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Old 09-20-2018, 07:37 PM
 
11,989 posts, read 5,271,831 times
Reputation: 7284

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Bloomberg has gotten details on an internal poll conducted for the Republican National Committee that stated:

Quote:
“Voters are evenly divided on the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act,” the RNC-commissioned report said. “But, we’ve lost the messaging battle on the issue.”
Voters stated by 2-1 that the tax cuts benefited the rich over the middle class.
Republicans polled said that the tax cuts favored the middle class over the rich by 38%, but Independent voters were -36% and Democrats far more negative than Independents.

Quote:
Overall by a 2-1 margin -- 61 percent to 30 percent -- respondents said the law benefits “large corporations and rich Americans” over “middle class families,” according to the survey, which was completed on Sept. 2 by the GOP firm Public Opinion Strategies and obtained by Bloomberg News.
Mitch McConnell after the passage of the tax cuts:

Quote:
“If we can’t sell this to the American people, we ought to go into another line of work,” Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell said in December, after his chamber approved the legislation.
LOL

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...le-on-tax-cuts

Last edited by Bureaucat; 09-20-2018 at 07:50 PM..
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Old 09-20-2018, 07:44 PM
 
Location: Del Rio, TN
39,810 posts, read 26,408,051 times
Reputation: 25705
In McConnell's case, he's right. Of course he and the RNC has a tough time countering a news media that lies nonstop and has refused to tell the facts about the middle class cuts since before they were even voted on. They refuse to mention that the only reason the individual tax cuts have an expiration is that not ONE Democratic senator cared enough about the American working man and women to vote for making them permanent.

I'm not sure how you counter that. Perhaps by defining biased coverage on a network as a campaign contribution to the appropriate political party.

I'm a middle class taxpayer, our combined income is approximately $100k, far below many on this board. I'm enjoying my 21% cut in income tax.
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Old 09-20-2018, 07:48 PM
 
16,376 posts, read 22,431,011 times
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Wait until Feb - April 2019 when people do their tax returns and learn they didn't get the tax cut they thought. The feds gave employers wrong withholding calculations which resulted in too little fed taxes taken out on paychecks for 2018.

30 million people will either get a smaller deduction next spring or they'll have to pay.

30 million could owe IRS after withholding error

New tax withholding tables for employers were put together by the government early this year. About 30 million workers received pay that was "under-withheld" — making their paychecks bigger this year but bringing a larger bill at tax time next spring, according to the Government Accountability Office's report.
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Old 09-20-2018, 07:49 PM
 
13,900 posts, read 9,751,574 times
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So you’re saying massive tax cuts for the rich and largest corporations isn’t a political winner?
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Old 09-20-2018, 08:01 PM
 
Location: Del Rio, TN
39,810 posts, read 26,408,051 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winter_Sucks View Post
So you’re saying massive tax cuts for the rich and largest corporations isn’t a political winner?
I think he's saying that there are people dumb enough to believe that the tax cuts favored the rich instead of the middle class. And most people are too lazy, and not smart enough to actually research it.
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Old 09-20-2018, 08:10 PM
 
14,221 posts, read 6,934,521 times
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Quick, how can we spin massive tax breaks for Donald Trump and his cronies and a huge increase in gifts to the military industrial complex into something positive!

The fact that its paid for by slashing support for the disabled and increasing the debt is definitely not a winner!
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Old 09-20-2018, 08:15 PM
 
13,900 posts, read 9,751,574 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toyman at Jewel Lake View Post
I think he's saying that there are people dumb enough to believe that the tax cuts favored the rich instead of the middle class. And most people are too lazy, and not smart enough to actually research it.
So the Republican midterm message is voters are lazy and dumb? That should stop the blue wave.


Hahahahahahah
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Old 09-20-2018, 08:25 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
25,591 posts, read 56,367,459 times
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Tax cuts were irresponsible, are ballooning the deficits and debt, and will cause another financial calamity.

From a big cheerleader for the market this year - he's been a big pusher of how great things are SHORT-TERM:

https://www.cnbc.com/video/2018/09/2...0money%20dwyer

Eventually, he says, this won't end well - you can't fix a debt problem with more debt.

Of course, the GOP will then be looking for a way to cut programs - not raise taxes.
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Old 09-20-2018, 10:14 PM
 
Location: Laurentia
5,580 posts, read 7,981,200 times
Reputation: 2442
The debt is caused by spending, not tax cuts. If they didn't spend more than they took in it wouldn't matter how much taxes were cut - as it is the spending will be paid for by future taxes, inflation, or the consequences of government default. Spending is the tax, not the tax the IRS collects, and Congress just so happened to increase spending by massive amounts this year, in case you forgot. Deficits were also projected to expand because entitlement spending was set to increase automatically even without the latest spending orgy this fiscal year. This is a recipe for a horror show and it's all caused by Congress being all too willing to spend other people's hard-earned money on the collection of their pet pieces of garbage masquerading as an effective government.

Consider that Harding and Coolidge in the 1920s cut taxes far more massively than our Republicans leadership has ever dared to contemplate and the debt as a percentage of GDP was paid down at the fastest rate in American history during their two administrations. The reason? Very large cuts in federal spending, that's the reason.


Oh, and there has been an acceleration in the economy* and in federal revenues under Trump that actually has helped to reduce the deficit considerably - federal revenues are actually at or near record levels last I checked. It's just that the spending increases have swamped this effect many times over, hence the expanding deficit and debt. Default of some sort is inevitable if Congress and Trump don't embrace smaller government.


*This is entirely due to the severely slowed pace of new regulations under Trump, not any tax cuts. Regulation has a far larger effect on economic growth than taxes do; lightly-regulated high-tax countries do much better than heavily-regulated low-tax countries do. Nordic countries embrace the former approach, hence why it took taxes rising to 60% of GDP for Sweden's economy to implode in the 1980s and 90s (before government was shrunk considerably, albeit still at a size where significant problems were still being caused), whereas France and the Mediterranean countries have seen their economies implode under much lower tax rates. Levels of economic freedom are higher in the Nordics than in southern Europe even with the tax rates factored in; leaving tax out of the picture, the difference in economic freedom is stark. A freer economy can simply keep going under much higher tax levels than a repressed economy can. The American economy is currently much less free than the Nordics once taxation is factored out, so the U.S. economy will go into crisis at tax rates much lower than 1980s Sweden did.
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Old 09-20-2018, 11:04 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
25,591 posts, read 56,367,459 times
Reputation: 23297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patricius Maximus View Post
The debt is caused by spending, not tax cuts. If they didn't spend more than they took in it wouldn't matter how much taxes were cut - as it is the spending will be paid for by future taxes, inflation, or the consequences of government default.

Oh, and there has been an acceleration in the economy* and in federal revenues under Trump that actually has helped to reduce the deficit considerably - federal revenues are actually at or near record levels last I checked. It's just that the spending increases have swamped this effect many times over, hence the expanding deficit and bt. Default of some sort is inevitable if Congress and Trump don't embrace smaller government.


*This is entirely due to the severely slowed pace of new regulations under Trump, not any tax cuts. Regulation has a far larger effect on economic growth than taxes do; lightly-regulated high-tax countries do much better than heavily-regulated low-tax countries do. Nordic countries embrace the former approach, hence why it took taxes rising to 60% of GDP for Sweden's economy to implode in the 1980s and 90s (before government was shrunk considerably, albeit still at a size where significant problems were still being caused), whereas France and the Mediterranean countries have seen their economies implode under much lower tax rates. Levels of economic freedom are higher in the Nordics than in southern Europe even with the tax rates factored in; leaving tax out of the picture, the difference in economic freedom is stark. A freer economy can simply keep going under much higher tax levels than a repressed economy can. The American economy is currently much less free than the Nordics once taxation is factored out, so the U.S. economy will go into crisis at tax rates much lower than 1980s Sweden did.
Triple and quadruple Horsehockey.

Tax cuts should not have take place UNTIL spending was cut.

REDUCING revenues and INCREASING spending at the same time is a recipe for disaster.

If Congress couldn't get spending in line with revenues, then it had no business reducing taxes.


The tax bill should NEVER have happened.

You can't fix debt by adding more debt which is exactly what Congress has done.

This mantra of reducing taxes and adding debt is total BS - and will lead to a calamity - probably beginning next year.

The GOP just never learns - it has only ONE playbook - steal money via borrowed tax cuts from the Treasury to give to people who don't need it, further enhance wealth disparity, build up debt, remove regulation so the crooks can take over, resulting in financial collapse - and, of course, war.

Last edited by Ariadne22; 09-20-2018 at 11:12 PM..
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