Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Status:
"“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”"
(set 1 day ago)
Location: Great Britain
27,163 posts, read 13,455,286 times
Reputation: 19459
Advertisements
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa
The things the two articles that are the OP's of these threads and three quoted posts have in common are a total lack of self-control, and total lack of any semblance planning. Call me heartless but why should people who work hard for a living, sometimes two jobs, should be payment for this?
The state has a duty of care for children and minors in most of the civilised world. That's why.
Best argument in favor of abortion I've ever heard.
First trimester abortions should be encouraged, subsidized and common.
I disagree with this, as I am definitely more in favor of contraception before conception instead of killing a fetus afterward (although I am not vehemently opposed to abortion except for most cases after about the 22nd week of pregnancy).
However, I do think that if a woman has at least one minor child and needs government assistance to survive, regular Depo shots (or proof of infertility due to voluntary sterilization, age, or some other medical condition) should be required. (The reason I said that it should be up to the woman is because temporary birth control is much easier and more reliable for a woman than it is for a man.)
I disagree with this, as I am definitely more in favor of contraception before conception instead of killing a fetus afterward (although I am not vehemently opposed to abortion except for most cases after about the 22nd week of pregnancy).
However, I do think that if a woman has at least one minor child and needs government assistance to survive, regular Depo shots (or proof of infertility due to voluntary sterilization, age, or some other medical condition) should be required. (The reason I said that it should be up to the woman is because temporary birth control is much easier and more reliable for a woman than it is for a man.)
I agree about contraception. It should be given away like candy. It should be dropped on impoverished neighborhoods out of helicopters. There should be containers full of pills and condoms at every entrance and exit to our high schools. Our students should all be given free bananas at lunch to practice their condom using skills with. But if they get knocked up and cannot afford to take care of the whelp without taxpayer help, they should be encouraged to have abortions and offered taxpayer subsidized abortions. And as you say if they decide to have the kid anyway they should be required to be on some form of medium term birth control or be sterilized before being eligible for subsidies.
Of course if we do all that we also have to close our borders or it will all be for naught. Every child our children do not have will be made up for by an anchor baby or a third world illegal or refugee. That would make us worse off not better. Maybe we can send some of those helicopters full of birth control in to Mexico and the rest of latin America.
Will note again that this family was put into a desperate situation after Super Storm Sandy....
Interesting that you all are ignoring the obvious.
I'll also note that you all don't know if they were using birth control or not. I am married and got an IUD after the birth of my 2nd child. I got pregnant with an IUD when she was 9 months old!
Birth control is not 100% effective and it is silly for people to believe that married couples aren't going to have sex.
The article also said the mother had a steady job prior to becoming pregnant. She had complications associated with her pregnancy (note this is the main reason why I support a woman's right to chose weather or not to get an abortion and/or carry a pregnancy to term). Someone earlier in the thread mentioned adoption is not always an option because of the burden of the pregnancy on the mother - this is true. This woman had a complication that is the primary cause of death for black pregnant women and for women in general - pre-eclampsia. It HEAVILY impacts black women and she was right to quit working and rest as best as she could during that pregnancy for her own health and the welfare of her family. Her husband, 14 year old and 4 year old need her.
You all really are looking over the fact that life happens. Often pregnancies cause women to drop out of the workforce. Hurricanes happen and make people lose all their belongings and the places of residence. The article stated that where they lived prior to Sandy was destroyed and they could not return home and they have been in a precarious predicament since then. Birth control does not work 100%. She had a right to chose to give birth based on her own convictions as an individual, along with the input of her husband. It was best for her to quit her job to stay healthy during the pregnancy for her unborn child and her living children/husband.
They seem like hardworking people and I do think they'll come out of the situation they are in. Sad that so many of you are overly judgmental.
At least the family is together. Hope things get better for them in time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC
I see a lot of positives here. There's a devoted husband/father in the picture who's very willing to work, and who is healthy and strong.
I don't see drugs.
I see parents who love their children very much, and extended family that is also healthy and quick to come run to help with the little one when Mom is hospitalized at the end of her pregnancy.
I really enjoyed the feature article. Thanks, OP.
Perspective. I wish them the best.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChicagoMeO
Ok so she did not have an abortion, thats nice. But she and the baby daddy needed to keep their groins locked up until they could sensibly afford a baby. Maybe work and save up for awhile and plan for a baby.
Personally, I think the United States has perverse public policy that encourages single parents. If you're poor, you get nothing. The minute you get pregnant, you qualify for Medicaid. The minute you pop out a kid, you jump to the head of the queue for Section 8 housing. The rest of us got the memo. Get your education. Get your career launched. Then start thinking about a committed long term relationship with someone like-minded. After all that, then start thinking about reproducing. Even following that formula, things can go off the rails in a relationship with children when people land in the safety net. When you're uneducated and poor, you're guaranteed to land in the safety net and the odds are extremely high that your offspring will land there too.
The only way to stop this behavior is to pull the plug on all those incentives. You're single and pregnant? You can have a free abortion or you can choose to have your kid with zero state assistance.
What does single parenthood have to do with this situation?
Will note again that this family was put into a desperate situation after Super Storm Sandy....
Interesting that you all are ignoring the obvious.
I'll also note that you all don't know if they were using birth control or not. I am married and got an IUD after the birth of my 2nd child. I got pregnant with an IUD when she was 9 months old!
Birth control is not 100% effective and it is silly for people to believe that married couples aren't going to have sex.
The article also said the mother had a steady job prior to becoming pregnant. She had complications associated with her pregnancy (note this is the main reason why I support a woman's right to chose weather or not to get an abortion and/or carry a pregnancy to term). Someone earlier in the thread mentioned adoption is not always an option because of the burden of the pregnancy on the mother - this is true. This woman had a complication that is the primary cause of death for black pregnant women and for women in general - pre-eclampsia. It HEAVILY impacts black women and she was right to quit working and rest as best as she could during that pregnancy for her own health and the welfare of her family. Her husband, 14 year old and 4 year old need her.
You all really are looking over the fact that life happens. Often pregnancies cause women to drop out of the workforce. Hurricanes happen and make people lose all their belongings and the places of residence. The article stated that where they lived prior to Sandy was destroyed and they could not return home and they have been in a precarious predicament since then. Birth control does not work 100%. She had a right to chose to give birth based on her own convictions as an individual, along with the input of her husband. It was best for her to quit her job to stay healthy during the pregnancy for her unborn child and her living children/husband.
They seem like hardworking people and I do think they'll come out of the situation they are in. Sad that so many of you are overly judgmental.
What does single parenthood have to do with this situation?
I consider the example given in the OP to be a launching point for a larger discussion. Talking about just one individual case is not that interesting in my opinion.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
