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Old 11-21-2017, 05:41 PM
 
1,400 posts, read 511,021 times
Reputation: 789

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BullCity75 View Post
Is there some imperative that we must radically change the tax code?
I disagree with your premise. The GOP plan really isn't a radical change to the tax code, just lower rates for households and businesses.
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Old 11-21-2017, 05:46 PM
 
1,400 posts, read 511,021 times
Reputation: 789
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Caldwell View Post
You are living under the Democrat tax plan. Retain the Bush era tax cuts for the lower and middle class, raise taxes on the rich. It's been in place since 2009.
So dems want to keep a 35% corporate rate? And keep taxing the heck out of small business so that they can't compete globally?
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Old 11-21-2017, 05:47 PM
 
9,041 posts, read 2,720,439 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
So you think its fair that 47% of the nation pays ZERO in federal income taxes while the other 53% pay for everyone?
INCOME tax is the key to the myth .


You guys LOVE to pretend that half the country does not pay tax. But the only tax they get away with income tax because their income is so small.... seems fair to me.

They still pay a lot of other taxes and those taxes tend to be regressive taxes, that hurt the low income a lot.

they pay property taxes , they pay sales taxes, they something pay state taxes, they pay payroll taxes. they pay gas tax and they pay taxes on their phone, tv, power, sewerage, water, trash.

they pay lots of taxes. in fact about half of the taxes are non income... and a rich man pays about the same gas tax as a poor man.

So ya i know i know you never said they don't pay any taxes. But you sure as hell made it sound like they don't.
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Old 11-21-2017, 05:51 PM
 
9,041 posts, read 2,720,439 times
Reputation: 6620
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1grin_g0 View Post
So dems want to keep a 35% corporate rate? And keep taxing the heck out of small business so that they can't compete globally?
who said that.

maybe if the GOP actually wrote a plan that closed all the loopholes currently making the effective corp rate less than 20% we would be fine with 20%.

But the Goldman boys, have not. the house has not , the senate has not.


tell me 1grin, where are all the promised reforms? This bill is just a massive give away and it fails to close the provisions.!!

Why ? why is this so called "reform" not reforming the tax code, and instead just slashing corp rates while further burdening the average citizen.
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Old 11-21-2017, 05:53 PM
 
Location: USA
7,456 posts, read 5,449,546 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seacove View Post
Democrats are not being allowed to participate. Got that? Democrats are not being allowed to participate in health care or tax bills - or really - anything at all. This is a Republican ruled country right now and every single thing that happens is owned by the GOP.

"Unwilling to make concessions to Democrats, GOP leaders have pursued a legislative strategy designed to cut them out entirely, using a procedural tool known as budget reconciliation that allows them to circumvent the 60-vote threshold to defeat a filibuster."

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...reform/541197/
Exactly. The right-wing dolts own the current mess and utter inability to get anything done for close to a year. They don't get to whine about "the left" when they utterly refuse to work with anyone who's not on board with their 1850's social policies and Gilded Age tax policies. They are a bunch of jokers, nothing more.

As for the Democrats, they are masters at snatching defeat from the jaws of victory and probably don't have much of a real plan, not that anyone on the far-right would listen anyway. Keep in mind their opposition is led by loons who basically believe paying taxes is "stealing," but who also magically expect to have roads, police, and the largest military in the world several times over all for free. When dealing with economic ignoramuses like that, what the Democrats say and do really doesn't matter.

But hey - any plan the Democrats present would probably be an improvement on the usual "give more money to the rich, stick it to everyone else, balloon the deficit, and gut our nation" plan the far-right so loves.
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Old 11-21-2017, 05:53 PM
 
3,935 posts, read 1,455,820 times
Reputation: 2228
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1grin_g0 View Post
So dems want to keep a 35% corporate rate? And keep taxing the heck out of small business so that they can't compete globally?


rate could be 95%, fact is the average effective rate is much lower and actually in line with other world economies. However, its a nice talking point to fool the rubes into giving more of their cash to the Koch brothers.
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Old 11-21-2017, 05:58 PM
 
9,041 posts, read 2,720,439 times
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at the barber today, old school place 12 chairs lots of business lots of cross talk.

Old guy next to me was super pissed about this tax plan. He lives in an assisted living facility. He had to buy into it at 300k and it costs 3k a month all in, health everything. that is his nut so to speak.. He was ranting about losing his credits and deductions because his costs are going to be so high he might have to leave. he has high medical and never thought that the federal government would come after him.
One guy tried to challenge him but the old guy really had his numbers and rules down pat. (i could not check them of course)

He said the entire home is in uproar, they are mad as hell at this plan. I thanked guy for his insights. As i left i wondered to myself if the conversation i had mostly just listened in on is a conversation going on in retirement communities across the nation.?

2018 will be interesting. it might well be the only tax plan the Dems for 2018 and 2020 is repeal and replace The Trump/Goldman sachs give away..
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Old 11-21-2017, 05:59 PM
 
69,372 posts, read 53,622,092 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsjj251 View Post
The link says that revenue generated at the top 1% at 39.5% tax rate is 543 billion. Just to be clear, 1% int here data starts at 1.2 million dollars.
A) No one pays 39.5%
B) even if they did the total still wouldnt be what you claimed.
(math lesson for you.. $543 billion - 4.5% if its being lowered to 35% = $24.435 billion

This of course doesnt count the fact that now there would be $24.435 billion more into the economy, which would circulate and then be taxed anyways...

Last edited by pghquest; 11-21-2017 at 06:15 PM..
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Old 11-21-2017, 06:18 PM
 
1,400 posts, read 511,021 times
Reputation: 789
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilcart View Post
who said that.

maybe if the GOP actually wrote a plan that closed all the loopholes currently making the effective corp rate less than 20% we would be fine with 20%.

But the Goldman boys, have not. the house has not , the senate has not.


tell me 1grin, where are all the promised reforms? This bill is just a massive give away and it fails to close the provisions.!!

Why ? why is this so called "reform" not reforming the tax code, and instead just slashing corp rates while further burdening the average citizen.
The GOP plan actually looks a lot like the one Trump ran on. I'm actually kinda disappointed it isn't a "reform", but given the ineffectiveness of Congress, I'll take what I can get. My household will save a few thousand. It might even be enough to help us cover the skyrocketing health insurance premiums.
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Old 11-21-2017, 06:48 PM
 
Location: Pine Grove,AL
21,758 posts, read 10,609,339 times
Reputation: 3956
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest View Post
A) No one pays 39.5%
B) even if they did the total still wouldnt be what you claimed.
(math lesson for you.. $543 billion - 4.5% if its being lowered to 35% = $24.435 billion
1. no one pays an effective rate of 39.5%, we agree, but no one ever argued that. people who make 418,000+ even after adjustments do though.

their effective rate is 31%, but they still pay taxes on everything over 418,000.

2. you arent getting it so im going to have to get you a visual aid

This link is from a different site and a different year, but it gives the same type of information.

Notice that like the Tax Foundation link(that you clearly didnt read) , this is not talking about taxable income, but rather revenue collected. both criteria are represented in the chart so you can see the difference.

https://www.stlouisfed.org/~/media/B...1217.jpg?la=en

27% of all federal income tax collectedrevenue(keyword) is on income over 1 million.

10% of all federal income tax revenue is between 999,000 and 500,000



27% of 1.6 trillion( federal income tax revenue from 2014) = 432 Billion
10% = 160 billion

that is 592 billion in their numbers.

Again, this is not their total incomes added in together, this is the amount of tax revenue collected specifically from that tax bracket( the tax foundation link goes into more detail)
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