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Much of the wealth and privilege of white SA's is based on theft and exploitation of blacks. We are talking about billions and billions.
Maybe, but nobody would have invaded and stolen their homeland and treated them like second-class citizens in their own home.
I don't understand how one can not see the moral side of it, which is by far the most important one. Other countries are doing fine without gold and diamonds, so no, those do not justify all the crimes that were committed.
White SA's were lucky that there was Mandela, without him and the generosity and benevolence of blacks they would have fared a lot worse after the end of Apartheid. Maybe there would even have been a little genocide...
So white SA's should stop whining about the end of their material and other privileges.
Other countries in Africa had the same natural resources and people from those countries are immigrating to South Africa as their countries are doing terribly. South Africa is richer than the rest, even after decades of economic stagnation, because they had implemented the rule of law and fought corruption to a much larger extent than other countries.
Compensation has been given to people who can prove that their land was stolen. But a lot of people chose money compensation over land. Land is not as important as some people here make it out to be. People are not living in the 15th century wanting to be a peasant. People would rather live comfortably in a city. And after decades of ANC rule, its clear that corruption and abuse of power is getting out of hand within the ruling elite. People are treated as second class citizens. Not based on race, but on class. And they are two different things. And as always, the ruling elite will target a minority or foreigners if they feel their power is threatened. Going down the route of Zimbabwe in order for the ANC (and their allies) to preserve their power is just wrong.
In regards to my own property, I do own multiple properties, if it came out that prior to me owning said property that they were stolen from someone and subsequently sold to me, I honestly would want the property to go back to the legal owner.
So would you support legislation that ensured that Native Americans got hold of all your properties and everyone else's property in America who are not Native American? Cant you see how destructive this is?
I actually agree that economically, technologically etc. SA has deteriorated under ANC rule, not least due to the black hole of qualified African people after the end of Apartheid, a result of Apartheid.
Then again, as s white person that is none of my business. It is the Africans' continent and if they want to ruin it and drown in corruption and superstition (like one of their recent presidents who believed sleeping with a virgin cures AIDS), it is none of my business. I would also fight African invaders coming here to Europe and telling us how to do things, taking our stuff etc.
I actually agree that economically, technologically etc. SA has deteriorated under ANC rule, not least due to the black hole of qualified African people after the end of Apartheid, a result of Apartheid.
Then again, as s white person that is none of my business. It is the Africans' continent and if they want to ruin it and drown in corruption and superstition (like one of their recent presidents who believed sleeping with a virgin cures AIDS), it is none of my business. I would also fight African invaders coming here to Europe and telling us how to do things, taking our stuff etc.
No you wouldn't. It's been happening and EU governments say you'll not just accept it you'll celebrate it.
No you wouldn't. It's been happening and EU governments say you'll not just accept it you'll celebrate it.
There are no African invaders. The few African migrants (relative speaking, Europe is a continent of half a billion people, so thousands or tens of thousands of African migrants is like nothing) that arrive here and manage to stay don't try to change Europe, instead they want to integrate in our society if we let them.
The white folks are going to have to make a decision. Do they arm themselves and take the country over or do they move out. Because the black leadership wants them gone or dead.
White folks have been a pretty hardy bunch throughout history. I don't like the black folk's chances much if they decide to fight.
Lol...oh yeah?
Whites were once the masters of Sub Saharan Africa. They aren’t the masters NOW. You think they just walked out of Africa because they’re such benevolent and generous people?
So what were you saying again about whose chances you like?
Quote:
Originally Posted by It'sAutomatic
A black American is as concerned with black South Africa as much as a white person in the US is concerned about white Belarussia. Why you're asking for their opinion is beyond me.
Because all blacks are alike. Lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by aslowdodge
I haven't read through all this, but this is a pretty severe action.
I can't help but think things will turn violent over this.
South Africa has been violent since its establishment. There’s never been a lull in the violence.
The only thing that changes is who the violence is perpetrated upon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyrano
If the white Afrikaaners had followed this admirable sentiment throughout their long imposition of apartheid, and of course the 1913 Land Act, maybe they’d be in a better position.
No one EVER thinks about that.
South Africa saw this movie play out in Rhodesia and they had a chance and plenty of time to enact prophylactic measures to prevent the same from happening in their country.
They were disinterested. Why? Because they thought they had a better stranglehold on South Africa than the whites had on Rhodesia. Big mistake.
Quote:
Originally Posted by katygirl68
I’ll have to take your word for it. It might just be a tiny group that sounds worse than it is, but it is scary to see. Glad you posted this. I’ve never been to any country in Africa, so I’m quite ignorant about the different countries. Thanks.
Americans don’t know about any country but their own...and they barely know about that either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtl1
White people in SA should refuse to be imposed upon and scapegoated and demand an independent nation or pick up their ball and try to leave. White Americans probably will need to do the same and demand independence in America too the way things are headed.
Bye. Don’t let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya.
So would you support legislation that ensured that Native Americans got hold of all your properties and everyone else's property in America who are not Native American? Cant you see how destructive this is?
The situation I described had nothing to do with legislation.
I stated if I found out my particular property had been stolen from another individual/family, I'd want them to have it back.
However, since you brought up native Americans, I'll note that I have ancestors who lived in a county in Northern Michigan where an indigenous tribe made a deal (treaty) with the American government for a reservation in Northern Michigan in exchange of the tribe relinquishing its claim on the majority of the state. The government and tribe agreed to this in the late 19th century, when my 4th great mother lived in this area.
I have letters that she and her brothers wrote to relatives where they mention the land that the Indians were giving up and how family members should move there to buy the land. Family members heeded that call and came and bought lands and were founding community members of a city in that area.
The Indian community lived on their reserved lands (reservation) while also engaging in friendly trade with the white and blacks in Michigan and they got along well. However, over the years the state of Michigan began taking away the Indians reservation for other purposes. The Indians tried to stop them via court process but were not successful. Today there are popular resort towns on the land that was supposed to be reserved for the Indians and the Indians still have the treaty they signed. In 2016 they sued the state of Michigan for the return of all their reserved lands basically that they would have dominion over that large swath in regards to their members in specific legal circumstances. There was a similar suit in Michigan some time ago and that tribe and local community made a settlement and the tribe got claim to their land. This tribe is seeking to do the same thing. Since they had an agreement in place with the State of Michigan and the US government that those lands were supposed to be a tribal reservation, I do believe that even today, those lands should go back to the tribe. I wouldn't support legislation for it because the tribe has the treaty and everyone knows that they have a valid claim to the land.
As a property owner/investor, one is supposed to research the land/property that they buy before buying it to ensure no one has a legal claim to it. When I seek out new properties to add to my portfolio, I have a search performed to ensure as much as I can that there won't be an issue. Legislation is not needed in cases like these IMO.
They should do a thorough land reform.
But, given that white people originally stole the land from native Africans, I do understand that basically white people can't be allowed to remain privileged in any way, including the ownership of land and other resources. I know it must be hard for white people there to accept, but leaving things the way they are, would set a bad example. When I steal a million dollars and give it to my grandson, should he be allowed to keep it just because he did not steal it himself? I don't think so.
I think white SA's should be happy they are allowed to stay in SA instead of being kicked out and told to go back to Britain or the Netherlands where their criminal, genocidal ancestors came from.
White SA's should hand their land over to the government voluntarily and ask the government to do a fair land reform where every citizen gets their fair share of the land.
(Such a reform is also overdue in several Latin American countries.)
Communism does not work dude.
When the white people came to that part of Africa the land was uninhabited.
As the state takes over the farms the country will head into a famine.
Great idea South Africa because look how well that worked out for Zimbabwe <sarcasm>. Prior to the land grab Zimbabwe was the bread basket of Africa.
When blacks become the majority the same thing will happen in the USA.
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