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View Poll Results: Should employers be allowed to check potential employees credit?
Yes. 71 42.01%
No. 90 53.25%
Indifferent/No Answer. 8 4.73%
Voters: 169. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-28-2017, 07:14 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nmnita View Post
As far as I am concerned there is no reason not to do one. Depending on the job there are many times an employer has every right to know about a person's credit. That is within reason I will add.
Why ? Hows a job skill have anything to do with ability to pay the bills on time ?
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Old 11-28-2017, 07:42 PM
 
1,772 posts, read 504,146 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinytrump View Post

Why ? Hows a job skill have anything to do with ability to pay the bills on time ?
They're two separate concepts.

Having the skills necessary to do the job is one thing. Just about every job applicant, even abject deadbeats under severe financial stress, can so qualify (We'll call this bunch "Group 1.")

Having the skills necessary to do the job, PLUS the inclination and propensity to apply those skills conscientiously and diligently until the job is complete is a far different thing. Almost no financial deadbeats will be found among this cohort, of course, because one of the characteristics of a conscientious person is that they pay their bills on time. (We'll call this bunch "Group 2.")

People in Group 1 are a dime a dozen. There are millions of them out there. From an employer standpoint, they don't really add that much to the business mix. Any candidate from Group 1 is automatically a risky proposition from a hiring standpoint, some more risky than others.

People from Group 2 are quite rare, and employers are willing to expend additional resources to find them. The financial risks arising out of hiring a Group 2 candidate are markedly reduced.

Credit/background checks won't guarantee that you get a candidate from Group 2. But they will help insure that you don't get stuck with a candidate from Group 1.

At our enterprises, we don't bother hiring candidates from Group 1.

And now you have the answer to your question.
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Old 11-28-2017, 07:59 PM
 
Location: Buckeye, AZ
25,467 posts, read 14,563,377 times
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Default I'm sorry for the delay, I wanted to fully reply to this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Volobjectitarian View Post
Employment is a voluntary association, and the criteria for who gets hired out a pool of applicants is almost totally subjective. All a credit check represents is simply one more of those totally subjective criteria.
Do you honestly think a 4 year degree actually prepares anyone for a job? In almost any field, your undergrad degree by itself is meaningless to your job knowledge/performance, but tons of companies have that (all by itself, no professional or graduate degree) as a criteria. Why?

Do you know the purpose of a job interview? It isn't to see if you are qualified to do the job. Your resume did that. The purpose of mos interviews is to determine whether you're cool enough to go to happy hour with the group. It's a popularity contest, and the goal is to see if the clique you want to be in will give you a trial run with them. It's totally subjective because the employer is asking "do I want to hang out with this person?" In all your personal associations, were all of your criteria totally objective, mathematical and rule based metrics for "who is friend" and who isn't? I doubt it. Job interview same thing. Popularity contest.
I'm sorry volobjectitarian for my delayed response but I wanted to give my fully informed and in depth reply to your post.

To the red text, in a way it is yes, but not really. See the issue is that unless you are independently wealthy, a trust fund kid or disabled, You have to work to earn a living. It isn't truly voluntary if your choice is to go and live on the streets or get a job (even with all the hoops of getting said job.) This is semi-voluntary. Yes, you do pick the employers you put into, take interviews with and accept an offer from; but at the same time, if you have only one choice of employer it isn't really a choice. It is like choosing between eating peanut butter which you are allergic to or dying of hunger.

To the orange text, it is subjective and arguably there is no correlation. The studies are split down the middle if they do help with limiting the pool for good candidates or not. As I've stated before, medical bills and identity theft are continually growing issues especially with people complaining of Obamacare plans (like my brother who cannot afford it because Maricopa County, AZ is one of those one policy places and is a part of a small business so he needs to seek the individual market (which he cannot afford)) and breaches like Target and Equifax, it isn't getting any better. This is the issue I see with using credit scores and has been this entire thread.

To the magenta text, I do but there are things that aren't. A college degree will teach you finance skills, management skills, marketing skills, etc. but it wouldn't teach company culture at all. There are things that having a degree or even skills (with or without degree) that you wouldn't know. This is why interning is important.

To the green text, because they perceive a seller's market (even if it is really a buyer's market) and they can cherry pick purple squirrels.

To the purple text, it is to see if you are a fit and if the application, resume and cover letters are all lies. The fit is important and I am not neglecting how big it is, but arguably they want to double check that you are for real or can remove you from the pool. If they can trip you up in any way, it makes their job of squeezing the pool down.

To the orchid text, it wasn't in the last two companies I've gotten jobs in or four out of the five I have interviewed with. These being a department store, a school district, a cell phone retailer, a security company and a movie theater. Honestly only the cell phone retailer seemed overtly a "popularity contest" was the cell phone retailer. The district isn't at all and because of when I looked at the department store and security company, it was during high demand time (Christmas and the Super Bowl) and both had interviewees who were not dressed for the interview, yet get the job too... The movie theater might have been, but it wasn't as clear as the cell phone retailer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Volobjectitarian View Post
Eleven states have decided voluntary association is bad and must be stopped.

Apparently, associations must be forced, coerced and governed by strict rules to make sure nobody enjoys the freedom of association.

Awesome!
No I look at the reply to the orange, it really don't have a connection except for banking jobs, stock markets, finance, government with top secret clearance, etc.
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Old 11-29-2017, 05:22 AM
 
28,041 posts, read 19,713,441 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Volobjectitarian View Post
There doesn't need to be a prize for responsible personal behavior because responsible personal behavior like getting/staying out of debt is its own reward. If it so happens that being responsible with debt also improves your chances of getting a job, then great, but that would be just one more personally rewarding thing tat comes from proper, responsible, personal behavior.

Along with being more employable, you save tens, maybe hundreds of thousands of dollars over your lifetime by having good credit and low debt. You have emergency resources. You have backup. You have personal financial insurance against catastrophe. Etc etc. Yeah, the "more employable" thing is handy I guess, but there are sooooooooo many positive, rewarding reasons to not be in debt that again, it is a no-brainer.
All that is wonderful but the point is, life is imperfect as are humans. An entire lifetime shouldn't be marred due to bad credit to the point where someone is even unable to secure reliable employment.

And what happens when you drain your emergency resources? What happens when you've maxed out your insurance? Those things are not infinite.
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Old 11-29-2017, 12:15 PM
 
5,249 posts, read 2,397,992 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
All that is wonderful but the point is, life is imperfect as are humans. An entire lifetime shouldn't be marred due to bad credit to the point where someone is even unable to secure reliable employment.

And what happens when you drain your emergency resources? What happens when you've maxed out your insurance? Those things are not infinite.
For the point in blue, actions have consequences, and an entire lifetime would be marred ONLY if the credit is not repaired. Fix your credit, problem solved.

For the point in red, this is simply untrue. A person might not be able to get the job that they want at the pay that they want, but they can get a job. If they can't get a job, it's for reasons way beyond their credit.

Hyperbole doesn't help your argument. . .
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Old 11-29-2017, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Buckeye, AZ
25,467 posts, read 14,563,377 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
All that is wonderful but the point is, life is imperfect as are humans. An entire lifetime shouldn't be marred due to bad credit to the point where someone is even unable to secure reliable employment.

And what happens when you drain your emergency resources? What happens when you've maxed out your insurance? Those things are not infinite.
I know, Goad. It is crazy how people dont see reality and prefer to see utopia.
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Old 11-29-2017, 12:57 PM
 
5,675 posts, read 2,142,702 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
All that is wonderful but the point is, life is imperfect as are humans. An entire lifetime shouldn't be marred due to bad credit to the point where someone is even unable to secure reliable employment.
Credit can be repaired. It doesn't mar an entire lifetime. It mars life until dealt with, like all mistakes and setbacks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
And what happens when you drain your emergency resources? What happens when you've maxed out your insurance? Those things are not infinite.
You're in a pickle, but nobody winds up at the very end of their last rope all of a sudden or by accident. Most people who get to hat point made countless decisions and took a good bit of time to get to that point. If one of their numerous negative consequences is that finding a specific job with an employer who does credit checks becomes more difficult, then welcome to the wonderful world of consequences.

My credit got wrecked when I was young, and it wasn't my fault. It was my fault for letting it stay wrecked for as long as I did, but someone else did indeed do the initial wrecking. And? Doesn't relieve me of the responsibility to fix it, which I did. Delayed gratification can cure many ills, and fixing credit problems is one of the bigger ones.

This thread reveals that there are only two kinds of people when you get right down to it - people that can and do accept responsibility for their own actions, and people who cannot and don't.

Employers asking for credit, background and health checks are on the increase. That's just how it is. Given the framework of the job market going that way, the person who can and dos accept responsibility for their own actions will seek to remedy any flaws or problems within their own "checkable" individual sphere. The person who does not will continue to let their issues go unaddressed and blame society for being unfair. The people in the former group have more freedom because they choose to take the responsibility to ensure they do.
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Old 11-29-2017, 01:08 PM
 
28,041 posts, read 19,713,441 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TaxPhd View Post
For the point in blue, actions have consequences, and an entire lifetime would be marred ONLY if the credit is not repaired. Fix your credit, problem solved.

For the point in red, this is simply untrue. A person might not be able to get the job that they want at the pay that they want, but they can get a job. If they can't get a job, it's for reasons way beyond their credit.

Hyperbole doesn't help your argument. . .
Oh dear, its not hyperbole. When the majority of companies require a credit check, the working man is screwed.

How do you fix your credit if you can't get a decent paying job?

This really happens so therefore its not hyperbole.
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Old 11-29-2017, 02:01 PM
 
5,249 posts, read 2,397,992 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
Oh dear, its not hyperbole. When the majority of companies require a credit check, the working man is screwed.

How do you fix your credit if you can't get a decent paying job?

This really happens so therefore its not hyperbole.
You said that their entire lifetime would be marred, and that they would be unable to secure reliable employment, due to bad credit.

Both statements are the very definition of hyperbolic. They are outlandish exaggerations, meant to further your agenda.

Very simply, one's life is marred ONLY IF one doesn't fix their credit, and a complete inability to obtain employment (which is what you claimed) would not be due solely to bad credit.
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Old 11-29-2017, 02:16 PM
 
2,201 posts, read 731,252 times
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Much of it also depends on the type of company, type of job and position of who is applying. Financial institutions (banks, CUs, etc.) have been doing this for decades now.
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