U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 11-28-2017, 08:20 AM
 
4,623 posts, read 1,222,496 times
Reputation: 2145

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by G1.. View Post
Leave it to the GOP to rob the poor and give to the rich.
I find this hilarious when the post you quoted noted $110K for a joint income. If that is poor then I have no idea what I am.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 11-28-2017, 08:26 AM
 
38,233 posts, read 14,941,272 times
Reputation: 24637
The final plan hasn't been nailed down yet, but what has been released so far is a disaster for middle America.

Good article in LA Times comparing the impact of tax cuts in Kansas to tax increases in California.

"Kansas embarked on its trickle-down experiment in 2012. Brownback slashed taxes across the board, calling his plan “a shot of adrenaline into the heart of the Kansas economy.” Five years later, the state’s economy is on life support, and government expenses are expected to outpace income by $1.1 billion through June 2019."

"California – has done just the opposite. In November of 2012, ... more than 54% of California voters approved Proposition 30, a measure that temporarily raised income taxes for the state’s wealthiest residents and increased the sales tax in order to fund schools and pay down debt. The tax hikes helped California erase $27 billion in debt, and the state has since enjoyed some of the strongest economic growth in the country."

As laboratories of democracy, "there’s no question which state embarked on the more successful test."

http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed...622-story.html
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-28-2017, 08:28 AM
 
Location: LEAVING CD
22,952 posts, read 22,549,626 times
Reputation: 15493
Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
Is it too hard to do your own research and then come back and write: "There isn't even a 'final plan' in place yet"?
Where's the fun in that?
The point, since it seems I have to explain is "Shouldn't people who are in a lather about something actually understand they're all upset and screaming over something that's not a finished product yet?"
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-28-2017, 08:30 AM
 
Location: Home, Home on the Front Range
22,896 posts, read 16,281,876 times
Reputation: 12816
Quote:
Originally Posted by GotHereQuickAsICould View Post
Such a crazy plan that it is difficult to see how this is anything but the GOP "dancing with the guys that brung them."
They've admitted as much.

"What could create such a sense of urgency and desperation among a legislative body with a 90-percent-plus reelection rate? Donors, big donors. Rep. Chris Collins (R-N.Y.) was quoted as saying, “My donors are basically saying, ‘Get it done or don’t ever call me again.'”

In another highly revealing statement, Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) posited that, “The financial contributions will stop.” The threat of big donor defections has congressional Republicans on edge."

Tax plans show Congress putting donors over voters | TheHill

Both plans were written with no one but big donors in mind.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-28-2017, 08:34 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
28,266 posts, read 26,258,197 times
Reputation: 11726
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimj View Post
Where's the fun in that?
The point, since it seems I have to explain is "Shouldn't people who are in a lather about something actually understand they're all upset and screaming over something that's not a finished product yet?"
So the time to mount objections to the bill are when it's finalized and passed? How many bills have there been in the history of Congress that faced zero criticism prior to release of the final text of the bill?

The only ones that come to mind are joint resolutions to rename a post office or stretch of highway after someone. It's a normal part of the democratic process to debate and criticize draft bills (and also hold hearings, which the GOP isn't doing for this bill).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-28-2017, 08:45 AM
 
Location: Bella Vista, Ark
71,993 posts, read 83,671,479 times
Reputation: 41793
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilcart View Post
Didn't see this posted yet. seems Rs don't want to talk about this tax plan because it is clearly going to hurt millions while enriching those at the top the most and throwing a dry old bone to those on about 100k ..

The CBO says the poor , the low income and most of the middle will not do well out of this plan.




https://www.aol.com/article/news/201...inds/23289281/
not taking sides, but I do take anything written in the Wash Post or AOL with a grain of salt.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-28-2017, 08:50 AM
 
15,323 posts, read 4,047,808 times
Reputation: 11055
Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
Then I'll doesn't address everything, but is a step in the right direction.

3. Cut spending.
.
Ah, so dead and suffering people and another 1.5 TRILLION piled onto debt is the conservative definition of "cutting spending"....

And please don't lecture us about the 5%. The only way to bring the budget into balance is to raise taxes, cut the security state and improve the ACA. Without doing all three we will be more in debt in 4 years than we are today.

Right about then the world may decide that Chinas currency is more stable. Then you can go to the local bank and they will give you $1 bills for your $10's and all will be OK.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-28-2017, 08:52 AM
Status: "Trump: Inept, Incompetent, Insecure" (set 8 days ago)
 
10,518 posts, read 6,209,999 times
Reputation: 7245
Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerLily24 View Post
They've admitted as much.

"What could create such a sense of urgency and desperation among a legislative body with a 90-percent-plus reelection rate? Donors, big donors. Rep. Chris Collins (R-N.Y.) was quoted as saying, “My donors are basically saying, ‘Get it done or don’t ever call me again.'”

In another highly revealing statement, Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) posited that, “The financial contributions will stop.” The threat of big donor defections has congressional Republicans on edge."

Tax plans show Congress putting donors over voters | TheHill

Both plans were written with no one but big donors in mind.


Exactly as I have noted earlier on in this thread.


I also noted, elsewhere (see below), of a Republican strategist whom wrote, a few days ago, that the Republicans are playing a 'long game'. In short, Republicans realize that they are probably facing significant defeat next November as well as losing the Presidency in 2020; that they realize that this 'tax reform' which favors the wealthy and yet increases the debt, will probably result in a recession.


However, the author also pointed out that voters tend to blame the party that is in power when such recessions occur, and not look back in time to see if it was the other party that created the conditions for the recession.


Hence, the 'long game' is 1) the Republicans pass the tax reform (tax cuts to wealthy) that their major donors desire; 2) Republicans lose power in next two elections; but 3) the recession hits while Democrats are in power, with Republicans suddenly re-discovering the horrors of the National Debt, and blaming the Democrats, which the voters will respond to. Republicans again in control in 2024, and all is well.


Here is the opinion article I am referring to, by Bruce Bartlett:


https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...cuts-democrats


One interesting paragraph among many (discussing how the party in power is blamed for economic conditions created by the prior party in power):

"I think Republicans remember better than Democrats the lesson of 1993 as well. Bill Clinton was elected in 1992 on an activist agenda. But once in office, he was persuaded to reverse course and put all his efforts into deficit reduction. This transformation was spelled out in detail in Bob Woodward’s 1994 book, The Agenda.


Its key element was a significant tax increase that every Republican in Congress voted against. They said it would crash the economy, but was instead followed by an economic boom. Unfortunately, the boom didn’t become apparent until after the 1994 election in which Democrats took heavy losses – in large part because of the tax increase. Republicans got control of both houses of Congress for the first time in 40 years."


It is, at least, food for thought. It does serve to explain the Republicans insistence on passing this tax reform that will greatly benefit the wealthy and corporations, while those 'tax cuts' for the middle class have a 10-year lifespan.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-28-2017, 10:07 AM
 
Location: NC
5,121 posts, read 1,824,880 times
Reputation: 2374
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTAtech View Post
If you disagree with the Penn study, you need to state what exactly they got wrong. It doesn't cut it to merely dismiss it because you think they are liberal. If a liberal says the sky is blue, you wo't believe it? People like you often just know things that they really don't know. I'm sure your extensive evaluation is far more accurate.

25 million people who have health insurance who couldn't get it before would disagree with your extensive evaluation.

uh, no. I don't.

Th 25 million who have health insurance(thats you parroting a leftist MSM talking point) get it on the backs of working deplorables like me, Its not cool that Im forced to subsidize the costs of others healthcare premiums.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-28-2017, 10:11 AM
 
Location: NC
5,121 posts, read 1,824,880 times
Reputation: 2374
As long as getting rid of the AMT remains in the plan, Im for it. All of you that keep saying tax cuts for the rich are drinking the kool-aid pushed by the liberals and wannabes(like Sanders) in opposition.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:16 AM.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top