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Old 07-25-2018, 10:10 PM
 
Location: In the bee-loud glade
5,573 posts, read 3,334,079 times
Reputation: 12295

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Quote:
Originally Posted by McGowdog View Post
Waa! Not My Pwesident! Waa!

Watching "God-fearing" moderate progressive humanist diversified homogenized pasteurized liberals try to bonk Conservative Christian types over the head with shame makes me laugh my balls off.
I mean really. Jesus would definitely suck up to a murdering tyrant like Putin or hoard his stuff so nasty people from shythole countries didn't get any of it. And he'd understand people without principles, or worse yet people abandoning their principles to support someone who did those things. WWJD?

 
Old 07-25-2018, 10:16 PM
 
Location: 23.7 million to 162 million miles North of Venus
23,184 posts, read 12,303,428 times
Reputation: 10310
To the OP, wherever he/she ran off to..


Many are claiming they are fleeing local gangs(we have gangs here, too), abusive spouses, etc. Those are not reasons to flee a whole country, they could easily move to another part of their own country to get away with them.

Yes there is a lot of poverty in third world countries, but many that come here illegally pay $6,000, $15,000 or more to hire coyotes to bring them and their kids here. Many American citizens don't have that kind of savings. We have poverty in this country too. Have you ever walked around a poverty stricken area in this country? Maybe you, and other pro-illegal people, should go and speak with our own citizens, who live in those areas, to see what their needs are.

Many drag their kids along, they think they will be processed faster because of them. Some of those kids are raped or murdered or die from other hardships along the way. The parents know that there is a very good chance that those things could happen, yet they continue to place their kids in danger to come here. Some of the parents don't even bother coming here themselves, they just send their kids--with strangers. Some of the parents are drug mules and some turn their kids into drug mules.
Why do those who are pro-illegals not care about any of those kids?

We have almost 2 million children, citizen children, who are homeless and live in the street in this country. Why do the pro-illegal people not care about them, where the kids of illegals come before them?

Some of our tax dollars go to these other countries to aid the citizens, and, there are people who send money on their own. We, along with other countries, have also helped create jobs in third world countries by building factories so that people can work (Haiti was one of the places--and no, the clinton foundation didn't help them at all) Along with the tax dollars that go to help in their own countries, we also spend almost $140 billion to support illegals in this country.

People need to stop risking their children's lives to come here illegally. They won't stop on their own, even if they know that their kid may die while traveling here. We need to force them to stop - build the wall, we need e-verify and we need to stop or reform the 14th Amendment--birthright citizenship.
 
Old 07-25-2018, 10:19 PM
 
Location: Texas
37,937 posts, read 17,805,641 times
Reputation: 10366
Quote:
Originally Posted by AFP View Post
There were 16 candidates to pick from on the Republican side the most unscrupulous one by far was selected.
You are probably correct on that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AFP View Post
It wasn't only about Hillary
Of course it was. It was well known that people voted against her by voting for Trump. She was the worst candidate in the last 50 years and ran against the 2nd worst.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AFP View Post
and yes it does matter to me I do generally vote Democratic but have some conservative leanings and was brought up right. There is no excuse.
lol no excuse for what?
 
Old 07-25-2018, 10:21 PM
 
Location: Texas
37,937 posts, read 17,805,641 times
Reputation: 10366
Quote:
Originally Posted by kimchee View Post
I repped you because you asked a legit question. A simple question that all of us non-Trumpers on this board wonder about on a daily basis. All the conservatives who are attacking you are taking a cue from their cult leader. They will bully you until you become too demoralized to post again and question yourself. Keep it up, you have others on your side here.
LMAO You just exposed yourself. Trump isn't conservative. That's what your handlers tell you to say to cover up the fact that Progressivism is a known failure. All progressive policies have failed.
 
Old 07-25-2018, 10:28 PM
 
Location: Japan
15,292 posts, read 7,735,369 times
Reputation: 10006
Quote:
Originally Posted by DT113876 View Post
The Bible also speaks about justice for the stranger and the foreigner.


My religion (Evangelical Lutheran) does not interpret Romans 13 as to say that just because there is a law, that it is just. Christians are not obligated to follow unjust laws. No human being is. If somebody is fleeing for their life from violence or extreme poverty, then there is a duty to help them.
Billions of people live in places that are either violent or extremely poor relative to the United States. The Lutheran Church is free to go to violent, poverty stricken lands, try to help the people, and encourage others to join in the project. But when they start demanding that their fellow citizens absorb these billions into their own societies, it's time to tell the Lutherans where to get off.
 
Old 07-25-2018, 11:26 PM
 
Location: Central Florida
1,329 posts, read 829,326 times
Reputation: 737
Quote:
Originally Posted by berdee View Post
To the OP, wherever he/she ran off to..


Many are claiming they are fleeing local gangs(we have gangs here, too), abusive spouses, etc. Those are not reasons to flee a whole country, they could easily move to another part of their own country to get away with them.

Not when the whole region is overrun by criminal gangs. In many cases moving to a new town can get you killed because you are perceived as a police informant.


Quote:
Yes there is a lot of poverty in third world countries, but many that come here illegally pay $6,000, $15,000 or more to hire coyotes to bring them and their kids here. Many American citizens don't have that kind of savings. We have poverty in this country too. Have you ever walked around a poverty stricken area in this country? Maybe you, and other pro-illegal people, should go and speak with our own citizens, who live in those areas, to see what their needs are.

They get loans from the same criminal gangs or coyotes who then will put liens on their property or threaten to kill their family if they aren't payed back. Many immigrants get involved in indentured servitude in the US, working on large corporate farms to try to pay back the loans. Frontline had a documentary on this a few weeks ago.
 
Old 07-25-2018, 11:42 PM
 
Location: 23.7 million to 162 million miles North of Venus
23,184 posts, read 12,303,428 times
Reputation: 10310
Quote:
Originally Posted by DT113876 View Post
Not when the whole region is overrun by criminal gangs. In many cases moving to a new town can get you killed because you are perceived as a police informant.


They get loans from the same criminal gangs or coyotes who then will put liens on their property or threaten to kill their family if they aren't payed back. Many immigrants get involved in indentured servitude in the US, working on large corporate farms to try to pay back the loans. Frontline had a documentary on this a few weeks ago.
I'll have to take your word on those things.


People in those countries need to stand up and fight or they will always be running. Some people are finally doing that in Mexico, against cartels and gangs, some have been fairly successful, so it can be done. We aren't doing them any favors by letting them come here. As long as there is a relief valve they will never stand up for themselves.
 
Old 07-26-2018, 12:08 AM
 
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD
3,674 posts, read 3,026,956 times
Reputation: 5466
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmgg View Post
As someone who lives right across the border from Iowa, I'll answer as a person of mostly conservative leanings and a Midwesterner.


The key word in everything to do with immigrants is the word LEGAL. Follow the rules of the country. No stepping in line in front of immigrants who are going through the proper chains towards citizenship. We cannot as a country save the world and maintain a standard of living even close to what we have now. It boggles the mind watching crowds of illegals waving the flags from the country they just fled in pride after it crapped on them. We need people coming to this country who WANT to become Americans. Once here, the Stars and Stripes is what should be coveted. Mexico as a country is turning into a toilet. You want unethical? How about the fact that their immigration laws are tougher than ours, yet they do everything possible to maintain the pipeline of immigrants from South America and Central America straight to OUR borders. Where's Mexico's compassion? How much financial help does Mexico provide these immigrants. (p.s., the answer is nothing).


I do not care about where someone is from as long as they are a citizen of this country. Embracing diversity is a liberal term meant to shame people. Whatever mix of cultures happens in my area should be a matter of individual choice. There is absolutely no benefit to anyone to bring in huge numbers of any particular ethnic group to any established locality in the country. When this happens, we end up with gang issues, crime, and localities with more allegiance to their former pathetic country they fled than to the country that allowed them in. Embrace diversity? No, I embrace ASSIMILATION.


Many of the Hispanics where I'm from work very hard. As a group, they are far more willing to work and not work the "system" to pump freebees like many other ethnic groups. Just get the process going towards citizenship or leave.

Outstanding post!!! To me, it's a matter of fairness and obeying laws, yet somehow that's xenophobic.
Legal immigrants should be welcomed with open arms, but somehow that's STILL a racist concept.
 
Old 07-26-2018, 12:18 AM
 
1,728 posts, read 3,120,560 times
Reputation: 1472
Quote:
Originally Posted by berdee View Post
To the OP, wherever he/she ran off to..


Many are claiming they are fleeing local gangs(we have gangs here, too), abusive spouses, etc. Those are not reasons to flee a whole country, they could easily move to another part of their own country to get away with them.

Yes there is a lot of poverty in third world countries, but many that come here illegally pay $6,000, $15,000 or more to hire coyotes to bring them and their kids here. Many American citizens don't have that kind of savings. We have poverty in this country too. Have you ever walked around a poverty stricken area in this country? Maybe you, and other pro-illegal people, should go and speak with our own citizens, who live in those areas, to see what their needs are.

Many drag their kids along, they think they will be processed faster because of them. Some of those kids are raped or murdered or die from other hardships along the way. The parents know that there is a very good chance that those things could happen, yet they continue to place their kids in danger to come here. Some of the parents don't even bother coming here themselves, they just send their kids--with strangers. Some of the parents are drug mules and some turn their kids into drug mules.
Why do those who are pro-illegals not care about any of those kids?

We have almost 2 million children, citizen children, who are homeless and live in the street in this country. Why do the pro-illegal people not care about them, where the kids of illegals come before them?

Some of our tax dollars go to these other countries to aid the citizens, and, there are people who send money on their own. We, along with other countries, have also helped create jobs in third world countries by building factories so that people can work (Haiti was one of the places--and no, the clinton foundation didn't help them at all) Along with the tax dollars that go to help in their own countries, we also spend almost $140 billion to support illegals in this country.

People need to stop risking their children's lives to come here illegally. They won't stop on their own, even if they know that their kid may die while traveling here. We need to force them to stop - build the wall, we need e-verify and we need to stop or reform the 14th Amendment--birthright citizenship.
I agree with you on the birthright citizenship policy. That needs to stop, just because you're born in America, doesn't mean you should be allowed to become a citizen. I'm tired of hearing about the Chinese coming to America as part of some birth tourism program. If only congress would stop bickering over partisanship issues and just do their job, we could solve some of the pressing immigration issues.

On the other hand, I don't agree with you that we can't take care of our homeless AND our immigrants at the same time. We've been doing this for years, it's this administration that is so adamant about proving it's doing its constituents' bidding that they enact atrocious policies like separating babies from parents. As if a long and dangerous journey to America isn't tough enough, now you're going to mass deport them w/o hearing why they are seeking asylum while keeping their kids? This is shameful on so many levels!

And no, don't started on it's the parents' fault for taking the risk because you might as well also blame your great grandparents for risking their family's lives as well. It's even more treacherous a journey to get to the USA when you have to cross an ocean way back when....
 
Old 07-26-2018, 01:14 AM
 
Location: 23.7 million to 162 million miles North of Venus
23,184 posts, read 12,303,428 times
Reputation: 10310
Quote:
Originally Posted by kimchee View Post
I agree with you on the birthright citizenship policy. That needs to stop, just because you're born in America, doesn't mean you should be allowed to become a citizen. I'm tired of hearing about the Chinese coming to America as part of some birth tourism program. If only congress would stop bickering over partisanship issues and just do their job, we could solve some of the pressing immigration issues.
It really does need to be changed.

Quote:
On the other hand, I don't agree with you that we can't take care of our homeless AND our immigrants at the same time. We've been doing this for years, it's this administration that is so adamant about proving it's doing its constituents' bidding that they enact atrocious policies like separating babies from parents. As if a long and dangerous journey to America isn't tough enough, now you're going to mass deport them w/o hearing why they are seeking asylum while keeping their kids? This is shameful on so many levels!
With almost 2 million children living in the streets each year, we're not doing a very good job with our homeless. Offhand I don't know how many adults are homeless, no doubt it's many millions. Plus there are many citizens that are poor, even though they may have shelter they have no food or clothing for themselves or their kids.

We send aid to these countries, why should we have to spend even more just because they come here, when that money could be going to our own poor, and to vets.

The people who make that trip to come here to seek asylum, seek asylum at the port of entry. Those people aren't usually split from their kids if they can verify that the kids are actually theirs and if they aren't committing a crime, such as carrying drugs (which many do). Coyotes/human traffickers are often with those kids. obama made the mistake of giving thousands of kids back to the coyotes (links to that have been posted many times in the forum), I'm sure Trump doesn't want to make the same mistake. I don't like to see families split up either , but I'd rather see that happen then for kids to end up with traffickers. The ones that are guaranteed to be split from their kids are the ones who come in illegally - and they KNOW they will be split up if they are caught.

Quote:
And no, don't started on it's the parents' fault for taking the risk because you might as well also blame your great grandparents for risking their family's lives as well. It's even more treacherous a journey to get to the USA when you have to cross an ocean way back when....
It is the parents fault, plain and simple.

For a very long time there were no immigration laws. If people wanted to come here, they came here. When we finally had immigration laws, people entering illegally would be sent back, and, people who came here but didn't make the grade were sent back. It wouldn't have mattered how far they traveled, if they had entered illegally or didn't make the cut - back they went. Plus, back then there were no social service, no welfare, no handouts, nothing. People that came here knew that they would have to work to survive.

People need to set their own countries right for themselves, for their kids, for their grand kids, etc. As long as they know they can just flee they won't do anything but run away.
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