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Old 07-30-2018, 02:36 PM
 
Location: Montgomery County, PA
16,569 posts, read 15,274,757 times
Reputation: 14591

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Quote:
Originally Posted by cuebald View Post
The Clinton Foundation was investigated seven ways from Sunday by the best hired snoops in the biz, but they were never able to dig up enough dirt to plant a flower. You got something they didn't find, bring it. Simply wishing something was so and saying so doesn't make it true.
Yeah, I got something. Where are the donations now that she is a nobody?
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Old 07-30-2018, 02:47 PM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
37,186 posts, read 19,200,869 times
Reputation: 14902
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quick Enough View Post
"will not know until the investigation is finished whether or what laws may have been violated"

The FBI did an "investigator" on hillary and the Director of the FBI went on national TV DETAILING how she broke several laws and nothing was done to her.

An "investigation"as opened up on Trump and hm colliding with the Russians.

Many dems and the LSM bragged it was a "slam dunk" yet, here we are 1 1/2 years later and still NO charges.

P.S. I am NOT making any claim one way or the other.
You need to send Hillary a box of chocolates or something. If she didn't exist, you wouldn't be able to post about Trump at all.

But, since you brought up the subject, What laws did she violate? Private server? Sending classified emails unsecured? What?

What evidence was produced and presented that she committed a crime, and did so with criminal intent? Why do you believe she was not charged and prosecuted by the head of the FBI, who was also the one who jerked the rug out from under her by announcing the reopening of the investigation eleven days before the election? Educate us.
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Old 07-30-2018, 02:49 PM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
37,186 posts, read 19,200,869 times
Reputation: 14902
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quick Enough View Post
"No, he broke his oath of Office with his side dealings with putin."


YOU made the claim NOW BACK IT UP.
SHOW US HIS TAX RETURNS SO WE CAN SEE WHERE HE GOT THE MONEY TO SERVICE HIS DEBTS.

See? We can yell, too.
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Old 07-30-2018, 02:50 PM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
37,186 posts, read 19,200,869 times
Reputation: 14902
Quote:
Originally Posted by vkhmini View Post
If laughter is the best medicine, I must thank all of you leftists here at CD for making me one healthy woman! Keep it up!
We'll be here all week. Try the veal. And don't forget to tip the waiter.
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Old 07-30-2018, 02:53 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
10,990 posts, read 20,567,401 times
Reputation: 8261
I think Giuliani is telegraphing what Trump has done. His offense is an attempt at defence. Why would he bother to mention the meetings with the Russians if there wasn't something there?
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Old 07-31-2018, 04:36 AM
 
59,059 posts, read 27,306,837 times
Reputation: 14285
Quote:
Originally Posted by cuebald View Post
You need to send Hillary a box of chocolates or something. If she didn't exist, you wouldn't be able to post about Trump at all.

But, since you brought up the subject, What laws did she violate? Private server? Sending classified emails unsecured? What?

What evidence was produced and presented that she committed a crime, and did so with criminal intent? Why do you believe she was not charged and prosecuted by the head of the FBI, who was also the one who jerked the rug out from under her by announcing the reopening of the investigation eleven days before the election? Educate us.
"What evidence was produced and presented that she committed a crime, and did so with criminal intent? Why do you believe she was not charged and prosecuted by the head of the FBI,"

Sometimes we have to repeat ourselves a MILLION times and some of you STILL ignore it and repeat the same old questions.

May if you pulled your eyes away from the alphabet "news" you WOULD no.

Why did you ask these questions? I thought all you libs were super educated and super smart n no EVERYTHING.

I'll answer your silly questions just to prove how ignorant some on the left are.

"What evidence was produced and presented that she committed a crime,"


"https://asweetdoseofreality.com/2016...lary-off-hook/
Quote:
Gowdy: Good morning, Director Comey. Secretary Clinton said she never sent or received any classified information over her private e-mail, was that true?
Comey: Our investigation found that there was classified information sent.
Gowdy: It was not true?
Comey: That’s what I said.
Gowdy: OK. Well, I’m looking for a shorter answer so you and I are not here quite as long. Secretary Clinton said there was nothing marked classified on her e-mails sent or received. Was that true?
Comey: That’s not true
. There were a small number of portion markings on I think three of the documents.
Gowdy: Secretary Clinton said “I did not e-mail any classified information to anyone on my e-mail there was no classified material.†That is true?
Comey: There was classified information emailed
.
Gowdy: Secretary Clinton used one device, was that true?
Comey: She used multiple devices during the four years of her term as Secretary of State.
Gowdy: Secretary Clinton said all work related emails were returned to the State Department. Was that true?
Comey: No. We found work related email, thousands, that were not returned.

Gowdy: Secretary Clinton said neither she or anyone else deleted work related emails from her personal account.
Comey: That’s a harder one to answer. We found traces of work related emails in — on devices or in space. Whether they were deleted or when a server was changed out something happened to them, there’s no doubt that the work related emails that were removed electronically from the email system.
Gowdy: Secretary Clinton said her lawyers read every one of the emails and were overly inclusive. Did her lawyers read the email content individually?
Comey: No."


" https://www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/pr...-e-mail-system

The FBI also discovered several thousand work-related e-mails that were not in the group of 30,000 that were returned by Secretary Clinton to State in 2014. We found those additional e-mails in a variety of ways. Some had been deleted over the years and we found traces of them on devices that supported or were connected to the private e-mail domain. Others we found by reviewing the archived government e-mail accounts of people who had been government employees at the same time as Secretary Clinton, including high-ranking officials at other agencies, people with whom a Secretary of State might naturally correspond.


Eight of those chains contained information that was Top Secret at the time they were sent; 36 chains contained Secret information at the time; and eight contained Confidential information, which is the lowest level of classification. Separate from those, about 2, From the group of 30,000 e-mails returned to the State Department, 110 e-mails in 52 e-mail chains have been determined by the owning agency to contain classified information at the time they were sent or received000 additional e-mails were “up-classified†to make them Confidential; the information in those had not been classified at the time the e-mails were sent.


This helped us recover work-related e-mails that were not among the 30,000 produced to State. Still others we recovered from the laborious review of the millions of e-mail fragments dumped into the slack space of the server decommissioned in 2013.

With respect to the thousands of e-mails we found that were not among those produced to State, agencies have concluded that three of those were classified at the time they were sent or received, one at the Secret level and two at the Confidential level. There were no additional Top Secret e-mails found. Finally, none of those we found have since been “up-classified.â€














HAVING CLASSIFIED MATERIAL on a private server is AGAINST THE LAW.




1. Mishandling Classified Information

Executive Order 13526 and 18 U.S.C Sec. 793(f) of the federal code make it unlawful to send of store classified information on personal email. Casey Harper at The Daily Caller delved into this angle:
"'By using a private email system, Secretary Clinton violated the Federal Records Act and the State Department’s Foreign Affairs Manual regarding records management, and worse, could have left classified and top secret documents vulnerable to cyber attack,' Cause of Action Executive Director Dan Epstein said in an email to reporters.
'This is an egregious violation of the law, and if it were anyone else, they could be facing fines and criminal prosecution.'â€
Harper goes on to point out that multiple violations of this law have been enforced recently, including in 1999, when former CIA Director John M. Deutch's security clearance was suspended for using his personal email to send classified information.
Additionally, this past week, Gen. David Patraeus pleaded guilty for mishandling classified information by using a Gmail account instead of his official government email.
18 USC 1924 reads:

Whoever being an officer, employee, contractor, or consultant of the United States, and, by virtue of his office, employment, position, or contract, becomes possessed of documents or materials containing classified information of the United States, knowingly removes such documents or materials without authority and with the intent to retain such documents or materials at an unauthorized location shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for not more than one year, or both.
2. Violation of The 2009 Federal Records Act

Section 1236.22 of the 2009 National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) requirements states that:
“Agencies that allow employees to send and receive official electronic mail messages using a system not operated by the agency must ensure that Federal records sent or received on such systems are preserved in the appropriate agency record keeping system.â€
According to the original story on Clinton's emails published in The New York Times:
"Federal regulations, since 2009, have required that all emails be preserved as part of an agency’s record-keeping system. In Mrs. Clinton’s case, her emails were kept on her personal account and her staff took no steps to have them preserved as part of State Department record.
In response to a State Department request, Mrs. Clinton’s advisers, late last year, reviewed her account and decided which emails to turn over to the State Department."
The fact that the State Department combs through the 55,000 pages of emails sent on Clinton's private email account seems to verify that at least some of the emails Clinton sent contained classified information.
3. Violation of the Freedom Of Information Act (FOIA)

Veterans for a Strong America has filed a lawsuit against the State Department over potential violations of FOIA. Joel Arends, chairman of the non-profit group, explained to the Washington Examiner that their FOIA request over the Benghazi affair specifically asked for any personal email accounts Secretary Clinton may have used:
“'At this point in time, I think we're the only ones that specifically asked for both her personal and government email and phone logs,' Arends said of his group's Benghazi-related request.â€
MSNBC's Lawrence O'Donnell believes that the use of a personal emails server appears to be a preemptive move, specifically designed to circumvent FOIA:
“'Hillary Clinton’s system was designed to defy Freedom of Information Act requests, which is designed to defy the law.'â€
[mga_video id=8oBEhNirSSg]
These are just three of the potential violations that Clinton may have committed by using a personal email account to conduct official State business. More information will be provided as this story continues to develop.
Supporters of Hillary Clinton continue to ask the equivalent of 'What difference does it make?'with regard to the former Secretary of State's use of a personal email account to conduct official State Department business.
Meanwhile, many investigative reporters are combing through federal rules and regulations to discover what criminal charges Clinton could face for her actions.
Here are the three most frequently cited laws that appear to have been violated by Clinton:
Executive Order 13526 and 18 U.S.C Sec. 793(f) of the federal code make it unlawful to send of store classified information on personal email. Casey Harper at The Daily Caller delved into this angle:
"'By using a private email system, Secretary Clinton violated the Federal Records Act and the State Department’s Foreign Affairs Manual regarding records management, and worse, could have left classified and top secret documents vulnerable to cyber attack,' Cause of Action Executive Director Dan Epstein said in an email to reporters.
'This is an egregious violation of the law, and if it were anyone else, they could be facing fines and criminal prosecution.'â€
Harper goes on to point out that multiple violations of this law have been enforced recently, including in 1999, when former CIA Director John M. Deutch's security clearance was suspended for using his personal email to send classified information.
Additionally, this past week, Gen. David Patraeus pleaded guilty for mishandling classified information by using a Gmail account instead of his official government email.
2. Violation of The 2009 Federal Records Act

Section 1236.22 of the 2009 National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) requirements states that:
“Agencies that allow employees to send and receive official electronic mail messages using a system not operated by the agency must ensure that Federal records sent or received on such systems are preserved in the appropriate agency record keeping system.â€
According to the original story on Clinton's emails published in The New York Times:
"Federal regulations, since 2009, have required that all emails be preserved as part of an agency’s record-keeping system. In Mrs. Clinton’s case, her emails were kept on her personal account and her staff took no steps to have them preserved as part of State Department record.
In response to a State Department request, Mrs. Clinton’s advisers, late last year, reviewed her account and decided which emails to turn over to the State Department."
The fact that the State Department combs through the 55,000 pages of emails sent on Clinton's private email account seems to verify that at least some of the emails Clinton sent contained classified information.
3. Violation of the Freedom Of Information Act (FOIA)

Veterans for a Strong America has filed a lawsuit against the State Department over potential violations of FOIA. Joel Arends, chairman of the non-profit group, explained to the Washington Examiner that their FOIA request over the Benghazi affair specifically asked for any personal email accounts Secretary Clinton may have used:
“'At this point in time, I think we're the only ones that specifically asked for both her personal and government email and phone logs,' Arends said of his group's Benghazi-related request.â€
MSNBC's Lawrence O'Donnell believes that the use of a personal emails server appears to be a preemptive move, specifically designed to circumvent FOIA:
“'Hillary Clinton’s system was designed to defy Freedom of Information Act requests, which is designed to defy the law.'â€
[mga_video id=8oBEhNirSSg]
These are just three of the potential violations that Clinton may have committed by using a personal email account to conduct official State business. More information will be provided as this story continues to develop.
Supporters of Hillary Clinton continue to ask the equivalent of 'What difference does it make?' with regard to the former Secretary of State's use of a personal email account to conduct official State Department business.Meanwhile, many investigative reporters are combing through federal rules and regulations to discover what criminal charges Clinton could face for her actions.Here are the three most frequently cited laws that appear to have been violated by Clinton:1. Mishandling Classified InformationExecutive Order 13526 and 18 U.S.C Sec. 793(f) of the federal code make it unlawful to send of store classified information on personal email. Casey Harper at The Daily Caller delved into this angle:"'By using a private email system, Secretary Clinton violated the Federal Records Act and the State Department’s Foreign Affairs Manual regarding records management, and worse, could have left classified and top secret documents vulnerable to cyber attack,' Cause of Action Executive Director Dan Epstein said in an email to reporters.'This is an egregious violation of the law, and if it were anyone else, they could be facing fines and criminal prosecution.'â€Harper goes on to point out that multiple violations of this law have been enforced recently, including in 1999, when former CIA Director John M. Deutch's security clearance was suspended for using his personal email to send classified information.Additionally, this past week, Gen. David Patraeus pleaded guilty for mishandling classified information by using a Gmail account instead of his official government email.2. Violation of The 2009 Federal Records ActSection 1236.22 of the 2009 National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) requirements states that:“Agencies that allow employees to send and receive official electronic mail messages using a system not operated by the agency must ensure that Federal records sent or received on such systems are preserved in the appropriate agency record keeping system.â€According to the original story on Clinton's emails published in The New York Times:"Federal regulations, since 2009, have required that all emails be preserved as part of an agency’s record-keeping system. In Mrs. Clinton’s case, her emails were kept on her personal account and her staff took no steps to have them preserved as part of State Department record.In response to a State Department request, Mrs. Clinton’s advisers, late last year, reviewed her account and decided which emails to turn over to the State Department."The fact that the State Department combs through the 55,000 pages of emails sent on Clinton's private email account seems to verify that at least some of the emails Clinton sent contained classified information.3. Violation of the Freedom Of Information Act (FOIA)Veterans for a Strong America has filed a lawsuit against the State Department over potential violations of FOIA. Joel Arends, chairman of the non-profit group, explained to the Washington Examiner that their FOIA request over the Benghazi affair specifically asked for any personal email accounts Secretary Clinton may have used:“'At this point in time, I think we're the only ones that specifically asked for both her personal and government email and phone logs,' Arends said of his group's Benghazi-related request.â€MSNBC's Lawrence O'Donnell believes that the use of a personal emails server appears to be a preemptive move, specifically designed to circumvent FOIA:“'Hillary Clinton’s system was designed to defy Freedom of Information Act requests, which is designed to defy the law.'â€[mga_video id=8oBEhNirSSg]These are just three of the potential violations that Clinton may have committed by using a personal email account to conduct official State business. More information will be provided as this story continues to develop.

"intent". NO WHERE in any of the laws pertaining to the handling of Classified material uses the word "intent"

If YOU are going to base your claims on it, YOU provide it.

Setting up a PRIVATE server to handle all her government business did NOT JUST HAPPEN BY ACCIDENT . Her "intent" was to set up the server for ALL her government relate business.

"Why do you believe she was not charged " and prosecuted by the head of the FBI,"

First, Comey goes say back to the Whitewater scandal and has a record of being involved in clinton "investigation and NOTHING is done.

Second, the FBI does NOT prosecute.


You asked, you GOT IT!
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Old 07-31-2018, 04:43 AM
 
59,059 posts, read 27,306,837 times
Reputation: 14285
Quote:
Originally Posted by cuebald View Post
You need to send Hillary a box of chocolates or something. If she didn't exist, you wouldn't be able to post about Trump at all.

But, since you brought up the subject, What laws did she violate? Private server? Sending classified emails unsecured? What?

What evidence was produced and presented that she committed a crime, and did so with criminal intent? Why do you believe she was not charged and prosecuted by the head of the FBI, who was also the one who jerked the rug out from under her by announcing the reopening of the investigation eleven days before the election? Educate us.

"What evidence was produced and presented that she committed a crime, and did so with criminal intent? Why do you believe she was not charged and prosecuted by the head of the FBI,"


Sometimes we have to repeat ourselves a MILLION times and some of you STILL ignore it and repeat the same old questions.


May if you pulled ypu eyes away from the alphabet "news" you WOULD no.



Why did you ask these questions? I thought all you libs were super educated and super smart n no EVERYTHING.


I'll answer your silly questions just to prove how ignorant some on the left are.


"What evidence was produced and presented that she committed a crime,"




"https://asweetdoseofreality.com/2016...lary-off-hook/
Quote:
Gowdy: Good morning, Director Comey. Secretary Clinton said she never sent or received any classified information over her private e-mail, was that true?
Comey: Our investigation found that there was classified information sent.
Gowdy: It was not true?
Comey: That’s what I said.
Gowdy: OK. Well, I’m looking for a shorter answer so you and I are not here quite as long. Secretary Clinton said there was nothing marked classified on her e-mails sent or received. Was that true?
Comey: That’s not true
. There were a small number of portion markings on I think three of the documents.
Gowdy: Secretary Clinton said “I did not e-mail any classified information to anyone on my e-mail there was no classified material.†That is true?
Comey: There was classified information emailed
.
Gowdy: Secretary Clinton used one device, was that true?
Comey: She used multiple devices during the four years of her term as Secretary of State.
Gowdy: Secretary Clinton said all work related emails were returned to the State Department. Was that true?
Comey: No. We found work related email, thousands, that were not returned.

Gowdy: Secretary Clinton said neither she or anyone else deleted work related emails from her personal account.
Comey: That’s a harder one to answer. We found traces of work related emails in — on devices or in space. Whether they were deleted or when a server was changed out something happened to them, there’s no doubt that the work related emails that were removed electronically from the email system.
Gowdy: Secretary Clinton said her lawyers read every one of the emails and were overly inclusive. Did her lawyers read the email content individually?
Comey: No.
What evidence was produced and presented that she committed a crime,"



HAVING CLASSIFIED MATERIAL on a private server is AGAINST THE LAW.


"intent". NO WHERE in any of the laws pertaining to the handling of Classified material uses the word "intent"


If YOU are going to base your claims on it, YOU provide it.


Setting up a PRIVATE server to handle all her government business did NOT JUST HAPPEN BY ACCIDENT . Her "intent" was to set up the server for ALL her government relate business.


"Why do you believe she was not charged " and prosecuted by the head of the FBI,"


First, Comey goes say back to the Whitewater scandal and has a record of being involved in clinton "investigation and NOTHING is done.



Second, the FBI does NOT prosecute.
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Old 07-31-2018, 04:49 AM
 
8,312 posts, read 3,927,691 times
Reputation: 10651
Quote:
Originally Posted by cuebald View Post
The title here has been a question I have seen asked repeatedly in the last year and a half, with much discussion following, fueled by opinion and limited citation. Most of us posting here are not attorneys. An attorney friend of mine compiled this list of the federal statutes which may be part of the answer.

Note: This is not posted as an accusation of anyone of doing anything. This is merely a list of laws that are possibly under consideration in the investigation. You are entitled to your own opinions, but none of us will know until the findings are handed down whether there are any infractions or not.


18 USC 208---Acts affecting a personal financial interest
^^^^^penalty, 18 USC 216
18 USC 211---Acceptance or solicitation to obtain public office
18 USC 219—Officers and employees acting as agents of foreign principals
18 USC 225--- Continuing Financial crimes enterprise
18 USC 227--- Wrongfully influencing a private entity’s employment decisions by a Member of Congress or an officer or employee of the legislative or executive branch
18 USC 242--- Deprivation of rights under color of law
18 USC 249--- Hate crime acts
18 USC 371--- Conspiracy to commit offense or fraud to United States
18 USC 373--- Solicitation to commit a crime of violence
18 USC 599--- Promise of appointment by candidate
18 USC 600--- Promise of employment or other appointment for political activity
18 USC 793--- Gathering, transmitting or losing defense information
18 USC 794--- Gathering or delivering defense information to aid foreign government
18 USC 798---Disclosure of classified information
18 USC 911--- False representation of a US citizen
18 USC 951--- Agents of foreign governments
18 USC 954--- False statements influencing foreign government
18 USC 982--- Civil Forfeiture (IGG)
18 USC 983--- Criminal forfeiture
18 USC 1001-- Statements or entries generally (false)
18 USC 1031--- Major Fraud against the United States
18 USC 1038--- False information and hoaxes
18 USC 1343--- Fraud by wire, radio, or television
18 USC 1349--- Attempt or conspiracy (of 1343)
18 USC 1385--- Use of Army and Air Force for posse comitatus
18 USC 1423--- Misuse of evidence of citizenship or naturalization
18 USC 1424--- Personation or misuse of papers in naturalization proceedings
18 USC 1425--- Procurement of citizenship or naturalization unlawfully (1423-1425, Melania illegally a US citizen)
18 USC 1505--- Obstruction of proceedings before departments, agencies and committees
18 USC 1510--- Obstruction of criminal investigations
18 USC 1513--- Retaliating against witness, victim or an informant
18 USC 1521--- Retaliating against a Federal judge or Federal law enforcement officer by false claim or slander of title
18 USC 1546--- Fraud and misuse of visas, permits and other documents (again, Melania)
18 USC 1621--- Perjury generally
18 USC 1622--- Subornation of perjury
18 USC 1623--- False declarations before grand jury or court
18 USC 1952--- Interstate or foreign travel or transportation in aid of racketeering enterprises
18 USC 1956--- Laundering of monetary instruments
18 USC 1957--- Engaging in monetary transactions in property derived from specified unlawful activity
18 USC 1962--- RICO violations (prohibited activities)
18 USC 2243--- sexual abuse of a minor or ward
18 USC 2383--- Rebellion or insurrection
18 USC 2384--- Sedition
18 USC 2385--- Advocating overthrow of government
18 USC 2701--- Unlawful access to stored communications
Thanks a LOT!!! It is refreshing to see someone actually engaging their brain, and to get some input from someone that actually knows the law. We all have opinions but at the end of the day we are a nation of laws, and we must abide by them. As you point out it remains to be seen whether there is sufficient evidence to bring charges against Trump. Lots of debate about whether this is even possible to bring Federal charges for a sitting President; that is undetermined at this point. New territory for our fine nation.

Normal course of events would be to bring impeachment proceedings first - but actually that's a worse outcome for Trump, since impeachment does not have the same rules and restrictions as a criminal proceeding. It would be far better for Trump to have criminal charges brought against him than an impeachment; he could delay/appeal that until Hell freezes over, given his billions in assets and super-citizen status. Anyone remember the "this glove doesn't fit" defense?

Last edited by GearHeadDave; 07-31-2018 at 05:11 AM..
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Old 07-31-2018, 05:08 AM
 
51,653 posts, read 25,819,464 times
Reputation: 37889
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nell Plotts View Post
I think Giuliani is telegraphing what Trump has done. His offense is an attempt at defence. Why would he bother to mention the meetings with the Russians if there wasn't something there?
Giuliani's mission is to get out ahead of changing stories.

Trump claimed he had nothing to do with hush money to Stormy Daniels until it became obvious that Cohen was no longer willing to take a bullet for him. Then Giuliani broke the bad news, but claimed there was nothing criminal about paying hush money right before an election.


https://twitter.com/TheOnion/status/1024030741917851648
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Old 07-31-2018, 05:11 AM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
37,186 posts, read 19,200,869 times
Reputation: 14902
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quick Enough View Post



Second, the FBI does NOT prosecute.
The FBI does, however, refer cases to prosecutors. Comey reopened the email investigation eleven days before the election, then decided there should be no prosecution. I wonder why?


BTW - It was going on before Hillary, and it's going on under Trump. Should we also prosecute the GOP Admin for violating the same laws?

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...server/541017/

https://www.vox.com/2017/10/3/163841...kushner-bannon

Six Trump officials used personal email accounts for White House business: report | TheHill

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...candal-201774/

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...illary-clinton
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