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Old 10-28-2018, 04:19 PM
 
45,676 posts, read 23,837,966 times
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It wasn't the right time to try and suggest the synagogue didn't do what it could to protect its members. It just wasn't the right time.

And we don't know -- an armed guard may have been shot first and then the same outcome.

Nobody knows. It is inappropriate at such a time when folks are grieving so painfully that someone suggests something like this.
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Old 10-28-2018, 04:20 PM
 
Location: PSL
8,224 posts, read 3,463,369 times
Reputation: 2963
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe the Photog View Post
Yes, a security guard with a Glock would have definitely no question about it stopped the madman yesterday with his AR-15 and three other guns.

SMH
Why not?

Difference between 9mm and .223/5.56 is quite significant.

Here. Bottom to top.
22lr, 5.56/2.23 9mm 45


That Glock will punch a bigger hole, and depending on projectile, do far worse damage than ball .223/5.56
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Old 10-28-2018, 04:22 PM
 
Location: PSL
8,224 posts, read 3,463,369 times
Reputation: 2963
Quote:
Originally Posted by moneill View Post
It wasn't the right time to try and suggest the synagogue didn't do what it could to protect its members. It just wasn't the right time.

And we don't know -- an armed guard may have been shot first and then the same outcome.

Nobody knows. It is inappropriate at such a time when folks are grieving so painfully that someone suggests something like this.
We know what happens without one present though don't we.
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Old 10-28-2018, 04:23 PM
 
Location: PSL
8,224 posts, read 3,463,369 times
Reputation: 2963
Quote:
Originally Posted by thefragile View Post
trump, along with his mindless supporters, blame the victims. Or at the very least, do not 100% put the blame on the perpetrator. Par for the course with the deplorables.
That isn't showing your work.

Try again this time actually prove your point rather than regurgitating a leftist talking point devoid of supporting fact.
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Old 10-28-2018, 04:28 PM
 
Location: Ft. Myers
19,719 posts, read 16,713,555 times
Reputation: 41861
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboteer View Post
President Trump remarked recently that when another Jew-hating slimeball killed 11 in a synagogue in Pittsburgh, there would likely have been fewer (or no) casualties if the synagogue had had armed guards.

Recent history from 1999 bears out what he said, despite screeches from the usual leftists. A demented man drove to one Jewish institution after another, looking for Jews to murder. At the first three, he found the places had armed guards, so he didn't stop, but drove away without harming anyone. Then he finally came to one that did not have armed guards. He stopped, got out, walked in, and shot five people.

How many of those people in Pittsburgh would be alive today if there had been guards?

Yes, it's sad that we seem to need armed guards in some places to safeguard our families, friends etc.

Does anybody have a better idea? One that works as well as this one did in Los Angeles in 1999?

------------------------------------------------------

From Wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Los_An...enter_shooting

Los Angeles Jewish Community Center shooting

The 1999 Los Angeles Jewish Community Center shooting occurred on August 10, 1999, at around 10:50 a.m. PT, when white supremacist Buford O. Furrow, Jr. walked into the lobby of the North Valley Jewish Community Center in Granada Hills and opened fire with a semi-automatic weapon, firing 70 shots into the complex. The gunfire wounded five people: three children, a teenage counselor, and an office worker. Shortly thereafter, Furrow murdered a mail carrier, fled the state, and finally surrendered to authorities.
(snip)
On August 7, Furrow bought a used red Chevrolet van in Tacoma, Washington and loaded it with five rifles, two pistols, 6,000 rounds of ammunition and a flak jacket. Furrow considered attacking three Jewish institutions: the Skirball Cultural Center, the American Jewish University and the Simon Wiesenthal Center's Museum of Tolerance, but security measures presented too much of a problem.

Ok, so let's play a little game. Let's appoint Roboteer head of "The commission to prevent future shootings at public places in America." So, now you have the full authority to do whatever is needed, what do you do ?

Do you put an armed guard in every church, school, daycare, movie theater, grocery store, drug store, post office, and company in the country ? How do you decide what targets need 24/7 protection and which do not ?

My point is, it is damn easy to sit back and play Monday Morning Quarterback when these things happen, but you could put a cop in every place you think you should protect, and some lunatic with a gun would still find a way to get in and do what he wants to do. And, if they can't use a gun, they drive a car or truck into a crowd and do it that way.

Bottom line, you can not be everywhere, all the time, America isn't an armed encampment. We are free to roam around, shop, worship, and go everywhere, and we simply can not protect everyone all the time.
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Old 10-28-2018, 04:30 PM
 
Location: Florida
23,795 posts, read 13,164,905 times
Reputation: 19952
Quote:
Originally Posted by MMS02760 View Post
What a sick world we live in when some people think the solution to all this violence is to station armed guards at every public meeting space.
I agree. It is amazing that people are casually discussing that everyone in the country should be armed, like we live in some warped version of Road Warrior.

Many suggested that teachers be armed to stop school shootings.

Why isn't anyone suggesting that priests, rabbis, ministers, reverends, pastors, deacons and the choirs be armed? Is it because the idea of religion, prayer and churches are the antithesis of gun violence? It is as absurd as the idea a pope should carry a gun.

Some Americans' answers to everything is more guns. There is something sick and violent in our culture and society and more guns will not solve the problem.

Honestly, I'd rather move, and probably will, to another country where I can move about public places and wander freely without worrying about being shot by either bad guys with guns or misguided vigilantes. We are in a prison of our own making and guns are a massive contribution to the problem--not the solution.
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Old 10-28-2018, 04:36 PM
 
18,073 posts, read 18,697,364 times
Reputation: 25191
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY_refugee87 View Post
Why not?

Difference between 9mm and .223/5.56 is quite significant.

Here. Bottom to top.
22lr, 5.56/2.23 9mm 45


That Glock will punch a bigger hole, and depending on projectile, do far worse damage than ball .223/5.56
Lol, that 223 has more, way more energy than the 9 even dreamed of having, and will slice right through anything short of a lvl 4 vest.

The pistol round uses hydra shock to provide a more lethal strike, but still will not catch up to the energy the 223 puts out.
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Old 10-28-2018, 04:42 PM
 
Location: Denver
9,963 posts, read 18,436,336 times
Reputation: 6181
Quote:
Originally Posted by MMS02760 View Post
What a sick world we live in when some people think the solution to all this violence is to station armed guards at every public meeting space.
Even more sick that our gov will do absolutely nothing to make this country safer.
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Old 10-28-2018, 04:43 PM
 
18,073 posts, read 18,697,364 times
Reputation: 25191
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach50 View Post
Even more sick that our gov will do absolutely nothing to make this country safer.
What you want them to do? Be specific.
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Old 10-28-2018, 04:48 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
36,970 posts, read 40,955,833 times
Reputation: 44900
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight View Post
I don't see any other source to confirm that he rejected the other sites because of armed guards other than Wikipedia.


I don't see any support for armed guards at churches or synagogues or any place of worship and this story even if true doesn't make the case.
There are articles that describe his scouting other locations. The Wiesenthal Center was concerned enough about his behavior there that security was called.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/...147-story.html

"Part of the answer might be found at the Simon Wiesenthal Center's Museum of Tolerance in Los Angeles. A docent at the museum has identified Furrow as the paying visitor she saw two weeks ago whose suspicious behavior prompted staff to call security, said Rabbi Marvin Hier, the facility's director.

'He came to the museum, part of a group, for a 2 1/2-hour visit in the principal installation area and he stayed for 20 minutes,' Hier said, quoting the docent. The man 'never looked at a single exhibit, looked only at the ceilings wherever we went and after 20 minutes left the group.'"

This article says that Furrow himself told authorities about the scouting mission and found security to be too tight at the places he rejected.

https://newspaperarchive.com/wilson-...g-13-1999-p-4/

Church shootings where armed response was a factor:

https://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/12/u...ted=print&_r=0

In this one no shots were fired and no one was injured:

https://www.goupstate.com/news/20120...points-shotgun
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