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Old 07-20-2018, 11:43 AM
 
12,960 posts, read 3,290,047 times
Reputation: 1616

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Quote:
Originally Posted by mightleavenyc View Post
I woke up this morning and the liberal media was screaming that the stock market was going to crash today since Trump announced he was willing to go up to $500B in tariffs on China, but it's actually flat and slightly up today.
What media is this you are referring to or focused upon? I read all variety of news sources every morning and I'm not hearing any of this "screaming."

Sure I can find headlines of any sort, but I try to stick with the more reputable news sources that are not quite so bent on sensationalism that appeals to their emotionally driven readers.

There is lots of speculation and prediction related to this trade war that Trump seems intent on pushing, to the tune of $500 billion, of course. Anyone who knows anything about how these sorts of tariffs and/or trade disputes can and do affect world economies is a fool to think the ramifications are not significant. Thing is, however, we've got a pretty strong economy that has been on an upward trajectory since before Trump came on the scene. A $20 trillion dollar economy like ours -- per year -- doesn't turn around overnight any more than a large tanker on the sea can change course like a small boat can.

What all happens further out into the opens seas, however, for better or worse, is an open question that all economists are speculating about right now, without clear consensus...
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Old 07-20-2018, 11:46 AM
 
27,267 posts, read 9,256,890 times
Reputation: 9514
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe View Post
Give it up already...

I've been following politics a long time now. I follow the news every morning, religiously, and along with my many years being a liberal/progressive, I managed to get my undergraduate degree in business, my MBA and eventually my own business. I also have a good many friends that are liberal and a good many who are conservative. None of my liberal friends have ever argued all should be equal, and fortunately, none of my conservative friends utter the sort of nonsense you insist on pushing.

The minimum wage, for example, actually applies to a very small percentage of the workforce, just for starters, in no way remotely close to any sort of effort to make all equal. The vast majority of people working for a wage earn more, and then there are those who earn salaries and/or "exempt" employees not paid by the hour (and usually paid a good deal more by way of salary).

The reason or argument that a minimum wage be federal is to help businesses compete on an equal playing field, so that one state can't undercut others by paying their workers less than other states do. Believe it or not, many business owners actually prefer this minimum so they don't have to keep dropping the pay for their workers to compete with the cut-throat businesses that could give a rat's behind about paying a fair or decent wage to their workers.

I know just a little about this because the business I started, owned and operated was an employment agency that hired and paid thousands of workers at the minimum wage rate. Even with that, I had to compete with other staffing companies that hired illegal workers who were more than glad to work for less. A minimum wage is hardly different than laws covering working conditions, safety and who is legal to work. Most business owners want sensible laws that apply to all businesses equally, so that all these issues aren't driven to the least common denominator lead by the worst business operators who care nothing about the people they employ.
The problem you have is the liberal/progressive party doesn't support what you want as a business person.
They want the illegals crossing the border unimpeded and driving the wages down. They support and champion the sanctuary city/state and abolishing agency's like ICE and law enforcement in general. Without law enforcement business is at the mercy of the collective and it won't be kind to business.
Pushing for a socialist state isn't individual business friendly.

Last edited by phma; 07-20-2018 at 11:54 AM..
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Old 07-20-2018, 11:48 AM
 
12,960 posts, read 3,290,047 times
Reputation: 1616
Quote:
Originally Posted by petch751 View Post
Yep this reminds me of the liberal freak out, one being Marc Cuban, screaming the market was going to crash if Trump was elected.
You new to politics maybe? Remember all the dire predictions about what would happen to our economy if Obama took over? Funny given the state of affairs handed over by GW. For most people back then, things could hardly get worse but of course there were all those anti-Obama folks intent on predicting the worst, just like everyone does when it comes to speculating the other candidate will take office rather than theirs.

Bit of an ongoing joke if you ask me, and the joke is on us...
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Old 07-20-2018, 11:55 AM
 
12,960 posts, read 3,290,047 times
Reputation: 1616
Quote:
Originally Posted by petch751 View Post
Liberals are hoping for a recession ‘to Get Rid of Trump. Yet, people on the left think liberals care about them
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/bi...get-rid-trump/

How A Recession hurts the average American:

1. Companies cut expenses, including laying off workers, reducing their hours or eliminating jobs,
2. With less money to spend due to a recession delay going on vacation and buying cars etc..,
3. Unemployment and financial pressures brought on by a recession affect family relationships.
4. Home values fall, and people whose main asset is their home lose equity and have trouble selling
You should be ashamed, or at least know better...

Your statement is that "Liberals are hoping for a recession," and you use Snopes of all things to prove your point. The Snopes link is about what Bill Maher said! Maher the voice of all Liberals now? Then you go on to list why recessions are bad. What an insult to just about anyone's intelligence!

Hey, but using dumb down tactics to promote this sort of agenda helps to keep things simple for all who are simple. All we need do now is listen to whatever Rosanne has to say to know what all conservatives think?
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Old 07-20-2018, 12:02 PM
 
27,267 posts, read 9,256,890 times
Reputation: 9514
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe View Post
You should be ashamed, or at least know better...

Your statement is that "Liberals are hoping for a recession," and you use Snopes of all things to prove your point. The Snopes link is about what Bill Maher said! Maher the voice of all Liberals now? Then you go on to list why recessions are bad. What an insult to just about anyone's intelligence!

Hey, but using dumb down tactics to promote this sort of agenda helps to keep things simple for all who are simple. All we need do now is listen to whatever Rosanne has to say to know what all conservatives think?
Very condescending. Lets hear from someone who knows you didn't build that business like you claimed.

Here he is :



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GjqdP6KSOE
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Old 07-20-2018, 12:04 PM
 
12,960 posts, read 3,290,047 times
Reputation: 1616
Quote:
Originally Posted by phma View Post
The problem you have is the liberal/progressive party doesn't support what you want as a business person.
They want the illegals crossing the border unimpeded and driving the wages down. They support and champion the sanctuary city/state and abolishing agency's like ICE and law enforcement in general. Without law enforcement business is at the mercy of the collective and it won't be kind to business.
Pushing for a socialist state isn't individual business friendly.
No, wrong. This is not my problem and of the many problems we all face, one very significant problem is the misrepresentation of facts, ideology and thinking that you seem Hell bent to promote. I highly recommend that you too give this thread a good review...

"Without truth, democracy is hobbled."

Show me a liberal who is against sensible immigration policy, law enforcement and what works best for all concerned, including business interests, and I'll show you yet another conservative trying to pretend they know the first thing about these subjects and issues. Another demonstrating just how lacking their objectivity and understanding can be. The "pushing for a socialist state" is about as dumbed down as conservative propaganda can get, but hey, at least just a notch better than trying to associate liberal/progressive thinking with communism.

Do you even know what these political terms actually mean?
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Old 07-20-2018, 12:05 PM
 
Location: The Driftless Area, WI
2,784 posts, read 1,078,313 times
Reputation: 6009
First of all, let's not make the mistake of trying to find a simple answer to a complex problem.
Secondly, The Stock Market is not The Economy. The stock market is one of the places people with excess money dump it, or people looking to the future hope to keep pace with inflation for their retirement. The market went up under Obama because investors were parking their money there (increased demand), not wanting to expand their businesses in an unfavorable regulatory environment. Mathematicians have been looking for a formula to explain the market for a century and their only conclusion has been that the market is legalized gambling: especially now that computers do most of the trading based on programs designed with technical factors, not fundamentals, in mind.
The economy is more directly measured by employment figures- when business is good, more people are working. By that measure, Obama's economy was one of the worst in history and Trump's is among the best.


Regulations kill business and their only real purpose is to maintain the jobs of the bureaucrats who make them.
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Old 07-20-2018, 12:13 PM
 
12,960 posts, read 3,290,047 times
Reputation: 1616
Quote:
Originally Posted by phma View Post
Very condescending. Lets hear from someone who knows you didn't build that business like you claimed.

Here he is :
I rarely feel that being condescending is any more appropriate.

Yes! Let's do hear from someone a bit more knowledgable, rational, intelligent and clearer thinking, but let's understand what we are hearing! I've heard this from Obama more than a few times because of people who simply will not accept what Obama was trying to explain, just like all who insist he apologized to Japan. Not true! Conservative propaganda that simply will not let the truth see the light of day. BS!

I was a business owner and I worked hard to start and build my business. I also had no problem whatsoever understanding what Obama was trying to explain and why. Problem is, however, trying to rationalize the likes with people like you is a waste of time, just like my time spent in this forum trying to explain the same things.

Instead of exchanging rational objective thoughts and ideas, I've got to devote ridiculous amounts of time fending off ridiculous comments about socialism, fascism, communism, and all the rest of the nonsense heavy right-wingers want to throw at all things not aligned with conservative thinking.

Condescending is the more polite approach as compared to a good many other approaches that come to mind when I encounter this sort of nonsense!
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Old 07-20-2018, 12:15 PM
 
23,469 posts, read 12,423,721 times
Reputation: 7453
You don't think Trump is being condescending when he hurls insults at folks who 'aren't as rich as him' - -implying they are less than (Mitt Romney in particular).

Yes the rally crowd cheered as he mocked folks who didn't have as much as he did.

Shaking my head.

Look -- if you are a conservative you didn't like anything Obama said -- and if you are a liberal or a REAL conservative -- you don't like most if not all of what Trump says.

It is what it is.
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Old 07-20-2018, 12:18 PM
 
12,960 posts, read 3,290,047 times
Reputation: 1616
Quote:
Originally Posted by guidoLaMoto View Post
First of all, let's not make the mistake of trying to find a simple answer to a complex problem.
Secondly, The Stock Market is not The Economy. The stock market is one of the places people with excess money dump it, or people looking to the future hope to keep pace with inflation for their retirement. The market went up under Obama because investors were parking their money there (increased demand), not wanting to expand their businesses in an unfavorable regulatory environment. Mathematicians have been looking for a formula to explain the market for a century and their only conclusion has been that the market is legalized gambling: especially now that computers do most of the trading based on programs designed with technical factors, not fundamentals, in mind.
The economy is more directly measured by employment figures- when business is good, more people are working. By that measure, Obama's economy was one of the worst in history and Trump's is among the best.

Regulations kill business and their only real purpose is to maintain the jobs of the bureaucrats who make them.
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H. L. Mencken

I like your premise, but unfortunately you too simplify more than a few things in a way I can't consider entirely accurate, beginning with what claim any POTUS can have on the economy they inherit or preside over. Again ours is a $20 trillion dollar economy, per year, with many "movers and shakers" that dictate our economic state of affairs in ways that most Americans can't even imagine, just for starters...

I'm tempted to get into a few other good points you touch upon, but I really need to get on with doing something productive with my time. Maybe tomorrow...
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