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Why do you dismiss modelling since that is what they use in preparation for space missions. Didn't they just use a model for the Jupiter and Mars missions, yet some reject the models and predictions here on the planet earth. Evidence although not perfect is certainly not lacking when it comes to data. What would a scientist use for a prediction other than modeling, a rear view mirror.
Modeling and predictions that can fail are not needed to make a valid argument so why are so many insisting on using that argument?
By filling their leaders' Swiss bank and tribal warfare accounts? As a taxpayer in a democracy I'd rather my money be spent in other manners.
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Then there will be no solution, expecting 3rd world countries living below the poverty level to take action while the wealthiest nation in the world refuses to assist is a non-starter. There will be more refugees and more destabilization around the world.
So what is the alternative to models and predictions.
I've noted it all through this thread. We have done many things to clean up our messes. People aren't against doing that by and large.
You don't need to tell people the world is going to end unless they start using more efficient appliances. They are available and people buy them.
The market for electric and or hybrid automobiles is constantly growing. It's not because people think the east coast will be under water in a decade if they don't.
Calling people names over predictions that have proven themselves wrong in the past is not how you get people to clean up.
I've noted it all through this thread. We have done many things to clean up our messes. People aren't against doing that by and large.
You don't need to tell people the world is going to end unless they start using more efficient appliances. They are available and people buy them.
The market for electric and or hybrid automobiles is constantly growing. It's not because people think the east coast will be under water in a decade if they don't.
Calling people names over predictions that have proven themselves wrong in the past is not how you get people to clean up.
I’m not calling anyone names just questioning their lack of belief in science. The free market isn’t fixing this a more than the ozone depletion.
I'm a bit confused. All of Colorado has been impacted by climate change - even Limon which is a small town east of Denver. No piñons grow there, however - Limon is just a little too far north and too far out on the plains. In general, piñons can be found from Colorado Springs and on south into New Mexico. They range into SW Colorado and on into Utah at Canyonlands NP, and extend south toward Flagstaff. They are in trouble everywhere, I'm sorry to report.
You said piñon trees all over Colorado were dying, so I asked about the prairie regions.
You said piñon trees all over Colorado were dying, so I asked about the prairie regions.
The dominant species of tree on the prairie is the cottonwood which generally grows along the banks of streams and other places that have a high water table like seeps and springs. The eastern half of Colorado was once shortgrass prairie. The two most dominant grasses in the shortgrass prairie are blue grama (Bouteloua gracilis) and buffalograss (Bouteloua dactyloides). When the sodbusters arrived they devastated the prairie ecosystem and were rewarded with the dust bowl for their efforts. As you probably know, temperatures on the American plains were abnormally high in the 30's and helped create a situation where the now bare topsoil blew away in the wind and actually ended up being deposited on the East Coast in cities like DC and NYC.
To this very day much of the prairie has never really recovered and the farming towns in SE Colorado are semi-ghost towns. It's eerie to go visit these places with their boarded up main streets scoured by the winds. Sic transit gloria mundi I guess.
As you probably know, temperatures on the American plains were abnormally high in the 30's and helped create a situation where the now bare topsoil blew away in the wind and actually ended up being deposited on the East Coast in cities like DC and NYC.
Indeed, a portion of the Dust Bowl heat wave split off and broke east, giving NYC its record high of 106°F on July 9, 1936 and NYS at Troy, NY on the same day of 108°. Most Northeast heat records were actually set that day.
The dominant species of tree on the prairie is the cottonwood which generally grows along the banks of streams and other places that have a high water table like seeps and springs. The eastern half of Colorado was once shortgrass prairie. The two most dominant grasses in the shortgrass prairie are blue grama (Bouteloua gracilis) and buffalograss (Bouteloua dactyloides). When the sodbusters arrived they devastated the prairie ecosystem and were rewarded with the dust bowl for their efforts. As you probably know, temperatures on the American plains were abnormally high in the 30's and helped create a situation where the now bare topsoil blew away in the wind and actually ended up being deposited on the East Coast in cities like DC and NYC.
To this very day much of the prairie has never really recovered and the farming towns in SE Colorado are semi-ghost towns. It's eerie to go visit these places with their boarded up main streets scoured by the winds. Sic transit gloria mundi I guess.
.................... and in that dust bowl and the Great Depression, which produced some of the highest recorded temps in the US, atmospheric CO2 levels fell due to reduced economic activity. That region will take another "hit" in the future, as they are draining the Ogalala aquafer. When that water is depleted, sustained agriculture will be very difficult to maintain. Too heavy reliance on irrigation can have terrible consequences- as the Soviets about that.
The Great Depression was the greatest "experiment" the world has seen regarding CO2 production and temperature changes. Despite a three year duration of CO2 in the atmosphere, the reduced CO2 levels had no impact whatsoever in reducing temperatures.
I wonder why anyone would think that such measures would work today, when there is no way, in the absence of another economic catastrophe, that man-made CO2 levels will fall as much as they did in the Great Depression. The result- increased temps.
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