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View Poll Results: What will happen to the unemployed?
No one will work because we will tax the robots 6 16.67%
We will subsidize cybernetic enhancements to allow all to keep up 4 11.11%
The unemployed will slowly die off because they will lose hope 9 25.00%
The unemployed will be killed off by a robot-powered dictator 17 47.22%
Voters: 36. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-27-2017, 12:37 AM
 
Location: Berwick, Penna.
16,214 posts, read 11,325,556 times
Reputation: 20827

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Catgirl64 View Post
I read your post several times, and still can't make any real sense of it, so I thought I'd ask for a bit of clarification, just in case you have a point, other than insulting liberals.
The point I've tried to underscore in many other posts at this site is this:

Seventy years ago, a thirty-year, two-act global war spawned by mercantilism. socialism, and other ideological baggage, rather than free enterprise, left the United States and Canada with the only functioning and mature industrial economies; everything else was either in ruins, or under the yoke of Marxism.

We wisely chose to allow and assist our former enemies, and allies as well, in rebuilding -- while we concentrated on the most-profitable heavy industrial sectors in which we held a monopoly. To keep the labor unions happy, we also acceded to most of their wishes and goals -- lots of their sons and daughters aspired to the professions anyway. Quality and efficiency suffered a little, but not enough at first, and the Asians in particular, operating under tighter discipline, began to overtake us; the shelter of North American dominance began to deteriorate -- and beyond the expensive and dangerous option of resuming a wartime stance (which gave us the tragedy of Vietnam) there was nothing to be done about it.

And by 1980, with many of the Baby Boom generation either delaying parenthood or raising smaller families, and a dearth of young people willing to do the menial jobs upwardly-mobile Americans scorned became apparent; our response was to welcome a new generation of legal immigrants, and a growing proportion of these were drawn to the higher echelons of the service sector -- such as health care. The MDs -, often directed toward the less-desirable communities, got in on H1B visas, and the less-skilled held down the menial jobs. Some others among them simply found that their upbringing in the "hydraulic societies" of Asia gave them the toughness to confront an equally-tough labor market. Meanwhile, the blue-collar sons and daughters, denied the traditional avenues of advancement (and less-stringent micromanagement) through basic manufacturing, remained in the backwaters and often turned to drugs.

Thirty years have passed, and much of the North American economy is a wasteland. Those of us outside the large cosmopolitan cities have often found a way to adapt; the deterioration and rebuilding of nearly all facets of distribution and supply chain management are testimony enough to that, and the control of racial and other animosities via a policy of "Lose your temper -- lose your job" is an important art of this. But the urban ghettos and the deserted former factory towns and districts are painful proof that it isn't working for all of us. And the only response from the weak-willed among most of the Republicans and virtually all of the Democrats is the divisive and short-sighted palliative of "identity politics".

A few recent positive trends aside, the American economy, and the pluralism with nurtures and sustains it, still runs the risk if deteriorating into a Mexican-modeled [i]faux[/I democracy, with a large, and ignorant lumpenproletariat led around (by the nose), all opposition misrepresented, stereotyped and demonized by an elite composed of Hollywood, Madison Avenue, and the manipulative media -- all of whom have no conscience or foresight beyond a desire to keep them well supplied with cheap personal servants.

The backbone of the Trump and Tea Party phenomena consists of people of moderate economic understanding who, like the young people of the turbulent Sixties, know that something is terribly wrong, but can't define exactly what; they have to be further dissuaded, by logical and peaceful methods, from misplacing their trust in the barriers, both legal and physical, linked to the policies which gave rise to the bloodshed of 1914-45. Those of us who more quietly, but effectively expressed our dissent a little over a year ago have to maintain the bonds among all of us who recognize that while Trump is often an embarrassment, the "blue" mentality is a far greater threat.

Last edited by 2nd trick op; 11-27-2017 at 01:53 AM..
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Old 11-27-2017, 08:41 AM
 
18,804 posts, read 8,462,725 times
Reputation: 4130
Quote:
Originally Posted by warhorse78 View Post
They'll keep some of the bottom feeders around, if anything, when they give a homeless family a free meal, they can then go home to their huge mansions and pat themselves on the back on a job well done. Or just to stroke their egos how much better they are than the struggling person.
The poor receive gov't money and buy stuff. That money climbs up to the producers, owners and the rich.
Or the gov't buys stuff to give to the poor, and that money climbs up the same way.
This trickle up has been very useful for the producers, owners and rich now and forever.
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Old 11-27-2017, 08:45 AM
 
18,804 posts, read 8,462,725 times
Reputation: 4130
Quote:
Originally Posted by ALackOfCreativity View Post
None of the above.

In 1800 83% of Americans worked in agriculture. In 1850 55% did. Today about 2% do.

In 1910 about a third of American jobs were in manufacturing. Today under 10% are.

We will find something productive to do with the excess labor, just as we have before in more jarring economic transitions.
Ray Kurzweil agrees.

https://futurism.com/ray-kurzweil-sa...over-our-jobs/
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Old 11-27-2017, 09:03 AM
 
10,513 posts, read 5,161,497 times
Reputation: 14056
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
The poor receive gov't money and buy stuff. That money climbs up to the producers, owners and the rich.
Or the gov't buys stuff to give to the poor, and that money climbs up the same way.
This trickle up has been very useful for the producers, owners and rich now and forever.
Correct. The economy works best as a feedback loop, ever circulating from the bottom to the top, with taxes taken to reinject money at the bottom again. It appears the "sweet spot" of optimum taxation seems to be around 35%, if we use the nations with the highest standards of living as a model.

Money sitting idle is wasteful and does not add to GDP. It's the velocity of money, the speed of its circulation, that drives a healthy economy. As the wealth disparity grows and the pile of idle cash grows at the top, the velocity of money has plummeted by 50% since the late 1990's.

Trump's tax plan is the exact wrong thing to do and will make wealth disparity worse and will cause the velocity of money to decline again.
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Old 11-27-2017, 09:18 AM
 
Location: Central Ohio
10,833 posts, read 14,927,894 times
Reputation: 16582
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avondalist View Post
What happened to the horse population after the automobile was invented?
And the blacksmiths?

To avoid upheaval what we need is to severely limit unskilled immigration into this country. Of course we will never do that because it is racism.
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Old 11-27-2017, 09:24 AM
 
7,447 posts, read 2,830,901 times
Reputation: 4922
Silly question. Obviously they will be mashed into a fine paste to be turned into bio-fuel to power the robots. Duh.
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Old 11-27-2017, 09:33 AM
 
10,787 posts, read 8,749,363 times
Reputation: 3983
Quote:
Originally Posted by CBeisbol View Post
This, so much this.

Imagine the creativity that will be unleashed when people no longer have to devote 40 hours a week of their life to working to survive.

Technology exists to make our lives easier. This is the next logical step
Go over to the c-d retirement board. Many retirees, or those whose retirement is pending, are baffled, confused and frightened about what they are going to do with so much free time. So much of their lives was centered around working.

There will be even more people who will not be prepared in any way for this kind of transition.
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Old 11-27-2017, 09:57 AM
 
18,804 posts, read 8,462,725 times
Reputation: 4130
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyb01 View Post
Go over to the c-d retirement board. Many retirees, or those whose retirement is pending, are baffled, confused and frightened about what they are going to do with so much free time. So much of their lives was centered around working.

There will be even more people who will not be prepared in any way for this kind of transition.
More fully immersive VR type activities of all kinds will take up a lot of the what to do slack.
Exercise
Games
Travel
Socialization
Actively participating in a Movie, play or orchestra.
Porn
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Old 11-27-2017, 10:00 AM
 
8,377 posts, read 4,359,448 times
Reputation: 11880
Every thing will be fine. Robo Cop will protect us.
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Old 11-27-2017, 10:54 AM
 
51,651 posts, read 25,790,245 times
Reputation: 37884
We have a large class of people who are already unemployed or underemployed because they don't have the skills to compete with robots.

Factories aren't hiring folks to put spare tires in cars. They are hiring folks who can operate the computers that tell the robots how to put the spare tires in.

A good percentage of the unemployed factory workers, coal miners, farmers, ... will find work in the service industry.

The rest will be put out to pasture and begrudged the grass.

Angry and resentful as this cruel twist of fate, they cling to the promises of con men.
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