Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
$9.25 has different purchasing power in different local economies.
Let states/ municipalities decide.
The purchasing power of $9.25 is one word in all of America: very low.
"let states decide" is really just code word for "let's start a race to the bottom". We need a strong and high federal minimum wage to prevent that. Cant have Alabama pushing for a $5 minimum wage and act as a Mexico within America and then expect Connecticut to have the room to increase it as much as is should be from a moral standpoint. Corporations will simply use different regulations in different states to pressure progressive states into submission.
Hong Kong has had a $0 minimum wage for a very long time. It has lead to the highest inequality in the developed world, a tiny super rich elite, just like Singapore, and for the working class in Hong Kong, life is a struggle in a cage home. Why do you want the working class in America to live in cage homes? Only a couple of years ago, Hong Kong, being lauded as the most free economy in the world by all the right wing think tanks in America, finally decided to implement a minimum wage of $3.35 an hour after extreme pressure from the desperate and hungry working class. This is the future of the working class in America. Living in cage homes working 50 hours a week.
Define "working class."
I think you need to read my post again. Apparently, what I said didn't sink in. Nobody is going to be living in "cage homes" in America without a minimum wage. But I wasn't arguing for eliminating the minimum wage anyway. I was arguing against raising it to what some call a "living wage." It never was supposed to be a "living wage" (as defined; i.e., a "wage that is enough to support a family on.") No one should be even trying to support a family if they are only making minimum wage. Besides, often people making only minimum wage are supported by a spouse who is the primary breadwinner. Anyone who thinks they should be able to support a family making minimum wage is just plain stupid. Such a person is either too lazy to work hard enough to "climb the ladder," by updating their skills, or they are just too uneducated and not willing to educate themselves. Sorry, but that's the truth.
I don't think Hong Kong can be compared with the United States.
Manhattan McDonalds can charge more for a BigMac Combo Meal than a middle of nowhere McDonalds -- do you seriously disagree with that?!
And restaurants are making automation -- and it will increase as the technology price drops and workers are required to be paid $15 in the middle of nowhere that can't support the higher wages like a Manhattan, Tokyo, London, etc.
It is probably natural progression, but let's not deny the reality that paying workers $15 an hour in a low cost of living area that can't sustain the prices wouldn't speed up this process.
Yes, but nowhere should the minimum wage be lower than $15 by 2024. I dont care how "low cost of living" an area is in America by that time. It is NOT as low as you claim it is. You make it sound like some American states have a price level of Mexico. If some states want to go higher than $15 by 2024, they should. It should be at least $20 in places like Manhattan by then.
Lots of countries have had far higher low skilled labor costs for decades. Your scare mongering about technology taking all of their jobs hasnt come to fruition. Besides, technological progress is good, not bad.
I think you need to read my post again. Apparently, what I said didn't sink in. Nobody is going to be living in "cage homes" in America without a minimum wage. But I wasn't arguing for eliminating the minimum wage anyway. I was arguing against raising it to what some call a "living wage." It never was supposed to be a "living wage" (as defined; i.e., a "wage that is enough to support a family on.") No one should be even trying to support a family if they are only making minimum wage. Besides, often people making only minimum wage are supported by a spouse who is the primary breadwinner. Anyone who thinks they should be able to support a family making minimum wage is just plain stupid. Such a person is either too lazy to work hard enough to "climb the ladder," by updating their skills, or they are just too uneducated and not willing to educate themselves. Sorry, but that's the truth.
I don't think Hong Kong can be compared with the United States.
You said the minimum wage should be $0. Thats arguing for eliminating the minimum wage. And yes, that means the working class will live in cage homes. 40 or 50 hours a week at appallingly low wages. We can look at the few developed economies that have no minimum wage and being constantly praised as the most free economies in the world. That's places like Hong Kong. Very, very low taxes, no minimum wage, extremely weak unions etc. And that means extreme inequality, massive suffering for the working class and cage homes making its debut in America. I fail to see what's so great about this.
How can you listen to FDR, making the case for the first minimum wage in the country, and claim that it never was supposed to be a living wage?:
In my Inaugural I laid down the simple proposition that nobody is going to starve in this country. It seems to me to be equally plain that no business which depends for existence on paying less than living wages to its workers has any right to continue in this country. By "business" I mean the whole of commerce as well as the whole of industry; by workers I mean all workers, the white collar class as well as the men in overalls; and by living wages I mean more than a bare subsistence level-I mean the wages of decent living.
Yes, but nowhere should the minimum wage be lower than $15 by 2024. I dont care how "low cost of living" an area is in America by that time. It is NOT as low as you claim it is. You make it sound like some American states have a price level of Mexico. If some states want to go higher than $15 by 2024, they should. It should be at least $20 in places like Manhattan by then.
Lots of countries have had far higher low skilled labor costs for decades. Your scare mongering about technology taking all of their jobs hasnt come to fruition. Besides, technological progress is good, not bad.
Who gets paid minimum wage?
People who lack skills get paid minimum wage. They are the people who either are just starting out or have some disability.
Even labor from someone with no skills has value.
I'll pay someone $15 an hour to pull weeds in my yard. I'd only pay someone $10 to sweep my floors in my house. I'd pay someone $25 an hour to carefully hand dig a trench in my yard during the summer.
If you want more money than $10 an hour from me (which is still above MW), you'd better have valuable skills or be ready for some really hard physical labor.
People who need the government to force others to pay them more are either too lazy to gain skills or too lazy to work hard (excluding those with a disability).
Feel free to pay a person $75 an hour to mow your yard if you choose.
You said the minimum wage should be $0. Thats arguing for eliminating the minimum wage. And yes, that means the working class will live in cage homes. 40 or 50 hours a week at appallingly low wages. We can look at the few developed economies that have no minimum wage and being constantly praised as the most free economies in the world. That's places like Hong Kong. Very, very low taxes, no minimum wage, extremely weak unions etc. And that means extreme inequality, massive suffering for the working class and cage homes making its debut in America. I fail to see what's so great about this.
How can you listen to FDR, making the case for the first minimum wage in the country, and claim that it never was supposed to be a living wage?:
People who lack skills get paid minimum wage. They are the people who either are just starting out or have some disability.
Even labor from someone with no skills has value.
I'll pay someone $15 an hour to pull weeds in my yard. I'd only pay someone $10 to sweep my floors in my house. I'd pay someone $25 an hour to carefully hand dig a trench in my yard during the summer.
If you want more money than $10 an hour from me (which is still above MW), you'd better have valuable skills or be ready for some really hard physical labor.
People who need the government to force others to pay them more are either too lazy to gain skills or too lazy to work hard (excluding those with a disability).
Feel free to pay a person $75 an hour to mow your yard if you choose.
Hatred for the poor go hand in hand with appalling living conditions for the disabled. Because the owners of America who decide policy dont make a distinction between the deserving and undeserving poor. That's why people who are born severely disabled in America only get $700 a month to survive on. This is the reality. Why is this? Because the ruling class dont make a distinction between a working stiff and a disabled person. They are all just members of the poor class and they must suffer. If a country has masses of working poor, that also means a terrible situation for the disabled. Without exception.
It is apt to quote FDR, the father of the minimum wage (and the most popular American president in the last 100 years) when people claim that the minimum wage was "not meant to be" a living wage.
Home ownership today is generally not possible on a minimum wage income. It would be if home ownership were scalable but government has gotten in the way.
Not in expensive areas. I know, you seem to think that if zoning were gotten rid of, you could own a home. You can barely afford a room in a flophouse. You'd never afford a house, no matter how small.
But what you say IS true. Which is why most smart people live their lives to earn more than minimum wage.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
