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Status:
"“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”"
(set 2 days ago)
Location: Great Britain
27,175 posts, read 13,455,286 times
Reputation: 19471
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FL IRON
So what your saying is people with guns will come.................. scary black guns.
What I am saying that gun crime is not tolerarted and there are plenty of armed resources, if anyone is seen with a weapon.
Gun crime is not a big problem in the UK, and knife crime sometimes fluctuates, however even a large proportion of knife crime is down to domestc disputes.
There were 30 Firearms Homicides in England and Wales last year, that's an area with a population of over around 58 million. If the US had a similar rate it would have around 150 Firearms homicides a year.
London had 130 murders last year, which is not a lot for a city approaching 9 million, and as already stated domestic disputes are the single largest cause of homicide and most homicides are committed by people the victim actually knew rather than strangers.
In terms of the thread it seems way off course, as America's gun violence has nothing to do with the UK, indeed the UK is an example of a country with one of the lowest levels of gun violence in the western world.
Last edited by Brave New World; 04-14-2018 at 04:10 AM..
...In terms of the thread it seems way off course, as America's gun violence has nothing to do with the UK, indeed the UK is an example of a country with one of the lowest levels of gun violence in the western world.
We went down this track because "someone" wanted to use the UK as a comparison and example of what gun crime stats should be.
If you can get through that police interview I posted (it does ramble and the interviewer's donate sound is annoying), the UK police officer explains how crime is different there, why the gun crime is different, and to an extent why gun homicide is not as big of an issue there (because the armed-criminal gets what they want without having to shoot you.) That police officer explains how he was at the mercy of a 13 year old with a gun.
60% of our "gun crime" is suicides. Roughly 80% of the rest of it is related to the battle for control of the inner city criminal activities. UK does not have that level of turf wars (as explained in the interview.)
We have reporting differences.
Given all that, our real problem is an inner city culture issue (driven by poverty and lack of education) which the UK is just now starting to see an expansion of US gang culture in places like Hackney and Luton.
The biggest reduction of gun crime in the UK came not from bans but from increased policing; the use of CCTV and hiring of more constabulary. It is something that could be tried in the US inner cities but I do not know how accepting the populace would be of having cameras on them 24/7.
Status:
"“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”"
(set 2 days ago)
Location: Great Britain
27,175 posts, read 13,455,286 times
Reputation: 19471
Quote:
Originally Posted by CtrlEsc
We went down this track because "someone" wanted to use the UK as a comparison and example of what gun crime stats should be.
If you can get through that police interview I posted (it does ramble and the interviewer's donate sound is annoying), the UK police officer explains how crime is different there, why the gun crime is different, and to an extent why gun homicide is not as big of an issue there (because the armed-criminal gets what they want without having to shoot you.) That police officer explains how he was at the mercy of a 13 year old with a gun.
60% of our "gun crime" is suicides. Roughly 80% of the rest of it is related to the battle for control of the inner city criminal activities. UK does not have that level of turf wars (as explained in the interview.)
We have reporting differences.
Given all that, our real problem is an inner city culture issue (driven by poverty and lack of education) which the UK is just now starting to see an expansion of US gang culture in places like Hackney and Luton.
The biggest reduction of gun crime in the UK came not from bans but from increased policing; the use of CCTV and hiring of more constabulary. It is something that could be tried in the US inner cities but I do not know how accepting the populace would be of having cameras on them 24/7.
Do you honestly think that London doesn't have a history of gangs going back hundreds of years, as do most other British Cities. If anything the gangs today are fairly tame, indeed the homicide rate was 2% back in Victorian Britain it's 0.9% today.
Gangs such as the Peaky Blinders from Birmingham are even serialised on the television, whilst the race course razor gangs as depicted in Graham Greene's 'Brighton Rock' were extremely violent. The 60's were a very famous time gor glamorous gangsters, such as the Krays (East End) and the Richardsons (South London), the Richardsons enjoyed nailing people to wooden floors and urinating on them for days (as potrayed in the film The Long Good Friday), as well as passing electrical shocks through the genitals of people who crossed them. Gangs such as the Clerkenwell Crime Syndicate (Adams Brothers) battled with other Irish Mob groups such as the Reillys. The Asifs were South of the River and the Hunt Crime Syndicare the subject of a recent Panorama Documentary run the East End today.
You had hardmen like Jimmy Burke (Conway) we had the likes of Jimmy Moody and enforcers such as Lenny McLean, Roy Pretty Boy Shaw, John Bindon, whilst the Krays would take people like Heavyweight boxer Rocky Marciano down to the local boys clubs and entertained the likes of Sonny Liston and Joe Louis. Whilst numerous stars including the likes of Barbra Streisand, Frank Sinatra, Judy Garland etc were friends, indeed Garland died of a drug overdose in London in the late 60's.
London was also a centre for gambling and Meyer Lansky and Philadelphia crime family boss Angelo Bruno were involved in the Colony Club in London, which was fronted by US Actor George Raft in charge, unfortunately Goege went on holiday to France and was prevented from returning to the UK having been banned as an undesirable. Antonio "Tony Ducks" Corallo a New York City mobster and later boss of the Lucchese family also had business interests in London and visited a number of times.
Today crime is very much multinational and organised crime gangs from across the world are linked and cooperate in what is known as McMafia, in terms of the streets gangs they were always low level and we have always had them, and they can usually be dealt with by investing in and educating young people. The more hardened international organised crime which operates at a global level and which likes to stay in it's own shdowy murky world is a lot more difficult to get rid of.
Do you honestly think that London doesn't have a history of gangs going back hundreds of years, as do most other British Cities. If anything the gangs today are fairly tame, indeed the homicide rate was 2% back in Victorian Britain it's 0.9% today.
...
The interviewee lays it out how things are changing. US Gang Culture is different than the gang culture London had in the past 50 years (and further back.) US Gang Culture is different, more violent, and revolves around having (and using) a gun. Your gangs there are starting to emulate US Gang Culture.
You're welcome, we love to be the trend setters. (/sarcasm)
Status:
"“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”"
(set 2 days ago)
Location: Great Britain
27,175 posts, read 13,455,286 times
Reputation: 19471
Quote:
Originally Posted by CtrlEsc
The interviewee lays it out how things are changing. US Gang Culture is different than the gang culture London had in the past 50 years (and further back.) US Gang Culture is different, more violent, and revolves around having (and using) a gun. Your gangs there are starting to emulate US Gang Culture.
You're welcome, we love to be the trend setters. (/sarcasm)
No they are not, there has been no rise in armed crime, arned police have actually seen a decrease in call outs, and homicide is at a very low rate around 130 a year. I don't call 30 firearms murders a year in England and Wales a problem, and gun violence is not on the increase.
Gangs have used knives throghout London's history, and we have had violent yardie and black gangs for a long time now, and our police have dealt with them in the past.
Furthermore London is a city being gentrified and is more similar to NYC than other US Cities and I don't see NYC experiencing massive problems at the moment, whilst London has started succesfully dealing with the problem with a new gan unit in Islington having been very succesful, and which is being rolled out to other boroughs, and there is a violemnce reduction strtegy in place, and the city has sought advice from the succesful Violence Reduction Unit in Scotland.
We went down this track because "someone" wanted to use the UK as a comparison and example of what gun crime stats should be.
If you can get through that police interview I posted (it does ramble and the interviewer's donate sound is annoying), the UK police officer explains how crime is different there, why the gun crime is different, and to an extent why gun homicide is not as big of an issue there (because the armed-criminal gets what they want without having to shoot you.) That police officer explains how he was at the mercy of a 13 year old with a gun.
60% of our "gun crime" is suicides. Roughly 80% of the rest of it is related to the battle for control of the inner city criminal activities. UK does not have that level of turf wars (as explained in the interview.)
We have reporting differences.
Given all that, our real problem is an inner city culture issue (driven by poverty and lack of education) which the UK is just now starting to see an expansion of US gang culture in places like Hackney and Luton.
The biggest reduction of gun crime in the UK came not from bans but from increased policing; the use of CCTV and hiring of more constabulary. It is something that could be tried in the US inner cities but I do not know how accepting the populace would be of having cameras on them 24/7.
Can't rep you again. Great post, and all true. The U.S. is a VERY safe country outside of the Black dominated ghettos.
Can't rep you again. Great post, and all true. The U.S. is a VERY safe country outside of the Black dominated ghettos.
I thought the message coming out of the US was 'black lives matter'? Obviously reading your post I realise that as far as you are concerned they don't even count as lives!
Do you honestly think that London doesn't have a history of gangs going back hundreds of years, as do most other British Cities. If anything the gangs today are fairly tame, indeed the homicide rate was 2% back in Victorian Britain it's 0.9% today.
Gangs such as the Peaky Blinders from Birmingham are even serialised on the television, whilst the race course razor gangs as depicted in Graham Greene's 'Brighton Rock' were extremely violent. The 60's were a very famous time gor glamorous gangsters, such as the Krays (East End) and the Richardsons (South London), the Richardsons enjoyed nailing people to wooden floors and urinating on them for days (as potrayed in the film The Long Good Friday), as well as passing electrical shocks through the genitals of people who crossed them. Gangs such as the Clerkenwell Crime Syndicate (Adams Brothers) battled with other Irish Mob groups such as the Reillys. The Asifs were South of the River and the Hunt Crime Syndicare the subject of a recent Panorama Documentary run the East End today.
You had hardmen like Jimmy Burke (Conway) we had the likes of Jimmy Moody and enforcers such as Lenny McLean, Roy Pretty Boy Shaw, John Bindon, whilst the Krays would take people like Heavyweight boxer Rocky Marciano down to the local boys clubs and entertained the likes of Sonny Liston and Joe Louis. Whilst numerous stars including the likes of Barbra Streisand, Frank Sinatra, Judy Garland etc were friends, indeed Garland died of a drug overdose in London in the late 60's.
London was also a centre for gambling and Meyer Lansky and Philadelphia crime family boss Angelo Bruno were involved in the Colony Club in London, which was fronted by US Actor George Raft in charge, unfortunately Goege went on holiday to France and was prevented from returning to the UK having been banned as an undesirable. Antonio "Tony Ducks" Corallo a New York City mobster and later boss of the Lucchese family also had business interests in London and visited a number of times.
Today crime is very much multinational and organised crime gangs from across the world are linked and cooperate in what is known as McMafia, in terms of the streets gangs they were always low level and we have always had them, and they can usually be dealt with by investing in and educating young people. The more hardened international organised crime which operates at a global level and which likes to stay in it's own shdowy murky world is a lot more difficult to get rid of.
Great post (as usual with you) and with plenty of links to back things up. I don't know why (some) people in the US seem to think they are 'different' to the rest of the human population so that they have a 'different' kind of criminal or gang member, its weird.
I thought the message coming out of the US was 'black lives matter'? Obviously reading your post I realise that as far as you are concerned they don't even count as lives!
Outside of suicide by people using a gun, where does the vast majority of violent crime happen in the U.S.?
Can't rep you again. Great post, and all true. The U.S. is a VERY safe country outside of the Black dominated ghettos.
Tell the hundreds of folks that were shot at a concert in Las Vegas that they were VERY safe that day.
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