demand all they want, but look at the FDA as it is right now...a mess. The Dept of Agriculture? Another mess...tainted meat from mad cows. No, the push for socialized medicine will be a giant money grab.
PS, happy birthday!

Thank you

Everything is a money grab, it's the american way! I think UHC is a nice idea, but I don't think it will happen. I do think reforms will happen that will allow many more people to become insured.

I prefer to focus on what we can actually achieve right now. Moving to MI has made a huge difference for me because I can't be denied insurance here so in 6 days my insurance goes into effect, and I can finally be self employed and not have to worry about medical bills bankrupting me. Making that reform national will help out a lot of people.

[mimimomx3]

Originally Posted by Acupunk

Thank you

Everything is a money grab, it's the american way! I think UHC is a nice idea, but I don't think it will happen. I do think reforms will happen that will allow many more people to become insured.

I prefer to focus on what we can actually achieve right now. Moving to MI has made a huge difference for me because I can't be denied insurance here so in 6 days my insurance goes into effect, and I can finally be self employed and not have to worry about medical bills bankrupting me. Making that reform national will help out a lot of people.

I agree that UHC would be great...in a utopia. I hope the next president will reform medicaid, start with what we already have, so that more children are covered and prevention is addressed.
Good news about you being covered. I'm always confused about how the US is all about entrepreneurship, but there are so many roadblocks. Getting insurance, tax disincentives...

[detshen]

Originally Posted by mimimomx3

I agree that UHC would be great...in a utopia. I hope the next president will reform medicaid, start with what we already have, so that more children are covered and prevention is addressed.
Good news about you being covered. I'm always confused about how the US is all about entrepreneurship, but there are so many roadblocks. Getting insurance, tax disincentives...

I think entrepreneurship is our dream and we are told that our country supports that, but in reality our country supports big business and big business wants to keep us enslaved in corporations. Am I cynical or what?

All children should be covered, they don't have the choice to get a better job.