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Old 03-30-2008, 01:41 PM
 
Location: Florida
2,336 posts, read 7,027,010 times
Reputation: 2304

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Quote:
Originally Posted by expat007 View Post
you learnt "wanna" from the 12th grade??
Twelfth grade? I have an MBA. I will put my English reading comprehension skills up against any illegal currently living in America, and I will smoke them all. To boot, I pay my taxes and don't rely on taxpayer-funded social services to do a damn thing for me. Illegal immigrants should be down on their knees kissing my A for everything my taxes provide for them. Instead, they're flying the Mexican flag and whining that I won't learn Spanish.
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Old 03-30-2008, 01:48 PM
 
523 posts, read 1,282,180 times
Reputation: 149
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiU08 View Post
Indisputable that we need a common language - we have one already, though. I know it seems like splitting hairs on semantics, but there is a huge difference between the two. The United States requires that (legitimate) immigrants pass an English proficiency test for naturalization. This test is estimated to be around a third- or fourth-grade reading/comprehension proficiency level.

So what's the PROBLEM?? Making English the official language won't affect anyone other than illegal aliens.
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Old 03-30-2008, 01:50 PM
 
523 posts, read 1,282,180 times
Reputation: 149
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe_Ryder View Post
If you were bleeding to death on an operating room table, I'm sure you'd want everyone in the room to speak a common language.

.
Yes I would. It is sickening how much illegal butt we kiss.
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Old 03-30-2008, 01:50 PM
 
1,544 posts, read 2,269,524 times
Reputation: 117
what your tax paid for was an illegal war overseas, what you pay on illegals is pittance
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Old 03-30-2008, 01:54 PM
 
523 posts, read 1,282,180 times
Reputation: 149
Foreign language ballots cost taxpayers millions of dollars, and in many cases, localities are required to purchase additional election materials that are never used.

News Center: Press Release - United States Representative Steve King (http://www.house.gov/apps/list/hearing/ia05_king/ColumnForeignBallots062006.html - broken link)

I work hard for my money, why am I forced to contribute to this??

People need to wake up. We are getting nickeled and dimes into the poor house while illegals flock here for free services.
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Old 03-30-2008, 01:57 PM
 
523 posts, read 1,282,180 times
Reputation: 149
Quote:
Originally Posted by expat007 View Post
what your tax paid for was an illegal war overseas, what you pay on illegals is pittance

Two wrongs do not make a right. Two illegals just came up from TX and murdered a couple in their Troy, MI home. More than a "pittance," dear.

Um, where do you live, work and pay taxes again? I must have missed that part.
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Old 03-30-2008, 02:10 PM
 
Location: San Francisco
357 posts, read 890,891 times
Reputation: 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pimpy View Post
What a joke. Third or fourth grade? Makes me wanna puke. How about TWELFTH GRADE or you get sent back to your country. We are the greatest nation in the world and we are accepting LESS than mediocrity from those coming here from inferior places.
I don't know if you realized this throughout your schooling, but English is a pretty tough language. It has taken me all of my life to master it, and I still learn things about it every day (as I hope has been your experience). It is fundamentally impossible to require someone to have that level of proficiency to retain citizenship. In fact, that type of requirement would disenfranchise a huge portion of the American-born population! The National Center for Educational Statistics (NCES) did a comprehensive survey in 2003 of Americans age 16 and older - the results were very revealing: fully 22% of adults are at a "Below Basic" comprehension level. On the 500 point scale, the average American score was 271 (265 is considered basic proficiency). Less than 65% of Americans are Intermediate Proficiency or above (measured by things like understanding metaphors in simple poems or being able to analyze salary information in a job offer, for instance).

Just as a side note: most commercial magazines and newspapers are written at a sixth- or seventh-grade proficiency level. Third- or fourth-grade level is fairly demanding for a non-native speaker.

P.S. - inferior places? Judgmental much?

All statistics come from this document: 2003 NCES Study
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Old 03-30-2008, 02:15 PM
 
Location: Florida
2,336 posts, read 7,027,010 times
Reputation: 2304
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiU08 View Post
I don't know if you realized this throughout your schooling, but English is a pretty tough language. It has taken me all of my life to master it, and I still learn things about it every day (as I hope has been your experience). It is fundamentally impossible to require someone to have that level of proficiency to retain citizenship. In fact, that type of requirement would disenfranchise a huge portion of the American-born population! The National Center for Educational Statistics (NCES) did a comprehensive survey in 2003 of Americans age 16 and older - the results were very revealing: fully 22% of adults are at a "Below Basic" comprehension level. On the 500 point scale, the average American score was 271 (265 is considered basic proficiency). Less than 65% of Americans are Intermediate Proficiency or above (measured by things like understanding metaphors in simple poems or being able to analyze salary information in a job offer, for instance).

Just as a side note: most commercial magazines and newspapers are written at a sixth- or seventh-grade proficiency level. Third- or fourth-grade level is fairly demanding for a non-native speaker.

P.S. - inferior places? Judgmental much?

All statistics come from this document: 2003 NCES Study
Maybe twelfth-grade is asking a little much, but third grade? Give me a break. If someone wants to come to the United States from another country and take jobs that could be filled by American-born citizens, I don't think it's too much to ask that they be able to read and comprehend something more sophisticated than a Judy Blume novel. When I was in third grade, my class's idea of poetry was The Diarrhea Song ("When you're sliding into home...") I think it is fair to request that adults immigrating to America be more literate than that.
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Old 03-30-2008, 02:16 PM
 
4,127 posts, read 5,065,593 times
Reputation: 1621
Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiU08 View Post
Indisputable that we need a common language - we have one already, though. I know it seems like splitting hairs on semantics, but there is a huge difference between the two. The United States requires that (legitimate) immigrants pass an English proficiency test for naturalization. This test is estimated to be around a third- or fourth-grade reading/comprehension proficiency level.

There is a huge difference between residency and citizenship. There is no language requirement for residency in the US as there is in most other countries. To be honest, once you have a green card, the only real advantage for the average person to get citizenship would be bragging rights.
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Old 03-30-2008, 02:18 PM
 
Location: San Francisco
357 posts, read 890,891 times
Reputation: 94
Voting in one's native language on one day of the year is unlikely to deter immigrants from learning English; there are many incentives for learning English that far outweigh the ability to conduct some necessary tasks in the native language. It has also been determined that bilingual ballots are most often used by a very specific group. A 1982 study by the Mexican American Legal Defense and Education Fund found that those most likely to use Spanish-language ballots were over 65, had a low level of education, and had low incomes (Avila, 1983). This group would most likely not vote at all if bilingual ballots were not available to them.



Regarding the cost of bilingual ballots: Bilingual voting services may sometimes require additional funds. However, it is the mandate of a democracy to give access to the ballot to as many citizens as possible. Doing so inevitably costs money. Voter registration drives take time and money. Allowing access to voting places to people in wheelchairs takes money. Special provisions for blind voters cost money. Absentee balloting costs money. Inclusion versus exclusion is the desired goal, one which is deemed worth the dollar price.
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