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Old 09-19-2018, 07:08 AM
 
Location: Manchester NH
6,235 posts, read 1,731,958 times
Reputation: 2055

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Quote:
Originally Posted by thelogo View Post
Not a popular topic. Had I showed a video about rep said vs dem said, people will immediately jump to defend their side. However, it is bad manner to tell the truth about wars when your country is starting them. Everyone just blind-fully wish there is a greater good in all of this, and ignore the obvious reasons: money & power.

So many influences, industries, business and finances revolve around the military death machine so wars won't ever stop. But it would be good if they just stop pretending and making bogus excuses, and admit that all modern wars are about taking control of countries who refuse to adopt the American/western European economic model.
Yeah, people donít want to handle the truth in this country.

Thatís why nothing will ever change.
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Old 09-19-2018, 07:20 AM
 
5,573 posts, read 2,119,011 times
Reputation: 2901
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gen Douglas MacArthur
The soldier above all others prays for peace, for it is the soldier who must suffer and bear the deepest wounds and scars of war.
Nobody joins the military hoping they'll die.
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Old 09-19-2018, 06:17 PM
 
967 posts, read 173,050 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburban_Guy View Post
One of the more remarkable individuals in regards to this type of thing, was Pat Tillman, the Arizona State and Arizona Cardinals football star.

He gave it all up, all the millions of dollars and fame, and enlisted in the Army not long after 9/11 (as did his brother). He did so in order to fulfill a sense of patriotic duty he felt he owed to America. And not only did he enlist, but he enlisted to try out for probably the most elite light infantry unit in the world, the Army Ranger Battalion, at age 26. Not only did he make it through the brutal selection process to make it to a Ranger Battalion, but he apparently thrived there.

Eventually though, Pat became very disillusioned with the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and felt they were illegal wars and the US were occupiers. In fact Pat planned on meeting with noted anti-war activist Noam Chomsky after his rotation in Afghanistan, and most likely would have become a very prominent anti-war activist (as his brother eventually did). Of course Pat lost his life in Afghanistan, gunned down by his own Ranger teammates (some of whom later were involved in a cover up of what happened, and lied to Pat's brother about what happened). And, of course, the U.S. government totally fabricated a story about Pat's heroism against non existent Taliban fighters which he was posthumously awarded a Silver Star. How ironic the US government would be doing the very things Pat would have spoken out against.

To this day, some try to twist the truth in order to portray Pat as the ideal patriotic war hero. To me, Pat was indeed a true hero. He gave up millions of dollars and the comfort and trappings of fame, in order to enlist in the US Army as an elite Army Ranger, and gave his life for it. And eventually, he would have been a very notable vocal anti-war and anti-imperialist activist in America, the kind of person that would routinely get insulted and mocked on this forum by the pro-war Team America (f**k yeah).

Wow. Is this related to an elite team that died in a helicopter crash after some mission?
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Old 09-19-2018, 06:45 PM
 
Location: Manchester NH
6,235 posts, read 1,731,958 times
Reputation: 2055
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburban_Guy View Post
One of the more remarkable individuals in regards to this type of thing, was Pat Tillman, the Arizona State and Arizona Cardinals football star.

He gave it all up, all the millions of dollars and fame, and enlisted in the Army not long after 9/11 (as did his brother). He did so in order to fulfill a sense of patriotic duty he felt he owed to America. And not only did he enlist, but he enlisted to try out for probably the most elite light infantry unit in the world, the Army Ranger Battalion, at age 26. Not only did he make it through the brutal selection process to make it to a Ranger Battalion, but he apparently thrived there.

Eventually though, Pat became very disillusioned with the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and felt they were illegal wars and the US were occupiers. In fact Pat planned on meeting with noted anti-war activist Noam Chomsky after his rotation in Afghanistan, and most likely would have become a very prominent anti-war activist (as his brother eventually did). Of course Pat lost his life in Afghanistan, gunned down by his own Ranger teammates (some of whom later were involved in a cover up of what happened, and lied to Pat's brother about what happened). And, of course, the U.S. government totally fabricated a story about Pat's heroism against non existent Taliban fighters which he was posthumously awarded a Silver Star. How ironic the US government would be doing the very things Pat would have spoken out against.

To this day, some try to twist the truth in order to portray Pat as the ideal patriotic war hero. To me, Pat was indeed a true hero. He gave up millions of dollars and the comfort and trappings of fame, in order to enlist in the US Army as an elite Army Ranger, and gave his life for it. And eventually, he would have been a very notable vocal anti-war and anti-imperialist activist in America, the kind of person that would routinely get insulted and mocked on this forum by the pro-war Team America (f**k yeah).
Wow, I just read the story and had no idea. This is heartbreaking, if only he's had lived a bit longer.

I'm still not sure though, was the friendly fire purely accidental or was their motive behind it? I read his unit burned his journal and uniform to cover their tracks.
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Old 09-19-2018, 06:59 PM
 
Location: Clown School
9,999 posts, read 4,220,822 times
Reputation: 11552
Quote:
Originally Posted by phma View Post
That sounds like reason enough to me.
We need to stay in practice for when a good war comes along.
You mean one that may very well be caused by going around killing people, antagonizing other nations, and causing chaos around the world?
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Old 09-20-2018, 09:29 PM
 
Location: Upstate NY
30,402 posts, read 9,086,867 times
Reputation: 28945
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohhwanderlust View Post
You mean one that may very well be caused by going around killing people, antagonizing other nations, and causing chaos around the world?


John Kerry, is that you?

Yes, there have always been and will always be those who proclaim to be "veterans against war."
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Old 09-20-2018, 09:45 PM
 
Location: Upstate NY
30,402 posts, read 9,086,867 times
Reputation: 28945
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburban_Guy View Post
One of the more remarkable individuals in regards to this type of thing, was Pat Tillman, the Arizona State and Arizona Cardinals football star.

He gave it all up, all the millions of dollars and fame, and enlisted in the Army not long after 9/11 (as did his brother). He did so in order to fulfill a sense of patriotic duty he felt he owed to America. And not only did he enlist, but he enlisted to try out for probably the most elite light infantry unit in the world, the Army Ranger Battalion, at age 26. Not only did he make it through the brutal selection process to make it to a Ranger Battalion, but he apparently thrived there.

Eventually though, Pat became very disillusioned with the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and felt they were illegal wars and the US were occupiers. In fact Pat planned on meeting with noted anti-war activist Noam Chomsky after his rotation in Afghanistan, and most likely would have become a very prominent anti-war activist (as his brother eventually did). Of course Pat lost his life in Afghanistan, gunned down by his own Ranger teammates (some of whom later were involved in a cover up of what happened, and lied to Pat's brother about what happened). And, of course, the U.S. government totally fabricated a story about Pat's heroism against non existent Taliban fighters which he was posthumously awarded a Silver Star. How ironic the US government would be doing the very things Pat would have spoken out against.

To this day, some try to twist the truth in order to portray Pat as the ideal patriotic war hero. To me, Pat was indeed a true hero. He gave up millions of dollars and the comfort and trappings of fame, in order to enlist in the US Army as an elite Army Ranger, and gave his life for it. And eventually, he would have been a very notable vocal anti-war and anti-imperialist activist in America, the kind of person that would routinely get insulted and mocked on this forum by the pro-war Team America (f**k yeah).



And, if true, that would be the only kind of veteran who wouldn't get insulted and mocked on this forum by the usual suspects in the America-is-always-wrong crowd.
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Old 09-20-2018, 10:01 PM
 
Location: Somewhere below Mason/Dixon
5,841 posts, read 6,919,012 times
Reputation: 10137
This thread is full of naive delusional liberals. Do you people think anyone likes war? No one wants to see war. War happens because people are greedy, ambitious and hateful. In short human sin causes all war. However believing that somehow we can ignore reality and human nature and just end war is the most naive and foolish belief ever.

Let’s start with what brought about the Afghan and Iraq wars, 9-11. Does anyone really think we should have just let a terrorist army( that is what al qaedia was) just continue to attack us after they killed 3000 civilians in our own streets? Afghanistan was absolutely necessary and Iraq was at the very least a very threatening nation to the US. Osama Bin Laden causes those two wars. We were obligated to answer the threat and protect our nation in response to 9-11.

Who thinks Hitler would have stopped killing Jews, stopped invading his neighbors if the allies decided they loved peace more than justice? In a world where the good guys don’t believe in war the bullies will just take over. WW2 was absolutely necessary as horrifying as it was.

The only way to stop evil people is with brute force. Any of the hippies in this thread who can demonstrate another way we could have persuaded Hitler to be nice or persuade the likes of Bin Laden or Saddam to quit killing people can speak up now.

The best method for preventing war is by projecting strength. When the good guys have overwhelming strength the bad guys back down. If you want to bring about war then go ahead and project weakness by begging for peace. There is no quicker way to encourage the wolf. Just ask Neville Chamberlain.
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Old 09-21-2018, 10:02 AM
 
4,036 posts, read 1,835,475 times
Reputation: 3221
http://treehouseletter.com/2015/01/3...erican-sniper/
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Old 09-21-2018, 10:46 AM
 
157 posts, read 63,258 times
Reputation: 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburban_Guy View Post
One of the more remarkable individuals in regards to this type of thing, was Pat Tillman, the Arizona State and Arizona Cardinals football star.

He gave it all up, all the millions of dollars and fame, and enlisted in the Army not long after 9/11 (as did his brother). He did so in order to fulfill a sense of patriotic duty he felt he owed to America. And not only did he enlist, but he enlisted to try out for probably the most elite light infantry unit in the world, the Army Ranger Battalion, at age 26. Not only did he make it through the brutal selection process to make it to a Ranger Battalion, but he apparently thrived there.

Eventually though, Pat became very disillusioned with the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and felt they were illegal wars and the US were occupiers. In fact Pat planned on meeting with noted anti-war activist Noam Chomsky after his rotation in Afghanistan, and most likely would have become a very prominent anti-war activist (as his brother eventually did). Of course Pat lost his life in Afghanistan, gunned down by his own Ranger teammates (some of whom later were involved in a cover up of what happened, and lied to Pat's brother about what happened). And, of course, the U.S. government totally fabricated a story about Pat's heroism against non existent Taliban fighters which he was posthumously awarded a Silver Star. How ironic the US government would be doing the very things Pat would have spoken out against.

To this day, some try to twist the truth in order to portray Pat as the ideal patriotic war hero. To me, Pat was indeed a true hero. He gave up millions of dollars and the comfort and trappings of fame, in order to enlist in the US Army as an elite Army Ranger, and gave his life for it. And eventually, he would have been a very notable vocal anti-war and anti-imperialist activist in America, the kind of person that would routinely get insulted and mocked on this forum by the pro-war Team America (f**k yeah).

I've listened to his parents in interviews and they went from very patriotic to total contempt, vitriol, and outright hatred of the US government.

And I don't need to hear from anyone's grand dad here.

Two time Medal of Honor winner and the most decorated US Marine in this country's history said and wrote a book " War is a Racket "

He also said : There are only two things we should fight for. One is the defense of our homes and the other is the Bill of Rights.


Enough said.

https://youtu.be/F3_EXqJ8f-0

Last edited by KathyKay44; 09-21-2018 at 10:48 AM.. Reason: Forgot something
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