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Old 09-06-2018, 07:09 AM
 
13,949 posts, read 5,621,810 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chad3 View Post
Which society is evil, a. or b. ?

a.) A society that equally shares all resources.

b.) A society that allows a few people to own the majority of the resources, while many people live in poverty and don't receive medical care.
which society is evil, (a) or (b):

(a) everyone is free is to form voluntary associations, to voluntarily trade the fruits of their labor with others under mutually agreeable terms, property rights exist and are protected, and nobody is forced to labor for anyone else?

(b) associations are forced by the state, trade is dictated by the stats and disregards the interests of both producer and consumer, property belongs to the state and they alone dictate how it will be used/allocated, and everyone is forced to labor according to the state's whims and desires?
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:13 AM
 
13,949 posts, read 5,621,810 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
About 40% of what I make has always gone to the government, but I am not a slave. A slave does not get paid a salary, and not do they get to keep anything they produce.
You and Frederick Douglass would disagree, and the venerable Mr. Douglass would call you what you are (and I am, and so is everyone else): a quasi slave. You have a certain degree of free movement, freedom to seek out different employment, etc...but Master ALWAYS gets a percentage of your labor, and if Master does not, force and violence can and will be used against you until you comply and remember who is Master and who is not.

Every taxpayer is a quasi slave.

All these socialist idiots want to do is increase Master's tithe and the scope/reach of Master's power.
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:27 AM
 
Location: Florida
76,975 posts, read 47,615,131 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Volobjectitarian View Post
You and Frederick Douglass would disagree, and the venerable Mr. Douglass would call you what you are (and I am, and so is everyone else): a quasi slave. You have a certain degree of free movement, freedom to seek out different employment, etc...but Master ALWAYS gets a percentage of your labor, and if Master does not, force and violence can and will be used against you until you comply and remember who is Master and who is not.

Every taxpayer is a quasi slave.

All these socialist idiots want to do is increase Master's tithe and the scope/reach of Master's power.
Well then I guess everyone is a 'quasi slave' unless you live in a cave at the mountains.

I am free though, not a slave. I don't mind paying for the services I get.

Anyone who sees themselves as slaves have a problem with themselves, and will never be happy.
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:31 AM
 
Location: Southern Nevada
6,748 posts, read 3,365,850 times
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In a nutshell, I don't believe anyone's money (or profits) should be controlled by anyone else. If someone takes a business selling widgets on eBay and turns it into Amazon, good for them. It was their ingenuity and hard work that got them there, and they don't owe anybody anything. It's only the lazy and the greedy that think they deserve a piece of that.

I also don't like the idea of big government and having control major industries. There needs to be some regulation, emphasis on "some", but the less government intrusion we have in our lives, the better off we'll be. We can take care of the less fortunate in our society by providing help and opportunity, and that's better than having a nanny state of free "everything" that comes from the efforts of everyone else.
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:34 AM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,561,042 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hapa1 View Post
I want liberal socialism. North Korea is far from that.
Same difference.

All socialists are evil.
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:38 AM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,561,042 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chad3 View Post
Which society is evil, a. or b. ?

a.) A society that equally shares all resources.

b.) A society that allows a few people to own the majority of the resources, while many people live in poverty and don't receive medical care.
Both are evil. A is socialism and B is the old feudal system which exists in places like Saudi Arabia.

On the other hand, capitalism, the real free society, is a society that respects the property rights and allows people to own the fruit of their labor.

How is that society in anyway not free?
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:42 AM
 
Location: Florida
76,975 posts, read 47,615,131 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
Both are evil. A is socialism and B is the old feudal system which exists in places like Saudi Arabia.

On the other hand, capitalism, the real free society, is a society that respects the property rights and allows people to own the fruit of their labor.

How is that society in anyway not free?
Capitalism is an economic model, and in itself does not guarantee freedom. You can have a capitalist country which forbids freedom of religion, speech etc. Not sure why you even try to equate capitalism with freedom in general.
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:44 AM
 
Location: Fredericktown,Ohio
7,168 posts, read 5,364,890 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chad3 View Post
In the next 15 years robots could take 38% of our jobs. And the number of jobs taken by robots will keep increasing.
Report finds 38% of US jobs will lost to robots by 2030 | Daily Mail Online

What happens in the future when robots take over 50% of our jobs?

How will the 50% of the population without jobs get housing, transportation, utilities, food, and medical services?
Thanks for the your post I have been waiting for this angle. Of the several writers in the article not one of them mention the race between man power labor and technology. It would seem that this would be a major selling point on why the U S needs to bring about democratic socialism.

You ask a good question, if we continue in our current economic model how will many Americans live with less jobs being available? What will consumer spending look like? it would have to be way lower and keep in mind it is a big driver of GDP. How about home sales and building?

Are we seeing Capitalism eating itself?

That is why I think democratic socialism will catch like wild fire in the future. Average Joe who has worked his whole life and no fault of his own has been replaced with technology. Who is Joe going to support with his vote? one who is touting capitalism that put him in the streets or the democratic socialist? When people get desperate and afraid of the current system who could blame them for looking for another alternative.
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:48 AM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,561,042 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Capitalism is an economic model, and in itself does not guarantee freedom. You can have a capitalist country which forbids freedom of religion, speech etc. Not sure why you even try to equate capitalism with freedom in general.
Name one capitalist country that does that.

How does capitalism even work without the freedom of speech?
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Old 09-06-2018, 08:05 AM
 
Location: Florida
76,975 posts, read 47,615,131 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
Name one capitalist country that does that.

How does capitalism even work without the freedom of speech?
Someone just argued if you pay any tax, you are a slave, so is there even a such thing as a capitalist country?

India is a capitalist country which some pretty restrictive laws. Pakistan can be said to have capitalist economy, and yet not exactly a model of freedom.

The point is that capitalism as an economic model does not give birth to freedom in general. Also, "freedom" is debatable. Many argue the nation is not free if pot and prostitution are not legal. It depends on your definition, but the point is that capitalism is an economic model.
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